Dealing with the pigheaded

[ferretchen]

"Also given Steve's accomplishments and position, When he talks you should listen, period... If what he said offended you, you should talk with him. Maybe you will be the one to come away with more wisdom."

Absolutely - I found the article valuable, it didn't offend me, and the author and his article have a thing or 200 to teach me... it just touched a nerve because I've encountered so many alpha @$$holes in diving instruction, which is generally shallow. I don't think the author is one of those. And I do agree that a pigheaded attitude is bad for safety; I don't want to dive with those people either.

What I'm trying to get at is the idea that attitude problems can best be corrected by absolute rejection of the individual with the attitude. Inclusion might "save" a few such people, and make them better divers. At least we should make the effort before being so absolute. It is possible for people to make foolish mistakes and learn from them, if the mistakes are made above the water... And the absolutism that prevails in diving education is harmful to the transmission of a thoughtful attitude about diving in general, even amongst the humble divers.

That said, some people just never learn, I accept this.

Perhaps it's an error to use this particular author as an example. However, this is a huge problem in the dive industry - "My way, or the highway." No reasoning, no explanation, no spirit of exploration - just boot camp. The R. Lee Ermy Geico commercial is priceless.

I've been disappointed in dive education most of the time - it doesn't appeal to the person who really wants to learn and understand, but is equivalent to a driver's ed class. Where can a diver go for some real quality, thoughtful education? Of course there are lots of books out there - I've been doing my homework -but I'd love an opportunity to get really "edumacated" with some weight behind it, and see that ethic more widely accepted.

My friends in Germany tell me that a driver's license is harder to get there, that it takes longer, involves textbooks, and is more expensive and time-consuming; as a result, driving is safer there. I'd like diving to become more like that. As a commercial enterprise with little or no legal regulation, there is little incentive for this.

Meanwhile, despite the development of DIR and DAN research, conversations about diving continue to be dominated by "riders" like "although insufficient data exists..." and "nobody can prove the safety of activity X..." and so forth.

So authoritative statements in diving are often backed up by the assertion of personal authority or "standard wisdom" about which there is no real conversation because... well, there's often no clue about the "right" answer.

I know I'm probably preaching to the converted, and that many are trying to address these problems.

 

[Kevin Carlisle]

Ahh ha. I see a point in what you are trying to say. There are many instructors ( especially in recreational areas ) that have humongous overinflated egos. Don't use them, if trying to get into the Tec area of diving interview instructors. Make them earn your business and find one that fits you. There are egos there too, but remember they have to sleep at night after they give you a certification that may kill you if you approach it wrong. There will always be those who are arrogant and stubborn, such is life. I remember being told to attempt dives where there is certain risk you can't eliminate ( as in cave diving ) it takes a little ego to do it. Bottom line, there are good and bad instructors and well as students. In the technical classes I took, I had the opportunity to take away as much knowledge as I wanted. To this day I still consider myself a student of the diving world. If you want hard core uniform standards, maybe you should look towards GUE classes.

 

[Suian]

I been observing and aiding in lots of OW courses lately, there have been many instructors that insist that every skill they teach is done there way. You don't want to confuse OW students so this works a lot of the time, however the "better" instructors in my opinion let the students experiment with the skills and make up there own variations.
As a DMT I have also been subjected to these same one-opinionated people. Many of them just got into a routine with it, so doing it wrongly is their OCD complex being triggered. Some, just like bossing people around.
I have learnt to either avoid the bossy instructors or work with them as little as possible and try to do courses with those that are more suitable to my style of work/learning.

 

[DevonDiver]

I been observing and aiding in lots of OW courses lately, there have been many instructors that insist that every skill they teach is done there way.

...and you are there to learn from them. It is their course...and the students are their responsibility. You are a guest observer on their course. As a DMT, you are there to study and absorb, not as a consultant.

When I was a DMT, I was glad to assist many different instructors teaching a variety of courses. It gave me experience of a wide spread of approaches to the same goal. Some were better, some were worse. Some I agreed with, others I didn't. However, they all achieved their goals and met with agency standards. I learned as much from the bad ones ("how not to do it") as the good ones.

You don't want to confuse OW students so this works a lot of the time, however the "better" instructors in my opinion let the students experiment with the skills and make up there own variations.

I don't agree that students should "make up" anything. However, a good instructor should understand that different students will find different approaches easier. He should be able to offer several different approaches to a solution and work with the student to tailor that approach so that it works perfectly.

As a DMT I have also been subjected to these same one-opinionated people.

This debate really is focused on technical diving - where standardisation is a primary concern. Whether that standardisation needs to be just team focused or agency wide (i.e. GUE) is an interesting debate.

The issue of standardisation (one-opinion) is more critical in tech diving because a team is much more inter-dependant. However, that can also lead to inflexibility when one or more opinions collide. It doesn't make either opinion incorrect, but any 'viewer' of such a debate has to understand that the divers concerned will have valid reasons for their opinions and to them the need for standardisation of any given aspect is based on experience.

The main problems arise when inexperienced tech divers are introduced to a single approach and then seek to establish this as the only way... without understanding the validity and differences in other approaches. This becomes an second-hand opinion without the basis of direct experience. Tunnel vision can persist.

Many of them just got into a routine with it, so doing it wrongly is their OCD complex being triggered.

OCD isn't a bad thing in scuba diving...and can be a positively good trait in a technical diver.

Even for a recreational instructor.... having taught hundreds of students, it is fair that they establish their own method for teaching a course (within standards). As a DM trainee, you don't yet have access to the cumulative teaching experience of those instructors...and that means you might be left guessing why an instructor is insistent on doing something a particular way.

It is fair for you to keep an open mind and decide how you might want to do things should you ever be an instructor yourself. BUT... until you are an experienced instructor, you won't know for sure how you would teach.

Like with sports, and many other things, it is easy to sit at the sidelines and criticise the people doing it....

Some, just like bossing people around.

Again... when you actually have responsibility for divers or students, you will understand the responsibility that comes with it. It is the instructor's perogative to run the course to their own satisfaction.

If you are doing a DM Internship, then you are there to assist the instructors. They are working...and taking responsibility... you are there to learn. If they demonstrate strong leadership of their courses, then you should try to respect that for what it is.

You are training in the scuba industry. The instructor concerned is working in that industry. If you are assisting them, then that means they are the boss. Bosses can be bossy.

I have learnt to either avoid the bossy instructors or work with them as little as possible and try to do courses with those that are more suitable to my style of work/learning.

Do you have any intention of working as a DM once you qualify? I think it may be a shock to you. DM is a professional rating. You would be working for salary. You would be sacked for not doing what you are asked/told. Better get used to the idea of 'sucking it up and getting on with it'...regardless of your bosses' approach... or you could find your scuba career is particularly unsuccessful and short lived.

Not criticism... just a reality-check.

 

[Suian]

I do understand and realise that if an instructor is teaching a course, it is their course. I shut my mouth and let them teach it, I don't argue over their methods, when the timing is right I'll ask them why this method over another method - understanding builds insight. I also know that every instructor has different ways of teaching different skill sets.

The main difference between the better instructors and the worse instructors wasn't just their style, it also amounted to their level of organisation, knowledge of related topics and people skills they had.
The "best" instructor I have been on a course with was very well organised: she had the day and skills planned out, while her knowledge base wasn't massive (she had little knowledge of tech diving), this instructor was able to handle students of any age, skill group and anxiety level with a warm comfort and rest assuring smile. As she was a part time instructor, he full time job was in the field of doing HR/PR so a lot of these skills were every day for her.

I have seen a pigheaded instructor in action; all ego, not much in people skills; below average organisation and they also thought they knew everything there is about diving. Yes they knew the skills, yes they could "teach" however I don't think the students had as much fun as they were hoping (and IMO, teaching scuba should always be fun). I didn't like the instructor or his style of teaching, so when I get the option of sitting in on courses I try to avoid him.

How skills are taught has varied differently. I had an instructor that taught selected skills using "discovery". He just asked his students to try to do something - such as remove/out on their scuba unit in the pool without explaining it. When I saw this, I was initially shocked but this guy had it sorted. After all the students had had a go, he proceeded to teach them the skill, while scuba unit removal is a simple skill (and also important), it allowed them to get the hang of skills like that very quickly.

OCD is generally not a bad thing; it helps people keep a routine and stay thorough when doing tasks. However it is an issue when you notice someone getting a little upset or distressed over someone breaking their routine.

I will admit I have 0 experience with tech diving. I know enough that it requires more planning and understanding then recreational. It also requires more detailed skill sets.

What I plan on doing with my DCS is up to me. I may go on to instructor when I have rocked up more experience working (I am partly doing this so I can run dives at a local dive club) as a professional (yes that will probably mean A LOT of work), for now I an simply doing my best to understand the local industry and earn my DCS not just expect a fancy card because I paid for the course.

 

[waterpirate]

If you find someones ego offensive, do not give them your money? If you move on to tech lite or full on tech you will find that you need to shop your instructor. This includes someone you feel will teach you and that you trust. Entry level tech starts at 650.00 and up depending, it is crucial that you learn and have respect for your tech instructor or it is a failed training experiance. whether or not it is as critical below adv/deco is debateable but it is still your money and time.
I like to apply the beer standard, go drinking with your prospective teacher and he and you will quickly find out whether you two are compatible. The instructor may decline you as a student, it is a two way drinking game. As a rule my life is two short to drink with "jack wagons" or give them my money or associate with them in any capacity.
Eric