Do I Need AOW to Travel?

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Divers with an open water certification are certified to dive within the recreational dive limits of 130 FSW (40 Meters).

18m/60ft = Newly certified OW Divers
30m/100ft = General recommended limit for recreational divers
40m/130ft = Absolute limit for recreational divers with further (deep) training and experience

So a requirement of AOW is a bit zealous for an operation, but some do it.

I think most of us experienced divers will agree that AOW means little, in relation to personal limits. It shouldn't be a necessity for diving below 18m/60ft, but neither should it be viewed as empowering a 'right' to go beyond that depth.

Far too many dive operations 'sell' the AOW course on the basis that it 'entitles' divers to go to 30m/100ft. Having made that spurious and misleading claim, they then have to back up their sales-pitch with an 'ethical' business policy to restrict divers at given depths.

Certification cards are not licenses.

Training should not be sought on the basis of the card you receive, but rather for the skills, knowledge and capability you will gain.

Of course, for a scuba diver walking through the doors of an unknown dive center, proving your skills, knowledge and capability over the counter can be a hard thing....
 
Certification cards are not licenses.

Training should not be sought on the basis of the card you receive, but rather for the skills, knowledge and capability you will gain.

This is exactly right and goes hand in hand with my comment. Advanced training does have benefits, no doubt, but nothing replaces experience. The depths you listed have a certain validity, but only insofar as making a point IMO. Basic OW does not certify you to a particular depth, save the depth of what is considered "recreational limits". When you are in a class, your instructor can and should enforce depth limits, but once you are certified to dive, it is all in the realm of your judgement and what you are comfortable with. Hopefully your training plays into this, and if you have a little sense, your judgement certainly will. That said, when a dive shop or dive professional is leading a dive, he does have the right to place restrictions on it. He doesn't really have the right or the ability to enforce it, but certainly, placing the restriction in the first place limits his liability exposure.
 
Yes and Yes.
IMHO

The reason that AOW is often required is because the dive op knows that you have made a "deep" dive, which should help ensure the diver has had been exposed and comprehends, Recommended "Emergency Decompression" procedures. However, I believe that if you coordinate your experience level with the DIve op during your pre-booking stage you can avoid any aggravation. As Devon Diver mentioned there is no Universal PADI rule which dictates the requirement for AOW to make deep dives. However, many operators that I am familiar with use AOW as a minimum qualifier to make certain dives...


AOW has been around for a long time, I got mine in 1978(old :).

Cheers,
Roger
 
Training should not be sought on the basis of the card you receive, but rather for the skills, knowledge and capability you will gain.

Of course, for a scuba diver walking through the doors of an unknown dive center, proving your skills, knowledge and capability over the counter can be a hard thing....

I think DevonDiver has nailed it. I could not care less about what gold-colored, laminated cards divers have in their wallets or purses while they are out getting wet (or sometimes staying dry :crafty:) and about to enter an environment that requires attention, training, and some skill to survive. What is worth more to you, the bragging rights or experiencing the wonderful marine environment safely and responsibly so you can share it with your kids and families afterwards?

The fact of the matter is that log books, while useful in some cases, do not, and can not, absolutely vouch for a diver's skill and ability; nor can a cert card. I have seen divemasters and personally know instructors with 100's of dives that are nightmares IMHO. Then I also know OW and AOW divers that are fantastic divers and that have more control and skill than many other divers I have encountered. My point is that real skills are practiced habits that have become second nature to a diver. If those skills were taught incorrectly or not reinforced enough and left unrefined during the training those bad habits will most likely haunt a diver's diving career forever without them often realizing they need some improvement. After all, they got the T-shirt, bought the postcards, did the pool sessions and completed the open water cert dives. Everyone is a master diver after that right? Or so you would believe if you listened to some divers who got the card this morning and are having a couple of beers at the bar in the afternoon.

I don't blame the guy behind the counter at the dive operator who has policy instructions from his boss to attempt to dissuade suspected newer divers, who often turn out to be OW only; i.e. not AOW certified, from doing more rigorous dives. Deeper is not always more dangerous but it does add an extra environmental factor that requires more honed basic skills at shallower depths first. So how do you realistically assess a diver's ability when he hands his OW C-card to you and says I've done 100's of dives? The answer is you can't, it's a crap shoot. Most people who have done more than 50 dives or so are usually AOW certified, partly because of the continuing education crap so many dive shops spout ad nauseum because they want the $$$, but also because it is a natural evolution for divers to explore greater limits to their newfound passion and training is a good way of doing this. It would be interesting to see the stats but I would not be surprised if those who never got AOW certified but that are still competent divers, while I am certain they exist, are in the minority.

So, for liability sake I understand why dive ops often seem to have what may seem to be the rigid rules engraved in stone about depth and correlating cert levels. In our litigious society today I would also probably err on the side of caution, and while I would not remain totally inflexible because the sign on the wall says "No AOW? No Deep 60!", I would likely try to explain the situation and encourage an OW to do a shallower dive first so a DM can check him or her out (skill wise of course) in real water first before doing deeper dives. If he is obviously a cousin of Triton, then allow him or her to decide what to do; perhaps have him sign a waiver, pair him up with a Rescue Diver buddy, ask the DM to keep a good eye on him and let him do dive 2 and 3 past the glass bottom barrier at 60'. If he is an obvious jack-in-the-box who is bouncing out of the water because he overloaded on weights and overinflated his BC to compensate, then perhaps he doesn't qualify to the deep side of the pool just yet. While you likely may have a cranky customer on your hands for refusing, and while you may likely lose his business, you at least steer clear of the lawsuits that could cost you your business because Chuckie decided to embolize on his way up after panicking at 90' after his buddies dared him to do a deeper dive over the beers they had yesterday afternoon at the bar.
Like Captain Barbosa would have said "the code is more what you would call guidelines than actual rules". :coffee:
 
Simple answer: You can either contact the dive op and see if AOW is required for dives below 60' and decide to go there based on that. Or, you can just get AOW and know that you can go on pretty much any dive charter. Of course keeping a log book that shows your last dive wasn't a year ago would also be wise, though nobody has ever asked me for that.
 
AOW is a requirement in FL by many dive Ops to dive the deeper wrecks in the keys. You can argue with them but many dive Ops have this rule and it is pointless discussing it. My Cuz has been diving since the 70's and they would not book her on the deep dives until she showed up with the AOW or better cert. You can hire a guide and maybe get a pass after that, not sure. So if you diving in the Keys and want to dive the deeper wrecks be forewarned.

I had no idea that any place other than FL was doing this as it is kinda BS IMO.
 
Advanced training does have benefits, no doubt, but nothing replaces experience.

I agree, but with a caveat. IMHO, training is the foundation of beneficial experience.

As the saying goes: "Practice does not make perfect. Only perfect practice makes perfect". Vince Lombardi

Experience alone is inconsistent - it is dictated by the whims of the individual and what they encounter. It is equally prone to negative development as it is to positive. Training provides a 'road map' or 'aiming point' for the realization of personal improvement from experience.

...and yes, I accept that training need not be a 'formal certification class'. It is the input, guidance and mentoring from the experienced to the inexperienced - whether paid for, or freely given.
 
I think a quote from WWII fighter Ace, Group Captain Sir Douglas Bader is pertinent here.

"Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men"

Personally, If I was running the Dive Op, I'd want to see an AOW card (or equivalent) or have the diver in question do a check dive.
As for log books, give me an hour and I'll create one that would make JYC look like a novice.
I wouldn't trust one.
 
AOW is a requirement in FL by many dive Ops to dive the deeper wrecks in the keys. You can argue with them but many dive Ops have this rule and it is pointless discussing it. My Cuz has been diving since the 70's and they would not book her on the deep dives until she showed up with the AOW or better cert. You can hire a guide and maybe get a pass after that, not sure. So if you diving in the Keys and want to dive the deeper wrecks be forewarned.

I had no idea that any place other than FL was doing this as it is kinda BS IMO.

AOW OR a log book to prove sufficient experience is acceptable. When I was a new diver, I brought my log book to the Keys. It worked fine.
 
Maybe I don't understand well, but in the video, it said: "40m is the absolute maximum depth for recreational divers, who have the experience AND TRAINING required." (for my level of comprehension, meaning with the "Deep dive specialty").

At the beginning of the video, it also says: "Limit your depth to your experience AND TRAINING."

In the standards, it is said for Open Water dives 1 and 2: 12m max. For Open Water dives 3 and 4: 18m max.
If I refer to "limit your depth to your experience AND TRAINING" an open water diver is not trained to go deeper than 18m...

In the Maldives, it is also the rule... http://www.agoffice.gov.mv/pdf/subrege/Diving.pdf (Chap.2 section 3)
"(4) Entry level Divers may dive to a depth of 20 meters or within the limits as set forth by standards of their certification agency, but not exceeding 20 meters.(5)Not until entry‐level divers have received training in Deep Diving techniques may they go deeper than 20 meters."

So yes, you will find some other places (Dive Centres or Liveboard) that require you to be at least AOW diver to go deeper than 18m...

When I agree that Advanced Open Water can mean very little, Open Water Diver can mean also very little.
Experience is, it's true, one the most important thing.
But, again, if I ear the standards correctly, "limit your depth to your experience AND TRAINING" ... what is the result of a training if not a certification?

Usually, an Advanced Open Water course is pretty fun to do, and can be done in an interesting way.
Advanced and Nitrox certifications usually open a few door regarding depth and dive sites.


Fact of the matter is, you can have a great vacation above 60'.
But AOW will open more opportunities for you.
 
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