Gear clones - like generic drugs?

[siikik]

While this is true. Several companies have ownership of their designs. While Manufacturer "X" may not make the regulator in the US. They have a company make it for them to their specifications. So for all intents and purposes - it is theirs.

As opposed to a China company that makes Regulator "Y" and puts a label on it that says, "ScubaBoard" and we go and sell that regulator as the "ScubaBoard Reg 3000" The regulator for the next millennium.

I want a "ScubaBoard Reg 3000."



Ken

 

[HowardE]

I want a "ScubaBoard Reg 3000."



Ken

Send CASH or Money order to me, and then wait by the mailbox 4-6 weeks for delivery.

 

[The Chairman]

Like I said, they have their place, but people need to get the erroneous thought out of their head that they are "exactly the same" as the brand, because they are not.

Sorry, but in ScubaDiving, its often the case that similar products are made by the same OEM manufacturer and to the same specifications. There was a snorkel test a few years ago where an advertiser's product was given a plus rating while the same OEM snorkel was rated as far less than satisfactory.

 

[widget]

I'm thinking that there is some money to be saved here by buying these off-brands,

Sure, especially in the scuba "softs" (things like masks, fins, snorkels, wetsuits, dive boots etc) these are by and large fit specific products, and, if they fit you well, do the job and are comfortable, then, unless you particularly want a brand name, the logo is not really that important.

As folk have said many scuba lines are mass produced in Asia and simply branded, this has a lot to do with economies of scale and its very common (especially if you look closely) to see the same line cataloged by a number of "brands",...... although as someone else pointed out, this is certainly not particular to only Scuba.

 

[ba_hiker]

While this is true. Several companies have ownership of their designs. While Manufacturer "X" may not make the regulator in the US. They have a company make it for them to their specifications. So for all intents and purposes - it is theirs.

As opposed to a China company that makes Regulator "Y" and puts a label on it that says, "ScubaBoard" and we go and sell that regulator as the "ScubaBoard Reg 3000" The regulator for the next millennium.

yes I am aware of that, but thanks for clearing up any confusion that others
may have had.

Still I am interested in how many companies actually make this stuff.
While companies may own the designs for their regulators, there are many manufacturing specific issues that can come up..

 

[RJP]

Sorry, but in ScubaDiving...

I know.

I was still on my "off-topic generic drug" rant.

 

[fnfalman]

Same thing with computers. There are but a handful of companies making dive computers. Others buy these computers and put their brands on.

 

[mdb]

RJP:

You can go on your rants. No problem. You know your markets. You, obviously, know a lot about the generic drug market.

As Pete mentioned, and you acknowledged, the SCUBA gear market is a bit different. Several offshore OEM's are manufacturing products that are sold under different brand names at widely different pricing.

Boots, gloves, wetsuits, snorkels, masks, regulators, BC's, dive bags, and more, are often made in the same place identical in all ways, except for the Logo-and the retail price.

 

[redacted]

Somewhat offtopic, but apropos nonetheless:

Just so you know - generic drugs are not necessarily EXACTLY the same as the brand name product. There is a misperception that the FDA regulates them such they must be "exactly the same" but in truth a generic drug is allowed a +/- 20% leeway in terms of being equivalent to the brand.

So if your MD prescribed you 100mg of Brand X, but you opt for the generic, you could be getting anywhere from 80mg to 120mg of what your doctor prescribed. And that can vary from one prescription to the next. Maybe 80mg isnt enough to treat you effectively so your doc bumps you from (in his mind) 100 - 120mg. Now you take your Rx for 120mg of Brand X to the pharmacy and get a generic instead. Only this time it's PLUS 20% so you really got 144mg and now you have terrible side effects. The doc think "I only bumped his dose 20%" (100 to 120mg) but in reallity your dose was increased ~60% (from 80mg to 144mg) so really neither you, you pharmacist, or doctor have any idea what dose you were ACTUALLY taking.

Same thing with "generic" scuba gear. It may look the same, you may be told it IS the same, and may be intended to serve the same purpose, but it might not ACTUALLY be the same.

Like with generic drugs, they have their place and can save significant money, but it is incumbent upon the consumer to know what you ARE and ARE NOT getting when you go that route.

This seems to contradict: Generic Drugs: What You Need to Know

 

[widget]

Still I am interested in how many companies actually make this stuff.
While companies may own the designs for their regulators, there are many manufacturing specific issues that can come up..

Regulators are not really high tech and theres quite a few companies making first stage casings in Europe, Asia, and the USA. Tooling up to produce a regulator body is well within the scope of most competant engineering operators, but, because the economies of scale are so small, only a few do it.

Its also quite common for a "brand" to have a cosmetically differant reg body externally, but internally the parts are identical to, and shared by other companies, again, economies of scale, and to keep costs down, many internal parts are identical between various brands. So often, its a situation of making a reg body "cosmetically around" the parts you have access to, and trust to deliver good performance.

Second stages bodies are just injection moulded items and these can be done anywhere the price is right, usually its cheapest in Asia, but, Italy has a very well respected injection moulding industry at competitive prices and many brands have their injection moulding done here, internally, again, many parts are shared.

Neoprene however, is very differant, this market is heavily dominated by Sheico, probably supplying more than 60% of the neoprene used in wetsuits and neoprene products world wide, irrespective of where its cut and stitched Sheico is by far and away the biggest player in this market.
They are also probably the biggest manufacturer of OEM wetsuits as well, and their cut and stitch factories make massive volumes of wetsuits for most of the big brands worldwide in Surfing, Scuba, Fishing,Boating etc.