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Got my OW cert, but SOB!

Discussion in 'New Divers and Those Considering Diving' started by maniago, Aug 26, 2012.

  1. tracydr

    tracydr Divemaster

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: North Carolina, 3 miles from South Carolina
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    I'm just now starting to help with classes as a DMC so I'm far, far from an expert but I've thought about this a lot as I've also been making changes to my own gear recently to prepare for technical diving myself.
    My plan is to use a regular ( ie what we see in the PADI pictures) configuration for the confined water classes so that I can do the demonstrations to students with the same configuration that they have with their rental gear. When we go to open water, I will have my bungeed secondary and long hose primary and show them how that works, so they will get and example of this as well.
    This will of course be somewhat instructor dependent. Personally, I think that as common as this configuration is becoming, students should be at least familiarized with it so that they have somthing to base their own decisions off of when planning their own purchases of new gear.
     
  2. boulderjohn

    boulderjohn Technical Instructor ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Boulder, CO
    26,388
    18,636
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    That's pretty much what I do. When I am in the classroom, I describe all the options a diver may encounter, explain the pros and cons of each, and I show them the equipment. In the pool, we use the standard equipment they are most likely to rent on a dive trip before they buy their own. In the OW, I use the long hose and bungied alternate and show them how it works.

    A couple of years ago, there was a thread in the Instructor to Instructor forum in which someone wrote that he had been told by another instructor that using the long hose in PADI OW classes was a standards violation. Not believing it, I wrote to PADI. I was told in reply that PADI had no requirement for any specific setup at all. They also said that showing students all the possible options as I do is good practice.
     
    DukeAMO likes this.
  3. Quero

    Quero Will be missed Rest in Peace ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: I just don't log dives
    Location: Phuket, Thailand
    9,494
    2,246
    0
    This is a great way to encapsulate the key aspects of being a donor!
     
    DukeAMO likes this.
  4. TSandM

    TSandM Missed and loved by many. Rest in Peace ScubaBoard Supporter

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    Rob (Diver0001) has been one of my favorite SB posters for the last 7 years . . . he has a fantastic way of breaking things down and making them logical. His thread on managing task loading is one of my all-time favorites.
     
  5. Quero

    Quero Will be missed Rest in Peace ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: I just don't log dives
    Location: Phuket, Thailand
    9,494
    2,246
    0
  6. Diver0001

    Diver0001 Instructor, Scuba

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  7. maniago

    maniago PADI Pro

    # of Dives: I just don't log dives
    Location: Mid-Atlantic (MD)
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    Thank you for all your comments Colliam7 (I didn't quote it all for simplicity sake). This is exactly what I need to hear - calm, collected, intelligent, thought provoking - you get my drift :). Ahhh though, please, I'm not dissing anyone else who has posted - all are good and enlightening. I just thought that these comments were a great encapsulation of what's been bantered around, and wanted to acknowledge the effort to post.

    That said, the best way not to lose a regulator is to....have a hole drilled in your head like the dolphins! haha :)
    I'll re double my efforts to practice sweeping, tracing, and modifying my gear to be more fool proof. All three should make a future similar situation, for me I hope, a simple minor inconvenience vice a CESA. Cheers!
     
  8. MADiveGirl

    MADiveGirl Angel Fish

    # of Dives: 25 - 49
    Location: Boston, Massachusetts, United States
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    We do this often to practice skills. Yeah, you need to be close, but I didn't find it uncomfortable.... In fact, in OW class we were taught to grab each other's BC's with our right hand, on their right shoulder. So you are supposed to be close.

    ---------- Post Merged at 03:07 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 02:47 PM ----------

    The way I see it is that the problem fundamentally was that his alternate secondary wasn't attached properly - not where it was supposed to be attached, or the length of his hose. If you don't attach your bungee'd second stage (or attach sloppily and it falls out, or the necklace breaks mid-dive, etc.) you are in the EXACT same boat, so your scenario above isn't a fair comparison. Of COURSE finding your alternate air source will be easier when it's where it's supposed to be. If his had been attached to his BC like it should have been, he would have been fine. Necklace, nifty little holder thing on a shoulder D-ring, etc. Doesn't really matter, does it? As long as it's put there and checked that it's secure.

    Isn't the real lesson here to make sure BOTH of your second stages are where they are supposed to be, and secured properly? Long hose, necklace, standard config.... Different discussion, no?

    I'm not arguing the benefits for or against a long hose set up, just thinking out loud a little about the actual problem stated by the OP....
     
  9. boulderjohn

    boulderjohn Technical Instructor ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Boulder, CO
    26,388
    18,636
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    The problem is that the traditional alternate air source is designed to come off easily. That's the way it works. Because it is designed to come off easily, it does exactly that: come off easily. Back when I used one, it would come off almost every time I did a giant stride entry, even though I tried a number of different holders. I would often notice it had come off during a dive. When I work with students and we do the alternate air skill in the OW dives, I have learned to make sure the alternate is in place before we do the skills because it has so often been unattached in the past. Watch any group of OW divers and see how many octos are dangling.

    In contrast, the bungied alternate is designed to stay attached, not to come off easily. I have never had one come off accidentally. I have never seen one come off a diving companion.

    In short, an octo falling off and not being in the right place is a very common failure of the system. The bungied alternate coming off and not being in the right place is a rare event. You can't say that the two are equally reliable because they both can fall out of place.
     
  10. MADiveGirl

    MADiveGirl Angel Fish

    # of Dives: 25 - 49
    Location: Boston, Massachusetts, United States
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    Ah, ok, then that does make total sense. I guess I've simply yet to have that happen to me, although I have seen dangling octos for sure. I thought the divers were just being lazy and not bothering to attach them in the first place (they weren't in my dive groups).
     

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