halocline
Contributor
Here we freakin go again......
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OP
redacted
Guest
And OSHA still uses the 40% standard. The real issue is that there have not been any incidents using the 40% standard and there are still plenty of dive shops (with banked nirtox) following that standard. Funny how the shops pushing the 23.5% standard all seem to be PP blenders. Is it safety or is it economics?
BTW, is G-4.1 referenced as mandatory in any of the Federal regulations? I did not find it in the link you provided.
Also, where does a dive shop fit into this?
§ 171.1 Applicability of Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR) to persons and functions.
Federal hazardous materials transportation law (49 U.S.C. 5101 et seq. ) directs the Secretary of Transportation to establish regulations for the safe and secure transportation of hazardous materials in commerce, as the Secretary considers appropriate. The Secretary is authorized to apply these regulations to persons who transport hazardous materials in commerce. In addition, the law authorizes the Secretary to apply these regulations to persons who cause hazardous materials to be transported in commerce. The law also authorizes the Secretary to apply these regulations to persons who manufacture or maintain a packaging or a component of a packaging that is represented, marked, certified, or sold as qualified for use in the transportation of a hazardous material in commerce. Federal hazardous material transportation law also applies to anyone who indicates by marking or other means that a hazardous material being transported in commerce is present in a package or transport conveyance when it is not, and to anyone who tampers with a package or transport conveyance used to transport hazardous materials in commerce or a required marking, label, placard, or shipping description. Regulations prescribed in accordance with Federal hazardous materials transportation law shall govern safety aspects, including security, of the transportation of hazardous materials that the Secretary considers appropriate. In 49 CFR 1.53, the Secretary delegated authority to issue regulations for the safe and secure transportation of hazardous materials in commerce to the Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administrator. The Administrator issues the Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR; 49 CFR Parts 171 through 180) under that delegated authority. This section addresses the applicability of the HMR to packagings represented as qualified for use in the transportation of hazardous materials in commerce and to pre-transportation and transportation functions.
Told ya it was debatable 
Scared Silly
Contributor
Yeah no shiit. Like wresting a pig.
If ya really want to know write DOT/OSHA and get a freakin interpretation/ruling.
OP
redacted
Guest
Do you think if DOT/OSHA proclaims it does not apply to an LDS and its sport diving customers, that the shop will stop insisting on the $20 per year inspection they charge me for my tank? I doubt it.
Scared Silly
Contributor
Can anyone tell me if its necessary to clean a Nx cylinder after a hydro if it was clean up to then. I have 2 60% Nx sling cylinders and when I got them hydro'd yearly per aust rules they re-cleaned them. Is there a reason why this must be done due to how they hydro them or is it more a money making exercise
jIM STEELE
Contributor
All bull was started by NASDS just after 1960 when they copyrighted VIP and showed the poster of that old car
---------- Post added March 17th, 2013 at 09:17 PM ----------
I have been filling tanks for over 50 years I follow the DOT I dont need make up my Owen rules or Jim's rules
---------- Post added March 17th, 2013 at 09:17 PM ----------
I have been filling tanks for over 50 years I follow the DOT I dont need make up my Owen rules or Jim's rules
..... but that's just to give the tank filler a clue..........
The tank primates on your female sibling's boat definitely need to get a clue. "The tank says 3442, but the valve is marked in bar‽"
Let's see now, I caught a green string of beads with a shamrock at the St. Patrick's Day parade today. I wonder if.....
In my psi course as explained... The anual requirement for a vis was for tanks that have up to 2 fills per week. So by that the vis is due every 100 fills give or take. It said that when fills are more often then a more frequent vis schedule is required. for tanks that are used daily up to 2 fils per day the vis was quarterly. I dont know what the source of this is but i accepted it as gosple because of stress fratcuring of al tanks. Whether that applied to st tanks i dont know. i never persued the matter as i have st tanks.
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So, why do I have to get an annual VIS?
Because of contamination of tanks from bad air including rust oil adn other undesireables in the tank. It could be an ins liability requirement, like no card no air
Why do I have to pay for 2 inspections in the course of a tank requalification?
The requalification date is also the vis date for the tank. Most do not accept this as the tank monkeys have been given a one rule fits all and that rule is the vis sticker less than 1 yr old. A vis includes the valve adn many do not send the valves to the hydro shop for many reasons.
Why does a VIS expire at the beginning of the indicated month?
The vis sticker is valid for UP TO one year. If the vis was done on say july 1 then it would be void the next july 1. as no date is on the sticker worst case dictates to treat them as done on the 1th of the month.
What qualifications are required of a hydro inspector?
cant comment on that one.
What qualifications are required of a shop visual inspector?
Ther are no black and white legal requirentnts per se for vis inspectors however the fed laws say they will be done iaw recommendations by cga dot and any other recognized authority. In short the feds passed the buck to non law making agencies to write thier recommendations. Most likely the Proceedures will say that inspections will be done by someone trained to properly conduct the inspection. Now ther are other aspects to the vis such the handling of hasmet. Compressed air is hasmat by definition. So surely the ins co's are there somewhere.
Standards for inspection are contained in cga standards i think. for al tanks there is a section for them..... steel tanks have thier own section ....fiber tanks have thier own. You dont just pick these up either they may be 200$ for each section. Insurance co's is another influence on shops. And of course they pass the buck to the feds which has passed the batton to cga.
Ihave the applicable sections listed in documentation at home but suffice to say they do exist. The conflict exists when discussing commercial or non comercial activities. Too many threads on this exist.
Now for example dot will say that no cylendar may be filled for transportation that has fallen out of qualiification or visual inspection periodicy. Itis allowed to be transported so long as it was filled prior to qualilfication expiration. i dont know the exact verbage but the contention is in the words transportation. Dot does not cover you but does any dot qualified vehical. And that is even debatable to some as whether it includes you.
Any documented references?
I am sure a lot of specific references will becoming out of teh trees on this. I will list some when i get home adn look up the numbers.
-----
So, why do I have to get an annual VIS?
Because of contamination of tanks from bad air including rust oil adn other undesireables in the tank. It could be an ins liability requirement, like no card no air
Why do I have to pay for 2 inspections in the course of a tank requalification?
The requalification date is also the vis date for the tank. Most do not accept this as the tank monkeys have been given a one rule fits all and that rule is the vis sticker less than 1 yr old. A vis includes the valve adn many do not send the valves to the hydro shop for many reasons.
Why does a VIS expire at the beginning of the indicated month?
The vis sticker is valid for UP TO one year. If the vis was done on say july 1 then it would be void the next july 1. as no date is on the sticker worst case dictates to treat them as done on the 1th of the month.
What qualifications are required of a hydro inspector?
cant comment on that one.
What qualifications are required of a shop visual inspector?
Ther are no black and white legal requirentnts per se for vis inspectors however the fed laws say they will be done iaw recommendations by cga dot and any other recognized authority. In short the feds passed the buck to non law making agencies to write thier recommendations. Most likely the Proceedures will say that inspections will be done by someone trained to properly conduct the inspection. Now ther are other aspects to the vis such the handling of hasmet. Compressed air is hasmat by definition. So surely the ins co's are there somewhere.
Standards for inspection are contained in cga standards i think. for al tanks there is a section for them..... steel tanks have thier own section ....fiber tanks have thier own. You dont just pick these up either they may be 200$ for each section. Insurance co's is another influence on shops. And of course they pass the buck to the feds which has passed the batton to cga.
Ihave the applicable sections listed in documentation at home but suffice to say they do exist. The conflict exists when discussing commercial or non comercial activities. Too many threads on this exist.
Now for example dot will say that no cylendar may be filled for transportation that has fallen out of qualiification or visual inspection periodicy. Itis allowed to be transported so long as it was filled prior to qualilfication expiration. i dont know the exact verbage but the contention is in the words transportation. Dot does not cover you but does any dot qualified vehical. And that is even debatable to some as whether it includes you.
Any documented references?
I am sure a lot of specific references will becoming out of teh trees on this. I will list some when i get home adn look up the numbers.
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