Innovation in diving

[gianaameri]

BS and we have discussed that within the first couple of pages. Thanks for using my "Scuba 101" term. Scuba is a built upon past training and equipment standards and additional training and equipment is added to the foundation that you learned in OW. Everything you have needed and learned in OW class, except for the snorkel, also applies to more advanced diving.

Now for some advice. When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

Yep, and that is why Tony rents a dive-light from Bill's corner dive store and goes to dive with a rented dive-light in a cave in a team of four and the other three guys go along with it .

Pathetic - and you are preaching me about safety and giving the good example!

Now, could you provide your superior opinion as to what I was supposed to do in this cave that dive that day with a Dive Computer/Bottom Timer to resolve/prevent exactly which emergency?

 

[Omisson]

i feel ya. ive been involved in a few myself. but in this one, NO ONE is making a coherent argument one way or another. But as much as it pains me to say it, Gian's argument (as thin as it may be) is the best one of the lot. Sad/weird/funny. Like Shakespeare, but way worse content.

Not so fast. Since when is "because I said so" a sufficient reason?

Now I'm not disagreeing that the risk was mitigated by familiarity with the system, marginal depth and sufficiency of gas supply.... Also I will concede in the scenario even a scooter failure/and entanglement at max penetration and depth (60 feet deep and 3000 feet back) when EANX 36 is the gas, is unlike to incur deco or at least it is a marginal concern.

However,

How is violating 2 scuba 101 rules (diving without a depth gauge AND without a bottom timer) REGARDLESS of the reason a sufficient argument ?

How is violating a Cave diving 101 rule (diving without a REDUNDANT depth & bottom timer) a sufficient argument?

How is violating a Full Cave imperative (not entering an unexplored section of cave without ALL required redundant cave gear) a sufficient argument?

At least we should acknowledge that while the risk was minimized by Gian's purported familiarity with the system (notwithstanding that he won't ID the cave -as all those commonly known in Mallorca do not fit a 12m deep & 2000m run, - or that no cave the majority of divers here are familiar with include depth information in cave line markers as claimed) it was violative of good scuba and cave diving practices....

AND instead of Gian claiming he did no wrong, should acknowledge that diving without a depth gauge & bottom timer in an overhead environment is not a good idea regardless of how familiar one is with the system.

Complacency is the number one cause of death in technically trained divers. The specific circumstances are merely the symptoms of the problem.

 

[syntaxerrorsix]

Yep, and that is why Tony rents a dive-light from Bill's corner dive store and goes to dive with a rented dive-light in a cave in a team of four and the other three guys go along with it .

Pathetic - and you are preaching me about safety and giving the good example!

Now, could you provide your superior opinion as to what I was supposed to do in this cave that dive that day with a Dive Computer/Bottom Timer to resolve/prevent exactly which emergency?

You weren't supposed to be there. A depth gauge and bottom timer could have told you your depth and bottom time instead of trying to guess what your severely over inflated ego and memory generated for you. You aren't clever enough to even make up a solid story, how are we to believe you are clever enough to monitor your time spent underwater?

 

[gianaameri]

Not so fast. Since when is "because I said so" a sufficient reason?

Now I'm not disagreeing that the risk was mitigated by familiarity with the system, marginal depth and sufficiency of gas supply.... Also I will concede in the scenario even a scooter failure/and entanglement at max penetration and depth (60 feet deep and 3000 feet back) when EANX 36 is the gas, is unlike to incur deco or at least it is a marginal concern.

However,

How is violating 2 scuba 101 rules (diving without a depth gauge AND without a bottom timer) REGARDLESS of the reason a sufficient argument ?

How is violating a Cave diving 101 rule (diving without a REDUNDANT depth & bottom timer) a sufficient argument?

How is violating a Full Cave imperative (not entering an unexplored section of cave without ALL required redundant cave gear) a sufficient argument?

At least we should acknowledge that while the risk was minimized by Gian's purported familiarity with the system (notwithstanding that he won't ID the cave -as all those commonly known in Mallorca do not fit a 12m deep & 2000m run, - or that no cave the majority of divers here are familiar with include depth information in cave line markers as claimed) it was violative of good scuba and cave diving practices....

AND instead of Gian claiming he did no wrong, should acknowledge that diving without a depth gauge & bottom timer in an overhead environment is not a good idea regardless of how familiar one is with the system.

Complacency is the number one cause of death in technically trained divers. The specific circumstances are merely the symptoms of the problem.

You keep on getting the numbers wrong.

N32, 12 meter average depth, 18 meters max. depth, 600 meters max. penetration (and 2 x 18 ltr. Sidemount tanks at 220 bar).

For the rest, yep I did not bring the Dive Computer/Bottom Timer that dive that day because I had forgotten all electronics in the garage and planned and executed and risk assessed that dive that day such that it could be safely carried out (including surfacing in the dry chamber as previously explained) without Dive Computer/Bottom Timer .

In doing so, that dive that day I breached conventions and rules, but it did not add to my risk (as abundantly explained).

---------- Post added February 2nd, 2014 at 04:45 PM ----------

You weren't supposed to be there. A depth gauge and bottom timer could have told you your depth and bottom time instead of trying to guess what your severely over inflated ego and memory generated for you. You aren't clever enough to even make up a solid story, how are we to believe you are clever enough to monitor your time spent underwater?

If I had to guess the depth, I would not have done the dive.

The depth was known as previously explained and so was the run time - this from waypoint to waypoint.

 

[syntaxerrorsix]

You keep on getting the numbers wrong.

N32, 12 meter average depth, 18 meters max. depth, 600 meters max. penetration (and 2 x 18 ltr. Sidemount tanks at 220 bar).

For the rest, yep I did not bring the Dive Computer/Bottom Timer that dive that day because I had forgotten all electronics in the garage and planned and executed and risk assessed that dive that day such that it could be safely carried out (including surfacing in the dry chamber as previously explained) without Dive Computer/Bottom Timer .

In doing so, that dive that day I breached conventions and rules, but it did not add to my risk (as abundantly explained).

---------- Post added February 2nd, 2014 at 04:45 PM ----------



If I had to guess the depth, I would not have done the dive.

The depth was known as previously explained and so was the run time - this from waypoint to waypoint.

The run time was guessed as well. You could only guess. You didn't calculate for battery discharge or speed, you just guessed by setting prop pitch to whatever number you usually run it at.

 

[gianaameri]

The run time was guessed as well. You could only guess. You didn't calculate for battery discharge or speed, you just guessed by setting prop pitch to whatever number you usually run it at.

No, it was the same run in the same cave along the same line attached to the same waypoints - still the same as we speak - with the same scooter at the same setting...

Were you with Tony in the foursome cave dive with a rental dive-light ?

 

[syntaxerrorsix]

No, it was the same run in the same cave along the same line attached to the same waypoints - still the same as we speak - with the same scooter at the same setting...

Were you with Tony in the foursome cave dive with a rental dive-light ?

You, are full of it. You guessed. This isn't experience talking this is bravado in imagination land. You, in my opinion are a hack.

I've got nothing else for you but I will be SURE to interject in any other nonsense you create in the future. Best of luck with your book.

 

[gianaameri]

You, are full of it. You guessed. This isn't experience talking this is bravado in imagination land. You, in my opinion are a hack.

I've got nothing else for you but I will be SURE to interject in any other nonsense you contrive in the future. Best of luck with your book.

You are just a nuisance in a pointless thread, but you and Tony made me have a good laugh tonight!

 

[TONY CHANEY]

Glad to see you having a good laugh considering you have been crying about bulling.

 

[syntaxerrorsix]

Glad to see you having a good laugh considering you have been crying about bulling.

Nothing more than a distraction. Dealing with reality hasn't historically been one of the poster's strong points. Easier to cry foul.