PADI Divemaster without Advanced?

[TMHeimer]

@boulderjohn - absolutely appreciate how the Advanced Open Water came about in that it's absolutely not Advanced... I learned a lot from your excellent and informative posts.

However, the marketing chimps still persist with using that misleading name.

It's a pure personal experience thing. When I started to dive I did the OW and AOW in quick succession. They were easy to do and it got me doing follow-the-leader diving in the Mediterranean. Of course I knew nothing about diving except what I had been taught and told. The issue was those skills were fine in the benign conditions, and pretty worthless in the more challenging northerly climes. As an "Advanced" diver, I felt rather short changed.

You don't know what you don't know. With very little experience, there's a lot you don't know. With a lot more experience all you do know is more about what you don't know.

I did the same thing (or almost the same). Took AOW after my 10th dive (including the 4 for OW). It was obvious that regardless of the word Advanced I knew I wasn't "advanced". I did OW here in NS.
I may disagree about the cold vs. warm things (as I have in the past). Same dives/skills that I did for AOW in North Florida could be done the same exact way in Nova Scotia but with more weight. Of course in either place you're not gunna do them in a storm with huge waves. Weather here in the North can be challenging but also the ocean can be calm as bathtub water.

 

[TravelGas]

Does anyone have an opinion of which cert' has the more difficult requirements to obtain the NAUI MSD or the PADI MSD.

Every diver, who is at least 12 years old, should aim for Master Scuba Diver.
The path starts with earning a PADI Open Water Diver certification, followed by PADI Advanced Open Water Diver and PADI Rescue Diver (or qualifying certifications). You also need to earn five PADI Specialty Divercertifications and have logged a minimum of 50 dives.



NAUI MSD

During training, students will engage in a minimum of eight open-water dives, including the following required dives:

• Emergency procedures and rescue
• Deep/simulated decompression diving
• Limited visibility or night diving
• Underwater navigation – search and recovery – light salvage

You may also choose from many different dives for your elective dives, such as:

• Skin diving
• Environmental study or survey
• Air consumption (practical application)
• Boat diving

Individuals ages 15+ and who have a NAUI Advanced Scuba Diver certification (or its equivalent), may enroll in the Master Scuba Diver course.

 

[boulderjohn]

Does anyone have an opinion of which cert' has the more difficult requirements to obtain the NAUI MSD or the PADI MSD.

Every diver, who is at least 12 years old, should aim for Master Scuba Diver.
The path starts with earning a PADI Open Water Diver certification, followed by PADI Advanced Open Water Diver and PADI Rescue Diver (or qualifying certifications). You also need to earn five PADI Specialty Divercertifications and have logged a minimum of 50 dives.



NAUI MSD

During training, students will engage in a minimum of eight open-water dives, including the following required dives:

• Emergency procedures and rescue
• Deep/simulated decompression diving
• Limited visibility or night diving
• Underwater navigation – search and recovery – light salvage

You may also choose from many different dives for your elective dives, such as:

• Skin diving
• Environmental study or survey
• Air consumption (practical application)
• Boat diving

Individuals ages 15+ and who have a NAUI Advanced Scuba Diver certification (or its equivalent), may enroll in the Master Scuba Diver course.

My opinion is that neither one is worth getting excited about.

Once again, these are relics of the early days of scuba instruction, when there were very few options for continued training. The "Master Scuba Diving" certification is designed to be an incentive for divers to take more advanced classes, but it really limits your training options to the kind of training available a half century ago.

What do I mean?

I am a trimix instructor and certified cave diver. My stack of certification cards measures two inches.

I do not qualify for the PADI Master Scuba Diver certification.

 

[Bob DBF]

I am a trimix instructor and certified cave diver. My stack of certification cards measures two inches.

I do not qualify for the PADI Master Scuba Diver certification.

Tsk-tsk.

 

[jborg]

I am a trimix instructor and certified cave diver. My stack of certification cards measures two inches.

I do not qualify for the PADI Master Scuba Diver certification.

Not everyone is cut out to join the best of the best, the elite group of respected divers who have earned this rating through both significant experience and scuba training.

 

[Wibble]

Does anyone have an opinion of which cert' has the more difficult requirements to obtain the NAUI MSD or the PADI MSD.

Every diver, who is at least 12 years old, should aim for Master Scuba Diver.
The path starts with earning a PADI Open Water Diver certification, followed by PADI Advanced Open Water Diver and PADI Rescue Diver (or qualifying certifications). You also need to earn five PADI Specialty Divercertifications and have logged a minimum of 50 dives.

PADI's so-called "master scuba diver" doesn’t assess for any mastery of skills, therefore isn’t a qualification.

It is a Starbucks loyalty card, purely a marketing tool—for which they charge money for.

What next, a PADI Prime subscription?

 

[Rayk]

Divemaster application form of PADI requires certification numbers of AOW, Rescue and EFR as prerequisite.

Also they demand you to submit copy along with the application, if any of those certifications issued by any other organization.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

"Advanced" modifies "Open Water" not the diver.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Does anyone have an opinion of which cert' has the more difficult requirements to obtain the NAUI MSD or the PADI MSD.

Every diver, who is at least 12 years old, should aim for Master Scuba Diver.
The path starts with earning a PADI Open Water Diver certification, followed by PADI Advanced Open Water Diver and PADI Rescue Diver (or qualifying certifications). You also need to earn five PADI Specialty Divercertifications and have logged a minimum of 50 dives.



NAUI MSD

During training, students will engage in a minimum of eight open-water dives, including the following required dives:

• Emergency procedures and rescue
• Deep/simulated decompression diving
• Limited visibility or night diving
• Underwater navigation – search and recovery – light salvage

You may also choose from many different dives for your elective dives, such as:

• Skin diving
• Environmental study or survey
• Air consumption (practical application)
• Boat diving

Individuals ages 15+ and who have a NAUI Advanced Scuba Diver certification (or its equivalent), may enroll in the Master Scuba Diver course.

This is somewhat misleading because those are the minimum requirements. The NAUI MSD course book is one of the most comprehensive I've seen. I have two of them here on hand. It's almost 300 pages (291 to be exact) and does not contain BS ads for other courses nor does it talk down to people. It is 12 chapters and is basically instructor level knowledge without the teaching component. And some instructor level courses don't have the info that it does.
It even has a section on hyperbaric chamber operation and concerns.
Technical diving at altitude with adjustments to decompression times? Yep.
It covers decompression diving as thoroughly as many Tech Deco Procedures courses.
The NAUI Master Diver course dive requirements are the bare minimum and all of the NAUI Instructors I know exceed them. Most of the instructors I know teach the course over several months and by the time students are done, they have way more than the 8 course dives. Master Diver candidates usually start with 50-100 dives before taking the course.
At the end of every section it also lists resources for further study that do not come from NAUI. I've yet to see any other agency do that in their books.

 

[scubadada]

How many times has this conversation regarding AOW occurred on SB?

Some operators require AOW to participate in their "advanced" dives. That's a good enough reason for me. Some operators may accept proof of recent deep dives, not sure what that proof would be, a logbook? AOW is a prerequisite for Rescue, another perfectly good reason to take it.