Seeking the DIR Answer: Must DIR Shops be Committed?

[John_B]

Unsafe by who's standards? That may very well be the problem. Some say that if you don't dive their configuration, you're gonna die! I dive an octo/inflator. Am I unsafe? A stroke?

I know you asked TRH, but I'll throw in my two cents. (BTW, I don't use the "S" work, its too incendiary.)

Does your octo/inflator make you an unsafe diver? No, not necessarily. I do recreational dives (<60') with guys with equipment probably similar to yours.

What makes an unsafe diver in my book is someone who doesn't have a dive plan before they hit the water or they don't follow it once they are wet. They skip equipment checks (bubble checks, s-drills), some of their equipment like their octo maybe substandard. In the water you might as well be diving solo for all of their (lack of) awareness of where you are, what the vis is, what the current is doing. Someone who argues when the dive is thumbed. Basically a complete lack of buddy awareness or team awareness.

I really don't get the fixation on DIR and equipment, its such a red herring. Like having a backplate and Scubapro regs with a bungeed backup is somehow going to make someone a good team diver? Uh, maybe not. Its really the other way around. The equipment standardization is because its a team decision and it works for pretty much all types of diving and you are on board with the thinking process, not because of some Rule#1 or Rule#6. Specific to your octo, its going to be hard as heck for you without a long hose to do s-drills and I start every dive with an s-drill, so that means I'd want to restrict the dive to <60' in pretty good conditions. And I'd prefer to know that it (the octo) is actually functional. It doesn't mean I'm too good to dive with you, or that I think I'm somehow better than you, it just means that its different from how I prefer to dive. Now if you're talking doing a dive on the Grove on an AL80, we have a whole bunch of additional issues beyond just the octo/inflator, starting with rock bottom gas calculations and whether I think you'd stick to the dive plan or go off by yourself (with my reserve gas, btw) and do your own thing and whether you'd do the same stops I do or whether you'd bump straight to 15' until your computer said three minutes were up.

John

 

[onfloat]

Hey onfloat, you want beef brah???

Naw, I like chicken, brah.

Well, I may have to stand corrected. I do listen to those who know more then I. I really didn't mean to "go off", just express my views. I may have taken Onfloats comments in the wrong tone, and in fact I hope I did. Teach me to post pre .

Well, you can take it anyway you want. Fact is the divers that are interested come of their own accord and those that don't...Well, don't.

 

[MonkSeal]

This thread should have never survived in the first place since it is a fairly obvious dig at DIR. Now this crap. Lynne, is this board going to be moderated or should it be abandoned as useless?

If it bothers you, don't read it. Pull the stick out....get on with your life.

This response shows that stickers, red warnings, etc. sometimes are not enough.

 

[Hank49]

This response shows that stickers, red warnings, etc. sometimes are not enough.

Check post 142. Then ask to ammend the red lettering so it says, "only hardcore DIR divers are allowed to insult women, or anyone else who questions GUE policy in this forum".

 

[MonkSeal]

Check post 142. Then ask to ammend the red lettering so it says, "only hardcore DIR divers are allowed to insult women, or anyone else who questions GUE policy in this forum".

I've read it ... and? If there's an insult in someone's post feel free to report it to moderator. Continuing to post something that's opposite to forum's policy will do no good to forum.

 

[TheRedHead]

What makes an unsafe diver in my book is someone who doesn't have a dive plan before they hit the water or they don't follow it once they are wet. They skip equipment checks (bubble checks, s-drills), some of their equipment like their octo maybe substandard. In the water you might as well be diving solo for all of their (lack of) awareness of where you are, what the vis is, what the current is doing. Someone who argues when the dive is thumbed. Basically a complete lack of buddy awareness or team awareness.

Well said, John. Lack of buddy awareness is my pet peeve. That and lack of proper gas planning.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Hmmm. I've never dived with a GUE-trained diver whom I felt unsafe. Have you?

Yes ... not everyone who takes a GUE class goes on to become a DIR diver. Some get caught up in gear and skills practice but fail to understand why GUE emphasizes those things in the first place.

Fundies will not make you DIR ... it will only provide some tools you can use to make yourself DIR ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[TheRedHead]

Fundies will not make you DIR ... it will only provide some tools you can use to make yourself DIR ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

I've only dived with a couple of DIR divers and they're very aware. The more I dive, the more I notice how unaware a lot of divers are. Being aware of your environment and the team is the thing that appeals to me.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I've only dived with a couple of DIR divers and they're very aware. The more I dive, the more I notice how unaware a lot of divers are. Being aware of your environment and the team is the thing that appeals to me.

I agree ... but a class will only teach you what you're supposed to do ... ingraining it into your habits takes diving experience. This is as true with GUE-trained divers as it is with anyone else ... the reason the former typically has better awareness is because it's heavily emphasized in the training. But it still takes practice to do it properly.

I once did a dive with a recently GUE-trained friend who left me at 20 feet when I had an 8-minute deco obligation. He went on in, and didn't even realize he'd left me behind till he stood up to take off his fins. Meanwhile, I was back at 20 feet burning off my deco.

Now, by his training, he knew that he'd screwed up ... but because at the time he was still pretty inexperienced, he had a momentary brain fart. It happens.

Today ... a few classes and a coupla hundred dives later ... I'm confident that he wouldn't make that mistake again.

GUE training doesn't de-humanize us ... and because we're still human, we'll still make mistakes. The thing is, folks who are attracted to GUE training are usually pretty motived to recognize their mistakes and self-correct when they make one.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[rjack321]

I once did a dive with a recently GUE-trained friend who left me at 20 feet when I had an 8-minute deco obligation. He went on in, and didn't even realize he'd left me behind till he stood up to take off his fins. Meanwhile, I was back at 20 feet burning off my deco.

Now, by his training, he knew that he'd screwed up ... but because at the time he was still pretty inexperienced, he had a momentary brain fart. It happens.

Today ... a few classes and a coupla hundred dives later ... I'm confident that he wouldn't make that mistake again.

Bob, how did one team member end up with a deco obligation when the other did not? There seem to be other peices to this story.