St. Thomas - Good Diving but Overpriced Ghetto

[Rule62]

Some people love detroit.

I loved living outside of Detroit, not in Detroit!! Only time in Detroit was to eat in Greektown or go to the Joe!!!

 

[DennisS]

I've sailed on oceanographic ships all over the world, for over twenty years, and the only place where we had crimes against the crew or scientists was the virgin islands.

One instance a guy was watching two guys arguing and they started a fight. They were boxing and sparring and the fight moved around a corner. When he followed another guy pulled a knife on him. The two guys that set him up with the fight robbed him.

One of the female scientists was with a group in a restaurant. A guy came in grabbed her purse and ran out the door.

One of the crew was coming back to the ship late, after a night of drinking, two guys, one with a machete, tried to rob him. He grabbed the machete and both assailants took off down the street.

This was over a period of years but its one of the few places where you can feel the attitude. The first two incidents took place on St Thomas, the last one on St Croix. Beutiful place but lots of criminals.

 

[Wildcard]

I was planing to visit St Thomas before I leave the carib but everyone I have talked to says the same thing, it sucks!

 

[H2Andy]

now you guys have to take a second step:

why is it that there is so little crime in other parts of the Caribbean compared to the U.S Virgin Islands? or Puerto Rico, another U.S. territory.

why do parts of the Virgin Islands look like Detroit? why are there so many violent crimes in Puerto Rico?

why do these U.S. controlled islands resemble more the mainland U.S. than the rest of the Caribbean?

 

[Cacia]

The British Virgins and the US Virgins have the same cultural legacy---sugar planations, slavery, etc. You can leave your purse in the street in Tortola...very friendly, very clean, excellent 3R's education in the primary schools. They still have Crown Rule, I think? They do not put up with a lot of crime, in comparison. The families are intact, the fathers have not been replaced with government checks.

We basically messed up the US Virgins. St John is an exception just because it is a small intimate community. Look, I loved St Thomas or I would not have stayed 8 years. BUT, for the most part the local West Indians hate whites..sorry it is true. I was engaged to a guy from Martinique, I had basically only West Indian friends for eight years (about 95%, the demographics). I worked in a very busy ER at the then Knud Hansen, I saw a lot. There are many great people there, and I was able to find them (most were from other neighbor islands tho) but St Thomas stands out in the Caribbean as a hostile place in many ways. So does St Croix. Anybody remember when LaBeets mowed down the golfers on the Fountain Valley golf course? (for being white?) Later he hijacked a plane to Cuba with a gun planted by the ground crew, if I recall correctly. An FBI agent brought me a gun for protection during one murder spree against whites. I ended up having it held to my own head, lol, hate to give that one to the gun control fans, but I was asleep when he took it out of my drawer.

I used to go to Sunsplash raggae festivals in Jamaica...I went to most every island., doing transport of patients. When I say your stuff gets stolen in San Jaun, or lots of people hate your face in Charlotte Amalie, if you are white, it's the truth as I saw it for more than just a week on vacation.

I liked many aspects of it, one was the challeng of staying alive.

I just think it is sort of pathetic to shut down people from saying what they see. To assume you are a racists for saying a place is dangerous or a ghetto or that many there hate whites, is kinda unsophisticated, don't you think?

 

[H2Andy]

BUT, for the most part the local West Indians hate whites..sorry it is true.

and why would this be so?

it's not the only possible reaction, but consider this:

you have privileges they don't have (you can take vacations; most of them can't afford one)

you have wealth they don't have (your average salary is beyond the reach of 99% of those islanders)

they see the "luxury" in which tourists live, and then have to go back to their much less comfy dwellings.

they are treated as "hired help" or "natives" by many tourists (not all)

for the most part, they are invisible to the tourists, who go by and don't acknowledge them (not all tourists). this makes tourists look "standoffish" and like "snobs" even though many are not

so ... how do you deal with someone who comes into your country, lives better than you, and treats you like hired help or ignores you?

in many places, if the tourist industry truly benefits the people, the people see tourists as their business and are much more friendly.

in places with a crappy economy or where tourist dollars are not spread out to many people, the tourists are just buttholes with no upside.

so ... they are easy to "hate" (i would say resent)

 

[Cacia]

Okay, resent. Maybe they should...I am not saying I wouldn't, don't you get it? But resent enough to kill, in many cases.

I never said I hated them...

I just tried to keep from getting killed for five bucks.

At that time in my life, I went around wanting to be a white rasta. lol, it was a big education. I did everything from deliver babies to sewing up heads without cutting the sacred dreads off. It was a big challenge to make them NOT hate ME. But, they hate most rich white people there on vacation, I'm just saying....hey, Andy...go ask them, they will tell you they do. When I say "they" I mean about 80% of St Thomians. It's the NYC of the Caribbean, so there are many West Indians from other places that are not that way. Anguilla, Montserat, way different attitudes, for example.

yea, bong water, that's why I am saying this, that's it.

The man is just saying he doesn't want to vacation where he is resented to that degree. West Indians that don't want to vacation in Lynchburg, Virginia, will get no arguments from me.

We are all grown ups here, aren't we?

so ... how do you deal with someone who comes into your country, lives better than you, and treats you like hired help or ignores you?

oh? you mean like the Japanese do here? I deal with it, it has other advantages, like the higher curve in my kid's classes and the low crime rate in my neighborhood. lol. Haole neighbors are not desirable in some ways...too noisy and have too many dogs. (like my house, motorcycles, crazy teenager parties) I just know to wait until the Japanese wait on each other, it doesn't kill me and I guess it is karmic debt.

I deal with it by whining to Kim...

in many places, if the tourist industry truly benefits the people, the people see tourists as their business and are much more friendly.

yes, it is corrupt I thought, just like Mexico.

 

[Mauifish]

and why would this be so?

it's not the only possible reaction, but consider this:

you have privileges they don't have (you can take vacations; most of them can't afford one)

you have wealth they don't have (your average salary is beyond the reach of 99% of those islanders)

they see the "luxury" in which tourists live, and then have to go back to their much less comfy dwellings.

they are treated as "hired help" or "natives" by many tourists (not all)

for the most part, they are invisible to the tourists, who go by and don't acknowledge them (not all tourists). this makes tourists look "standoffish" and like "snobs" even though many are not

so ... how do you deal with someone who comes into your country, lives better than you, and treats you like hired help or ignores you?

in many places, if the tourist industry truly benefits the people, the people see tourists as their business and are much more friendly.

in places with a crappy economy or where tourist dollars are not spread out to many people, the tourists are just buttholes with no upside.

so ... they are easy to "hate" (i would say resent)

Andy, I am presently in Koh Samui Thailand and see the economic disparity and very poor conditions of most here yet even the poorist seem to smile and enjoy a good disposition, they are totaly dependant on tourism yet they seem to like tourist genuinly. Could it be a difference in genetics or some other reason than social class?

 

[H2Andy]

it probably is a cultural difference

i don't think any of the Asians there were slaves to westeners until about 120 years ago, and then saw all the wealth they had help create kept by the upper classes when slavery ended

it is a very different dynamic, and they are very different cultures anyway

 

[Cacia]

one with a machete, tried to rob him.

yea, those machete hack jobs got my attention. A nurse I knew was hacked to death walking home from work.

I don't think the St Thomas crime problem has anything to do with slavery.

The other islands were slaves from Africa, brought in to work the sugar planations and they are very different. Very very safe, many of them. Many West Indians embraced me, took me in on other islands treated me like family.
It's the bondage of a welfare state, the new form of "slavery".