TDI or GUE or UTD

[lamont]

That's right. When you sign up for a GUE class, you have to accept that you'll do enough dives at the pace *GUE* feels makes you a safe diver, not just your own personal whim. If 25 dives in three years seems too great a "burden" then (1) GUE training isn't for you (there's nothing wrong with that), and (2) you really do have to question why you're getting trimix certified (it's a fair amount of work and money if you'd be doing less than eight such dives per year).

In any case, as I already mentioned, you can renew with some checkout dives (assuming your skills haven't deteriorated).

You're turning it personal. And personally, I don't have to worry until around 2015 before it becomes an issue for me.

However, I have *seen* a diver take three years off, then I went cave diving with him, without a GUE instructors blessing, and it all turned out fine. Nobody died. He rapidly went from a little rusty, to being a better diver than I am now with my newly-minted C2 card.

At some point, it would be nice if the agency would admit that you're an adult, and you're trained and certified and you should be able to make your *own* decisions, and trust you to make *good* ones about what level of continuing training you need. Lynne would choose training, the buddy that I went diving with chose diving with some C1 divers for a week as a warm up.

At some point in life, you're 21 years old, and you can drink and smoke and drive and vote and join the military -- even though 21 year olds don't know jack ****. I think there's a parallel to T2/C2 divers.

I doubt this argument is possible to ever settle, though, since I'm making a mostly philosophical point that isn't likely to affect me anytime soon, and you're choosing to interpret it as me trying to get away with something.

 

[Rainer]

I literally have no idea what you're talking about. There's nothing personal about this.

If you don't agree with the GUE stance, don't take the GUE class. It's really that simple.

You're turning it personal. And personally, I don't have to worry until around 2015 before it becomes an issue for me.

However, I have *seen* a diver take three years off, then I went cave diving with him, without a GUE instructors blessing, and it all turned out fine. Nobody died. He rapidly went from a little rusty, to being a better diver than I am now with my newly-minted C2 card.

At some point, it would be nice if the agency would admit that you're an adult, and you're trained and certified and you should be able to make your *own* decisions, and trust you to make *good* ones about what level of continuing training you need. Lynne would choose training, the buddy that I went diving with chose diving with some C1 divers for a week as a warm up.

At some point in life, you're 21 years old, and you can drink and smoke and drive and vote and join the military -- even though 21 year olds don't know jack ****. I think there's a parallel to T2/C2 divers.

I doubt this argument is possible to ever settle, though, since I'm making a mostly philosophical point that isn't likely to affect me anytime soon, and you're choosing to interpret it as me trying to get away with something.

 

[TSandM]

I'm not sure I would "choose training". I'd choose doing the diving regularly enough to stay current. If something in my life changed and I wasn't able to do that, I think I'd talk to Danny and ask him if he'd do a couple of days of diving with me and tell me if he thought I needed to take the class over again.

Of course, I now have a non-expiring full cave card, so it's not formally an issue. But you know what? If I didn't stay current, I'd STILL ask Danny or Fred or Dennis to do a couple of days with me before I got back into it. The skills to dive in a cave, and the skills to cope with an emergency are different. If Cave 2 taught me nothing else, it taught me that if you haven't practiced emergency procedures in a year and a half, they aren't sharp any more. In fact, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea if all of us who dive caves did a day of drills under an instructor's eye every couple of years.

 

[StreetDoctor]

I also see where Bob Sherwood has a class in Key Largo soon. That would be cool!

Yup, taking it with Bob. Can't wait

 

[lamont]

I'm not sure I would "choose training". I'd choose doing the diving regularly enough to stay current. If something in my life changed and I wasn't able to do that, I think I'd talk to Danny and ask him if he'd do a couple of days of diving with me and tell me if he thought I needed to take the class over again.

Of course, I now have a non-expiring full cave card, so it's not formally an issue. But you know what? If I didn't stay current, I'd STILL ask Danny or Fred or Dennis to do a couple of days with me before I got back into it. The skills to dive in a cave, and the skills to cope with an emergency are different. If Cave 2 taught me nothing else, it taught me that if you haven't practiced emergency procedures in a year and a half, they aren't sharp any more. In fact, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea if all of us who dive caves did a day of drills under an instructor's eye every couple of years.

Well, what you just said there, is exactly what i meant by 'choose training'.

And you would clearly do that even if you weren't required to do so (and which you aren't required to do because of your other card).

I'd probably just sign up for a few days of guided diving with Fred, too, just because that is fun and he shows you a lot, on top of being an instructor.

But, I can choose to make those decisions on my own. I don't feel like I need an agency to make those kinds of decisions for me.

(And I'm not quite sure why this thread got moved, since its still mostly DIR-related and we're talking specifically about GUE-vs-UTD policies -- no biggie, but it'll probably fall off my radar, so it may be the last thing i have to say).

 

[lamont]

If you don't agree with the GUE stance, don't take the GUE class. It's really that simple.

Yeah, but this is the one issue that I disgree with GUE over, and on more substantive issues I'll pick GUE over any other agency -- but I think I've shelled over enough money to GUE that i have a right to gripe now about whatever issues I see fit too... (And JJ/GUE has every right to ignore me completely, because they're the ones actually running the agency...)

EDIT: oh, and you're still turning a philosophical discussion into a personal argument.