Touch contact navigation procedures in low-zero viz

[Norwegian Cave Diver]

touch contact. Dive leader on the right, since it's 0-vis he'll have a compass I assume. Diver on the left is the "buddy" and is watching depth/time/whatever else and has a lose c-grip on the dive leaders tricep. We teach this at OW level. Not rocket science

Dive leader on the Right?
Diver on the left is the buddy?
Why dive buddy on the left? Is your long hose on the left?

 

[tbone1004]

Dive leader on the Right?
Diver on the left is the buddy?
Why dive buddy on the left? Is your long hose on the left?

Both divers need free left-hands for buoyancy control.
Dive-Leader needs right hand free to use the nav-slate, only possible on the right. If on the left the "buddy" would need to hold on with his left hand which would require breaking touch contact for buoyancy control.

 

[Norwegian Cave Diver]

Both divers need free left-hands for buoyancy control.
Dive-Leader needs right hand free to use the nav-slate, only possible on the right. If on the left the "buddy" would need to hold on with his left hand which would require breaking touch contact for buoyancy control.

Ok. So what length of hose is required for the donation reg for that to work well?

 

[tbone1004]

Ok. So what length of hose is required for the donation reg for that to work well?

32" reaches in that position though isn't ideal. 40" is more than enough

 

[Norwegian Cave Diver]

32" reaches in that position though isn't ideal. 40" is more than enough

The expectation would be that in low vis someone needs help navigating but isn't low on air. But if low on air is included then a standard length hose will work.

 

[Landlocked123]

. Well for good or bad here is a section of video from our dive. Apologize for the long video. I had already cut it for our own review purposes. Video is from my dive buddy's camera. My go pro crapped out. This was dive #3 of the day. Feel free to point out things we did wrong as we already identified several. This is why we go pro all our dives. Its amazing what you see after the fact. The camera never lies. Our goal is to keep improving. To clarify, the bottoming out and kicking up muck with our hands was by intent meaning we are literally diving blind not knowing if below us is hard bottom or the way deeper we are looking for and obviously we don't know what is in front of us either. This quarry is notorious for its large submerged trees. We punched through 5-6 feet of the suspended muck several times only to bottom out each time. We almost smacked into a tree at one point so kicking up more crap is the least of our concerns. No corals to destroy here and if we see more muck then we know we need to keep looking for the way down. We got separated twice due to one of us adjusting buoyancy as T Bone mentioned which caused loss of touch contact. In the dark portions we are touch contact but we were not consistent moving on opposite sides of one another. Oh and yeah I know my mask is always flooded. Pretty standard for me...LOL... apparently my face is deformed because in 10 years of diving I still cant ding one that does not leak. My upper lip area is apparently too small and that is where I always leak. Advantage is I am used to 45 degree water in my mask which inevitably causes me to lose one or both of my contacts .

 

[lowviz]

Would like some feedback on procedures folks use in low to zero viz diving with respect to touch contact navigation. Please do share. ...//...

I've had a bit of real experience in no-viz diving and (in 2007) a professional 2-yr cert in same. I'm unsure of your use of the word 'navigation'. If you are just trying to get somewhere in zero viz with no overhead, then I suggest you both surface.

But I most certainly don't want to discourage your exploration of such diving! I would suggest you and your buddy go to Willow Springs (PA) and dive the caboose. It is in a very shallow area away from classes, etc. You can silt the hell out of it and nobody will care.

I assume that you are struggling with the problem of two totally blind divers relying on each other for guidance. An exact statement of what you are actually trying to accomplish would be most helpful.

Edit:

I watched your vid again, this time closely for content. The viz starts out rather good! I note the somewhat awkward arms folded and frog position. No judgment here, I'm still working on mine. IMHO, forget everything (for now) other than getting your buoyancy control better. Job one is to never silt the place out. If that viz is typical, then the two of you drifting above the silt should be no problem with respect to nav.

 

[Landlocked123]

Per my post what we were trying to accomplish is find a place to punch through to deeper water. When we hit the layer of muck its already silted out so we did not care about trying to not silt anything out . We intentionally scrapped at the bottom as there was no other way to find out if below us was bottom or deeper water. We can stay 3 feet off the bottom all day long if we can see it ..LOL .... My post was aimed at trying to get feedback as to how folks stay in touch contact regardless of the direction they are going in. We by intent had no set bearing just an original starting direction. The reason you see us pointing at each other to go this way or that way is we were just noticing pockets of what appeared to be darker/deeper water and systematically tried to drop into each one. This meant scraping the bottom. That was the plan. I have some ideas folks have shared and we will be practicing. Also to clarify, we were hundreds of yards away from the areas where classes were being held and there were no other divers so there was no concern of ruining other peoples dives. Lowviz where did you get formal training ? I would like to look into it.

 

[lowviz]

...//... The reason you see us pointing at each other to go this way or that way is we were just noticing pockets of what appeared to be darker/deeper water and systematically tried to drop into each one. This meant scraping the bottom. That was the plan. ...

OK, now I get it.

...//... Lowviz where did you get formal training ? I would like to look into it.

Rapid Deployment Search and Rescue / Recovery - Team Lifeguard Systems - Public Safety Water Rescue Training and Equipment

It may not be what you are looking for. It is team diving, four of the team on the surface and the 'dope on the rope' is doing a blind search while being directed from the surface. Safety diver and backup diver are dressed and ready to assist if you get into trouble.

It is rare to find another diver who is comfortable in the conditions you describe. That would be the benefit of taking the course I did, but it seems that you and your dive bud are already there. BE CAREFUL!!!

When my kid and I would do ........ like that, we would use 'bump contact'. Make a fist and gently poke your partner. Reach straight out to the side, not forward or behind. Lets you know who is getting ahead or behind. Up or down? Grab your bud and try to get both to the same depth. It isn't pretty, but it works rather well.

 

[Landlocked123]

Thanks for sharing. One of the guys that dives at this quarry runs the County dive and rescue team. He has a ton of experience in Public Safety diving so I have reached out to him as well. I may give it a go and join the Fire dept and head down that route. I think the training would be invaluable. For good or bad this is going to be my watering hole. It means most of my diving is going to end up low to no real viz. Its not by intent but almost by need meaning I already have over 30 dives in four weeks at this quarry so , although its large, we are getting the urge to see new things and discover new things. Eventually they are going to drop stuff in there (a C130 as well apparently).The inherent risk is not lost on me so again thanks for sharing the link. To further clarify the reason we are so actively seeking to get below this layer at 70 is the staff is telling us that apparently viz improves below it. Hopefully this is correct as it would be great to be able to locate this clearer water.