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We call it the "shrimp dance" ...TSandM:
... Bob (Grateful Diver)
Trim/Body position Practice Techniques
- Thread starter dirthead
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... Bob (Grateful Diver)
Green_Manelishi
Contributor
Snowbear:Make sure your head "back" ... as in face forward ... when you are back-kicking. This will help keep you 'in trim' and at the same depth when backing up.
I tend to look "down" when I back kick, which makes me lose depth. This is actually something I have learned to use to my advantage when I want to start decreasing my depth
That must be quite a sight; descending in reverse
Consider the possibilities when you master the back kick.
You can do a dive using nothing but the back kick and never see where you are going .. only where you have been !!!
BabyDuck
Contributor
hmm, snowbear, that's good advice. i think the problem is that i like to see that i'm actually backing up, and get all enthralled with watching *the bottom* go backwards, so my head's down! i'll have to try it watching a wall or something i guess.
someone also suggested dropping my knees a bit. any thoughts on that idea?
someone also suggested dropping my knees a bit. any thoughts on that idea?
cmalinowski
Contributor
See TSandM, lot's of people thought it was descendingGreen_Manelishi:That must be quite a sight; descending in reverse
Consider the possibilities when you master the back kick.
You can do a dive using nothing but the back kick and never see where you are going .. only where you have been !!!
I did too the first time I read it...
Losing Depth = Gaining Shallow
Chris
The "baby shrimp" is a fairly common occurrence during the backwards kick. It's a great way to setup the headspin helicopter turn, but may not be what you're looking for .
As folks have said, keeping your head up is a big first step. This helps a) improve team awareness and b) keep your center of gravity aligned. I have a medium body and an XL head. . .so I have to keep my head up to prevent that lawn dart effect. Dropping my head makes my feet go up.
The big problem is that the tips of the fins tend to grab the water while you're extending backwards. Once the tips curl, the rest of the fin wants to follow. So if you're extending your legs back during the loading stroke and the tips curl up, the rest of the fin naturally wants to go up as well. Then when you perform the power stroke, you pull yourself upwards instead of back.
There are many ways around this, and depending on what you can do, many will work. In the video, we emphasize a) bringing the fins together in a v-formation, and b) extending back and down. Bringing the fins together in a v may help reduce the chances of the tips curling up, but may decrease your stability, as your feet will be close together. It's important that you setup the fins prior to extending for the loading stroke though; once those fin tips start to curl, you'll have to work twice as hard to prevent that from happening. And if you make any movements that aren't focused on moving you backwards, you will go forwards.
The last tip I can impart is that you must go slowly when you extend for the loading stroke; your fins are designed to impart foward motion, and any movement may be converted into that unknowingly. Moving slowly prevents any accidental force from moving you forward (think space walking). Of course, in order to move slowly and purposefully, you must be stable in the water.
But don't worry; perfect practice makes perfect. And hey, it's a bit advanced, but if you have some way to create a movie file online of your diving/kicks, I'd be happy to look at it and let you know how to tweek it a bit. Just drop the link to me at joe@breakthrudiving.com.
joe talavera
.As folks have said, keeping your head up is a big first step. This helps a) improve team awareness and b) keep your center of gravity aligned. I have a medium body and an XL head. . .so I have to keep my head up to prevent that lawn dart effect. Dropping my head makes my feet go up.
The big problem is that the tips of the fins tend to grab the water while you're extending backwards. Once the tips curl, the rest of the fin wants to follow. So if you're extending your legs back during the loading stroke and the tips curl up, the rest of the fin naturally wants to go up as well. Then when you perform the power stroke, you pull yourself upwards instead of back.
There are many ways around this, and depending on what you can do, many will work. In the video, we emphasize a) bringing the fins together in a v-formation, and b) extending back and down. Bringing the fins together in a v may help reduce the chances of the tips curling up, but may decrease your stability, as your feet will be close together. It's important that you setup the fins prior to extending for the loading stroke though; once those fin tips start to curl, you'll have to work twice as hard to prevent that from happening. And if you make any movements that aren't focused on moving you backwards, you will go forwards
.The last tip I can impart is that you must go slowly when you extend for the loading stroke; your fins are designed to impart foward motion, and any movement may be converted into that unknowingly. Moving slowly prevents any accidental force from moving you forward (think space walking). Of course, in order to move slowly and purposefully, you must be stable in the water.
But don't worry; perfect practice makes perfect. And hey, it's a bit advanced, but if you have some way to create a movie file online of your diving/kicks, I'd be happy to look at it and let you know how to tweek it a bit. Just drop the link to me at joe@breakthrudiving.com.
joe talavera
Green_Manelishi
Contributor
Green_Manelishi:That must be quite a sight; descending in reverse
Consider the possibilities when you master the back kick.
You can do a dive using nothing but the back kick and never see where you are going .. only where you have been !!!
OK so I misread the post. :06:
Losing depth = ascending. Gaining depth = descending.
Regardless, once the kick is mastered the entire dive can be done in reverse.
cmalinowski
Contributor
My backwards kick seems to be getting better (not going up as much). You can tell when it "feels" right.
Now, my helicopter turns... they need some work to be able to pivot around and object. I tend to move and, essentially, circumnavigate the object
Chris
Now, my helicopter turns... they need some work to be able to pivot around and object. I tend to move and, essentially, circumnavigate the object
Chris
BabyDuck
Contributor
well, chris, i see more rawlings visits in your future...i see the meat locker plugged in & putting out the cold...i see warm showers...i see campfires...
are you feelin' it? let's make it happen!!
are you feelin' it? let's make it happen!!
After today's pool session I just want to take one of my Jet fins and smack myself over the head with it!!!!
This stuff is harder than it looks. To start it off, I went into the pool with the exact same weighting as the last time. In my previous session, I felt like my trim was fairly good. Today, I was so top heavy it was a struggle just to keep from going completely head down. I adjusted my tank as low as possible, moved some weight around, but no improvement. My Jets just seemed to have a mind of their own. I would try to work on some finning techniques and one would go toe up and one toe down. I could not control them whatsoever.
Today was the first day in over a week that it was warm and sunny, but it was a horrible day for me to be in the pool. I got so frustrated I just got out of the pool and had a beer, or two. Now I feel better!
Do you guys have days like these? Where nothing seems to work....You just can't get your weighting right......Your fins are possessed......You feel like it was your first day with scuba gear on. Man, I hope tomorrow is a better day or I just might dig a hole and bury all my gear, six foot under. Maybe I should just go back to the flutter kick and standard rec hoses.
This stuff is harder than it looks. To start it off, I went into the pool with the exact same weighting as the last time. In my previous session, I felt like my trim was fairly good. Today, I was so top heavy it was a struggle just to keep from going completely head down. I adjusted my tank as low as possible, moved some weight around, but no improvement. My Jets just seemed to have a mind of their own. I would try to work on some finning techniques and one would go toe up and one toe down. I could not control them whatsoever.
Today was the first day in over a week that it was warm and sunny, but it was a horrible day for me to be in the pool. I got so frustrated I just got out of the pool and had a beer, or two. Now I feel better!
Do you guys have days like these? Where nothing seems to work....You just can't get your weighting right......Your fins are possessed......You feel like it was your first day with scuba gear on. Man, I hope tomorrow is a better day or I just might dig a hole and bury all my gear, six foot under. Maybe I should just go back to the flutter kick and standard rec hoses.
Absolutely!!! Though fortunately they are very infrequent any more and usually related to some sort of equipment change.dirthead:
Don't give up, though.
If you are hopelessly frustrated, it's often better to just go do a fun dive and come back to practicing skills or whatever when you have relaxed. Being frustrated will make you tense and it will seem like nothing is going right... which will frustrate you more. In your case, since you were in the pool and couldn't just go swim around and look at critter, you did the right thing by stopping.... just don't give up completely.... it'll come
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