Using the regulator to provide rescue breathing.

[ZapDiver]

Hello all!

I've just finished my Rescue course (exam and certification pending), and I was wondering if it's possible to use the regulator to provide emergency breathing, either on the surface or on the boat or land (Lift chin, pinch nose put the regulator on the mouth and press the purge button for about 1 second).

I asked about it to my instructor and he told me that he didn't knew that it could be done. Does anyone have any opinion about it?

 

[scubamountaingirl]

as a fellow brand new rescue diver, it sounds like a good plan especially if your tired from doing cpr for a while....i will post this to my instructor who is as smart as a whip...

ww

 

[tc]

A couple of problems with that-

A normal regulator mouthpiece won't create a good seal around the mouth, If you do manage to get a seal and there is any resistance to the air flow going in then it will just flow out the exhaust of the second stage.

And the biggest potential problem occurs if you overcome the first two issues- Scuba regulators can produce enough flow to cause an over expansion of the lungs- creating even more problems for the already non-breathing victim.

There are oxygen regulators such as the MTV-100 sold by DAN that are flow limited and are designed to stop flow if resistance is encountered- those are suitable for resuscitation. Many jurisdictions in California prohibit their use by paramedics and EMT's due to remaining concerns over the over inflation problem. In those areas they use a bag-valve mask (BVM) for resuscitation.

MTV-100 costs $300 something last time I checked- BVM's are $15 to $20.

 

[DennisS]

I had a friend that was a paramedic in Oregon and they weren't allowed to use them. If two states won't allow trained personnel to use specifically designed equipment. It would be a bad idea for divers to start improvising with holding the victims nose and inflating their lungs with a diving regulator.

 

[Slonda828]

The FROPVD, or flow-restricted, oxygen powered ventilation device (AKA the demand valve in the o2 kit) mitigates lung over-expansion injuries by literally restricting airflow into the airway of an unconscious victim. I would not try to use a SCUBA regulator to perform this function. First, as lay rescuers are not EMT trained, you are doing something that is above the scope of your training as a first responder (state dependent) by mechanically ventilating an unconscious victim. When I took WEMT, for example, first responders were not trained on how to use a bag valve mask or FROPVD. The second issue is that rescue breathing, which is the only function of basic life support that you are supposed to perform in water, is not so tiring that you would need to risk further injury to the patient by blowing a ton of water particles and compressed air into their lungs. Besides, CPR is traumatic and stressful for both the rescuer and the victim. I would love to see someone perform CPR correctly and provide adequate circulation and ventilation while in the ocean.

Tow them to the boat or shore while administering 1 rescue breath every 5 seconds for a total rate of 12 breaths per minute (not to exceed 20). Don't over-complicate it. If you have a pocket mask or a snorkel without a purge valve, you can use both of those to get a better seal. If you are stranded somewhere in the ocean, chances are that they will die long before you get them to definitive care without early CPR and early defibrillation anyway according to most DOT approved curricula.

 

[chrispete]

Part of your rescue training should have covered the fact that you have some legal protection for attempting to rescue someone in immediate danger as long as you stay within the scope of your training. Once you step outside of that scope you can (and likely will) be sued. Just do what you can to get the person to someone with more training or better yet keep an eye out for divers who look like they might be in distress and assist. The best rescue is one in which the victim has no idea that they were just rescued, in my opinion.

 

[TSandM]

It is theoretically possible, but as already stated, you would have to do two things: Achieve a good seal around the mouthpiece (very difficult) and block the exhaust valve enough to generate a high enough pressure to expand the chest, without giving so much pressure that you blow a lung. It is not really a good option.

 

[Doc Harry]

As a physician, I never attempt to do anything with a patient unless I am confident that I can treat any complications that I may accidentally create.

Using "powered" inflators, you can burst someone's lung and give them a pneumothorax or even a tension pneumothorax that can kill them. Unless you are confident and trained in the treatment of tension pneumothorax and cutting open someone's chest, I would not use a "powered" ventilator of any kind.

Using a regulator to ventilate someone is a great idea in theory but a difficult and even dangerous one in real practice.

 

[tc]

Side note- If anyone would like to get training in the MTV-100 or bag-valve mask the DAN advanced Oxygen provider course does cover both.

 

[Doc Harry]

Side note- If anyone would like to get training in the MTV-100 or bag-valve mask the DAN advanced Oxygen provider course does cover both.

That's a great idea.