Why do I need a Nitrox certification?

[Rhone Man]

Interesting thread. A couple of posts prompted some interesting thoughts:

• Lots of strong opposition to people using nitrox and just "riding their computer" rather than fully understanding what is going on. But no comment on people who struggled through a nitrox class, forgot it all soon afterward and then just "ride their computer"?
  
• Someone asked: if you say people shouldn't need a whole new class for nitrox, why not trimix? So long as we are comparing like with like, I'd take that point. No one suggests an OW cert should allow you to use trimix. But if you are trained and experienced diving deep on air (wait till I finish my comment to start flaming please...), handling two stage bottles and planning your deco and gas reserves, what is a normoxic trimix course going to give you other than a not-very-secret formulae to calculate END and another card?

 

[chrpai]

Interesting thread. A couple of posts prompted some interesting thoughts:

• Lots of strong opposition to people using nitrox and just "riding their computer" rather than fully understanding what is going on. But no comment on people who struggled through a nitrox class, forgot it all soon afterward and then just "ride their computer"?

I left a comment to that effect. I said something along the lines of "a C-CARD just tells the fill shop that at some point you convinced someone you knew what you were doing." To me, it's a given that it's up to the diver to keep their knowledge and skill up to date.

I believe in self study ( I have a very high paying IT job despite never having gone to college ) and I believe that there is room for discussion on how the industry teaches and sells the stuff. But I believe the original poster is far, far, far from being the poster child for that cause.

 

[Teller]

Now that I think of it why do I need an open water cert either?

 

[jmneill]

Interesting thread. A couple of posts prompted some interesting thoughts:

• Lots of strong opposition to people using nitrox and just "riding their computer" rather than fully understanding what is going on. But no comment on people who struggled through a nitrox class, forgot it all soon afterward and then just "ride their computer"?
  

It took eleven pages of primarily unuseful comments for someone to to post this. From my experience of diving with many Nitrox certified divers/ instructors (BTW, none of whom had any qualms diving with me) I can say IMHO that beyond a shadow of a doubt that this is how the majority, if not vast majority of Nitrox dives are done. I am not advocating it, I am merely bringing it to light. After eleven pages I am without a definitive answer as to if this practice along with a conservatively minded diver that has spent 15 minutes reading up on nitrox basics is really putting themself at an elevated risk... I know which way I am leaning at this point.....

 

[ianr33]

• Someone asked: if you say people shouldn't need a whole new class for nitrox, why not trimix? So long as we are comparing like with like, I'd take that point. No one suggests an OW cert should allow you to use trimix. But if you are trained and experienced diving deep on air (wait till I finish my comment to start flaming please...), handling two stage bottles and planning your deco and gas reserves, what is a normoxic trimix course going to give you other than a not-very-secret formulae to calculate END and another card?

My trimix course gave me a pretty little plastic card and an $800 hole in my bank account.

Totally agree with you.

 

[Slamfire]

The gas in my tank.

Without gas in my tank I can not breathe.

Alberto (aka eDiver)

Some decades ago, when I was just starting to use scuba tanks with the instruction of my father (who had never had any training from any traditional agency) a skill we practiced was taking off your rig at depth, leaving it at the bottom and ascending to surface. Then you had to free dive to the bottom and put it all again and keep on diving. There were no BCDs, no spgs, just J valves that often malfunctioned. Clearly, the gas in our tanks was not the most important asset since we continually trained on how to abandon it.

One time I had a real out of air, again, because the blessed J valve did not deliver extra gas when I pulled it down. I was buddying up with my dad and I gave him the out of air signal. He quickly jumped into action doing buddy breathing and then proceeded to try to take my rig off from me. At that point I pushed him back because I had no inclination to abandon my rig and have to come back later to hunt it down and rescue it. It was an otherwise uneventful ascent followed by my surface swimming a couple of hundred yards with an empty tank on my back. No BCD. You did have to be a competent swimmer back in the day. However, I did have the peace of mind that if at any point this was getting too much for me, I could quickly get out of the rig and continue swimming without it.

 

[boulderjohn]

Interesting thread. A couple of posts prompted some interesting thoughts:

• Someone asked: if you say people shouldn't need a whole new class for nitrox, why not trimix? So long as we are comparing like with like, I'd take that point. No one suggests an OW cert should allow you to use trimix. But if you are trained and experienced diving deep on air (wait till I finish my comment to start flaming please...), handling two stage bottles and planning your deco and gas reserves, what is a normoxic trimix course going to give you other than a not-very-secret formulae to calculate END and another card?

I said earlier that the real challenge of advanced nitrox/deco procedures was the skills associated with handling decompression, extra tanks, etc. That is probably why some agencies include helium mixes from the very beginning of tech training. Those skills are pretty much the same whether you are breathing trimix or air during the dive.

You would think, then, that an agency that includes trimix in its beginning technical training would therefore be pretty much done once you get to that level. Au contraire! After one such agency gets the diver to the rough equivalent of what other agencies call normoxic trimix (or just trimix), it requires three additional classes and a total of 95 dives at different depths in addition to the dives in the courses in order to complete trimix training. That can take years and many thousands of additional dollars to complete what can be done in a month with another agency. That's why I always caution people entering technical diving to look carefully at the entire path a potential agency provides. The differences from one agency to another are truly amazing.

 

[Bob DBF]

Now that I think of it why do I need an open water cert either?

You don't.

I only picked up a c-card because an increasing number of shops would not fill my tanks and the card was less expensive than a compressor.



Bob
---------------------------
I may be old, but I’m not dead yet.

 

[dmoore19]

You don't.

I only picked up a c-card because an increasing number of shops would not fill my tanks and the card was less expensive than a compressor.



Bob
---------------------------
I may be old, but I’m not dead yet.

Yep, it's all a conspiracy the by the LDS and PADI to get your money.

 

[halocline]

But no comment on people who struggled through a nitrox class, forgot it all soon afterward and then just "ride their computer"?

That's exactly what I said in my earlier post, that even in a nitrox class made up of exclusively DM candidates, several students didn't really understand the math or how to calculate equivalent air depth.

I think one main difference with nitrox certification is that it's all knowledge and no actual dive skill, so there's no reason at all that a motivated student could not acquire the same knowledge through self study. As to the idea that a class is necessary to adequately warn students of the dire consequences of O2 toxicity, I think that's a little shaky. (no pun intended about convulsions...) The same message can be easily conveyed in print or video materials.