Why the dislike of air integrated computers?

[boulderjohn]

Wait, is that how it's supposed to go? My check on the SPG simply consists of "enough", "turn soon", "ascend soon", "****.", and for the sake of me, I can't see why we'd need to memorize exactly how much there is. (not talking some technical diving, but even then I feel like "my way" would be good enough)

Is that what your SPG says? I am not familiar with that model. All the ones that we have in our shop give readings in increments of 100 PSI.

The standard calls for the student to know pressure within a few hundred PSI because of a recent SPG check. You may see it as rocket science, but so far my students have had the mental capacity to be able look at an SPG, see that it says about 1,800 PSI, and then be able to give a rough estimate of the current situation if asked about it 2-3 minutes later. You may be able to do it yourself. Give it a try. You might surprise yourself.

 

[Patoux01]

No, my SPG has increments (10 bar though).

I just don't see any use to remember it... I also don't think it's my buddy's job to ask me for my tank pressure at any time. I'll ask him when I get close to turning pressure, and if he asks me, I expect him to be close to turning pressure as well.

When having a new diver, I'll keep a closer eye on them, BUT I don't take a new diver on a dive deep enough that he'd get through his tank before I even ask him for his pressure, and I expect a diver to be trained well enough to know to tell the others when he's got N bar (with N being defined in the briefing), and to actually keep an eye on it so he knows before he reaches those N bars.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I like air integration now.

On the subject of SCUBA instruction. I spent three days diving and photographing at the BHB. Two of the days were excellent, not many people there. But, on the third day there were several classes there. I know for a fact one was an advanced class. They were all roto-tilling the bottom. They were also all, all, doing the PADI circle performing their skills, KNEELING on the bottom damaging the environment and killing everything they were kneeling all over. Yes, it is true, I have an agenda, skills should be performed mid water, and until such time as the student can do them mid water they should not pass the course. I have no idea, how many times, I have watched a diver go to ground on a coral reef to clear their masks. Divers are not the only thing impacting coral reef health, certainly, but in some places they are, IMO, the primary cause of reef damage.

N

OW courses and weighting/buoyancy control, now your hijacking the thread. But since you mentioned it, coral destruction and all, I'd like to tie Hoseless PDC in and bring it back around.

So, a while back I commented on a pic I saw with a diver about to destroy a coral tube with a dangling console that looked more like a brick on a rope, or maybe a wrecking ball...because that's exactly what it was about to become and the diver seemed completely oblivious to this fact.
One thing I can say about AI hoseless computers is it would mean the end of the dangling console "wrecking balls" that swing around bashing and smashing up delicate marine life. With just a screen on the wrist and no swinging hoses with bricks on the end it would really help people to clean up their act. The rototilling problem is another issue and deserves another dedicated thread.

 

[olphart]

Stuartv:

There are some on this forum with what I'd call a subculture of independence, with the view that you should always 'own your dive,' in the sense that even on guide-led tourist excursions you should be independently navigating, always know where you are, have rock bottom (or similar) gas calculations planned in your head, etc...



I learned to do this on the first dive off a liveaboard following an instabuddy. I tracked our headings for a while as we wandered around the reef, then got lazy and went off compass and paid little attention to our position relative to the boat. Dumb move...
After a while he turned and signalled, "Where's the boat?" to which I signalled back "DIIK! Kinda that way maybe?". Not a huge deal, given the conditions, but it meant that one of us had to "turtle navigate" to get a bearing.

Lesson learned cheaply. Since then I'm always either on the compass or keeping track of where I am, even with a group.

 

[luscioman]

So I have posted early on in this thread that I am pro AI. Yesterday I had a chance to go diving with my father which doesn't happen much. He has his own gear which he always gets serviced every year no matter how many dives he does. He uses an SPG, depth gauge and a on intergraded Oceanic Veo 100. So we did a 2 tank dive yesterday and had no issues on the first dive. So we geared up for the 2nd dive turned on our air and as we walked to the back of the boat to jump in "boom." I turn off his air and I walk him back to our seats. I gave him a set of fabers 100's with inserts so I thought an oring had gone bad. As I troubleshoot the problem I realize that his HP hose has a 2inch gash in it. I feel lucky that it happened when it did and not 3 mins later when we were on the dive. I always carry a Aeries Atmos AI in my bag and put it on his 1st stage. That Atmos has saved at least 3 dives for people over the last 2 years due to faulty hoses mainly.
So after thinking about what happened I realized that an SPG has 2 failure points one of them being the hose. Usually in a transmitter type of situation you don't have a hose so there is only one point.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

So I have posted early on in this thread that I am pro AI. Yesterday I had a chance to go diving with my father which doesn't happen much. He has his own gear which he always gets serviced every year no matter how many dives he does. He uses an SPG, depth gauge and a on intergraded Oceanic Veo 100. So we did a 2 tank dive yesterday and had no issues on the first dive. So we geared up for the 2nd dive turned on our air and as we walked to the back of the boat to jump in "boom." I turn off his air and I walk him back to our seats. I gave him a set of fabers 100's with inserts so I thought an oring had gone bad. As I troubleshoot the problem I realize that his HP hose has a 2inch gash in it. I feel lucky that it happened when it did and not 3 mins later when we were on the dive. I always carry a Aeries Atmos AI in my bag and put it on his 1st stage. That Atmos has saved at least 3 dives for people over the last 2 years due to faulty hoses mainly.
So after thinking about what happened I realized that an SPG has 2 failure points one of them being the hose. Usually in a transmitter type of situation you don't have a hose so there is only one point.

An SPG actually has three failure points that I can think of, however they are very rare. One would be the hose and connections, second would be the spool, and third would be the gauge itself either with a sticking needle possibly due to salt water getting in the line at some point, or flooding due to an edge crack in the glass or some other reason.

I've personally seen one HP hose blow. It sounded like a shotgun and was loud enough to make the Sheriff show up to the parking lot where we were gearing up.

 

[phoenix31tt]

By that logic we can really start to rack up the failure points on AI very quickly...


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[luscioman]

By that logic we can really start to rack up the failure points on AI very quickly...


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Probably but there has not been a case of a transmitter that has exploded that when under water could create an out of air emergency like that of a high pressure hose explosion.

 

[phoenix31tt]

Probably but there has not been a case of a transmitter that has exploded that when under water could create an out of air emergency like that of a high pressure hose explosion.

An hp hose explosion would not/should not? create an ooa emergency... And I wouldn't say "there has not been a case" prolly more accurate to say "I've never heard of a case"


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[dmoore19]

Then with that logic, neither should the failure of a transmitter.

If the transmitter quits or the hose blows, there is no emergency.

An hp hose explosion would not/should not? create an ooa emergency... And I wouldn't say "there has not been a case" prolly more accurate to say "I've never heard of a case"


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