Minimum training standard to start with a rebreather

[Dr. Lecter]

Having transitioned to CCR in the relatively recent past, I get where someone who says 'The sooner the better!' is coming from. Buoyancy is funamentally different and significantly more difficult on a CCR, and the earlier you start on one the less you'll be inclined to fall back on the OC experience of breath volume and timing to fine tune buoyancy. Having rapidly moved back into the same 100m+ diving I was doing on OC when I switched over, I get where all the cautions are coming from even more: CCR is to OC as space shuttle is to glider.

As already pointed out, rebreathers have many, many more failure points than OC and of their many failure modes there are plenty that can kill you without giving any indication there's a problem. They require greater attention to detail and more care in keeping and use than OC, with the penalties for laziness or simple oversight being a lot nastier than a bunch of bubbles and/or a non-functional OC gas delivery system. And honestly, while the slience and duration are awfully neat, OC is more fun to dive - compared to a CCR, an OC reg is an easy button for the simple act of underwater breathing at any depth and in any position. Plus, bailing out puts you right back on OC for what's likely to be a complicated and stressful ascent.

So, as between those two tensions, it's pretty obvious to me that the value of OC experience outweighs the buoyancy head-start early CCR might provide. Ideally, do OC tech through whatever extended range nitrox or normoxic trimix cert floats your boat and then decide to go CCR for stuff much past 130'.

Photogs wanting CCR for its silence might be an exception, but they'd better be willing to accept that they're putting up with all the PITA and risks of a CCR for dives they could otherwise do on the blessed simplicty of an AL80...just to avoid scaring their subjects. Something that's good for basically nothing but gas extension and wasting several thousand dollars, like an Explorer...is probably a good compromise for someone like that.

 

[kenny kustom]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
My dives are longer, I'm warmer, and my mouth isn't dry.
It's my " several thousand dollars" and I spent it where I chose to.
I love the explorer.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

Sorry, I just couldn't resist In all seriousness, I can see why someone would get one if they really thought they needed a RB for NDL only diving...I just can't fathom what would cause anyone to do that because I hate the burdens and limts of CCR so much that better deep diving is the only reason I own one. To each their own, of course.

 

[kenny kustom]

Hey.
I also just bought a new travel trailer and 3/4 ton diesel.

You guys will proboly bitch, that I could have went camping in a tent, just as easy.

---------- Post added October 1st, 2014 at 07:40 PM ----------

Sorry, I just couldn't resist In all seriousness, I can see why someone would get one if they really thought they needed a RB for NDL only diving...I just can't fathom what would cause anyone to do that because I hate the burdens and limts of CCR so much that better deep diving is the only reason I own one. To each their own, of course.

All my local diving is less than 100'.
I'm cursed, living in the middle of canada. My diving is limited.
In my own situation, it is perfect.
If I lived in Florida, I would proboly be doing caves in sidemount.

 

[PfcAJ]

I can't recall a time I was limited by gas diving a single tank. It's always NDL.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

I can't recall a time I was limited by gas diving a single tank. It's always NDL.

I'll make the charitable assumption that what rec RB divers mean when they say "longer" dives is that they do a lot of multilevel and would benefit in terms of NDL from a fixed pO2...though that requires an actual CCR rather than a SCR like the Explorer, so the complexity goes up. Maybe they really just mean they like getting huge runtimes out of a smaller unit than the big tank they'd need for the same dive on OC...whatever works for them I guess.

 

[hroark2112]

I dive a CCR because I like it. I enjoy the quiet, the ability to be the first one in on a dive and the last one out, the reduced deco, the warm moist air, and overall the experience of diving a rebreather.

If anyone doesn't like it, that's a "you" problem...not a "me" problem. Sorry for your problem!!

 

[tstormdiver]

Full trimix in my neck of the woods. And I fully agree with it.

I am also trying to figure out the Trimix requirement that some say should be. I can understand it for using Trimix as the diluent, but for simple air diluent???? For me, right now, Trimix does not make much sense. I am quite land locked in KY & there are not really any dive sites deep enough to warrant the use trimix, within a reasonable drive. I teach Nitrox frequently & I teach it well beyond the books & understand it very well. What is a rebreather???? A Nitrox mixing machine on your back.... Would not a thorough understanding of Nitrox be enough to safely dive one using air as a diluent? I got my rebreather to enhance my cave diving, extend bottom times & be able to explore more, not so much the depths that would require Trimix. Trimix is likely down the road for me,..... but right now it is not feasible.

When I started on my Prism2, I had nearly 900 OC dives (nearly 200 of those, full cave). When I got the unit in Dec of 2012, I spent nearly 40 hrs in the pool during the winter, just getting familiar with it. I had over 10 hrs of Open water dives before being turned loose as an air diluent diver. Since I work part time at my LDS, my instructor constantly grills me on scenarios & "what ifs" to see how I analyze a problem & solve it. When we dive together, he still puts me through my paces with skills. Several times during my training, I had to break my unit down & rebuild it, I am now VERY familiar with it & how it works. I have learned to troubleshoot problems on it & how to correct it or if not, to get the heck off the loop. I just recently completed the required hours to begin my CCR Cave training on it & plan to begin the training later this month.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

Strictly DIR-approach divers react to choosing CCR for dives you "could do" with BM doubles/stages/deco bottles in 3...2...1...action

 

[PfcAJ]

I am also trying to figure out the Trimix requirement that some say should be. I can understand it for using Trimix as the diluent, but for simple air diluent???? For me, right now, Trimix does not make much sense. I am quite land locked in KY & there are not really any dive sites deep enough to warrant the use trimix, within a reasonable drive. I teach Nitrox frequently & I teach it well beyond the books & understand it very well. What is a rebreather???? A Nitrox mixing machine on your back.... Would not a thorough understanding of Nitrox be enough to safely dive one using air as a diluent? I got my rebreather to enhance my cave diving, extend bottom times & be able to explore more, not so much the depths that would require Trimix. Trimix is likely down the road for me,..... but right now it is not feasible.

When I started on my Prism2, I had nearly 900 OC dives (nearly 200 of those, full cave). When I got the unit in Dec of 2012, I spent nearly 40 hrs in the pool during the winter, just getting familiar with it. I had over 10 hrs of Open water dives before being turned loose as an air diluent diver. Since I work part time at my LDS, my instructor constantly grills me on scenarios & "what ifs" to see how I analyze a problem & solve it. When we dive together, he still puts me through my paces with skills. Several times during my training, I had to break my unit down & rebuild it, I am now VERY familiar with it & how it works. I have learned to troubleshoot problems on it & how to correct it or if not, to get the heck off the loop. I just recently completed the required hours to begin my CCR Cave training on it & plan to begin the training later this month.

I'd argue that those dives are best done on OC.

Lets be real, you can see virtually all of Peacock on a single stage and backgas (to include the deep bits). Same with pretty much all the 'usual suspects' out there as far as caves go.

I'll forgo the "could do's" and sub it with "have dones" Dr Lecter

Deep stuff, okay, fine, I'll play along. But shallow nitrox stuff? Nah, doesn't make sense to introduce all the RB shenanigans for such a simple dive.