New diver having trouble with the back plate wing BCD my instructor sold me.

[dfx]

You're really just making up nonsensical objections at this point.

Have you ever been in a dive shop where a diver came running in wearing a wetsuit, mask, fins, and carrying a scuba cylinder pleading with the owner "Quick - I need a BCD immediately! If I can't don it here in the store right now and get in the water within 60 seconds I'm going to die!"

You obviously still don't understand. In how many ways can a jacket BCD be adjusted? It has what, 3 straps that you can pull on? 4 if you count the cummerbund. You pull them tight and that's it. Other than that, either it fits or it doesn't. In how many ways can a BP/W be adjusted and customized? Hundreds? Several thousand? Millions? And don't even try to downplay this, because this is one of the strengths, if not the main strength, of the BP/W system that people continuously propagate. It's customizable, adjustable and replaceable to no end. And that's what makes it more complicated.

 

[cool_hardware52]

You obviously still don't understand. In how many ways can a jacket BCD be adjusted? It has what, 3 straps that you can pull on? 4 if you count the cummerbund. You pull them tight and that's it. Other than that, either it fits or it doesn't. In how many ways can a BP/W be adjusted and customized? Hundreds? Several thousand? Millions? And don't even try to downplay this, because this is one of the strengths, if not the main strength, of the BP/W system that people continuously propagate. It's customizable, adjustable and replaceable to no end. And that's what makes it more complicated.

My laced tennis shoes are *more complicated* than my slippers, however figuring our either one is not much task loading…...

Tobin

 

[doctormike]

You obviously still don't understand. In how many ways can a jacket BCD be adjusted? It has what, 3 straps that you can pull on? 4 if you count the cummerbund. You pull them tight and that's it. Other than that, either it fits or it doesn't. In how many ways can a BP/W be adjusted and customized? Hundreds? Several thousand? Millions? And don't even try to downplay this, because this is one of the strengths, if not the main strength, of the BP/W system that people continuously propagate. It's customizable, adjustable and replaceable to no end. And that's what makes it more complicated.

It's adjustable the same way that a custom suit is adjustable. So once it fits, you don't need to adjust it.

I agree, the BP/W does give you a lot of choices in terms of exactly how you want it set up. However, you don't need to make them all at the time of purchase, like you do when you buy a jacket BC. With a jacket BC, you pick one and whatever it has in terms of D-rings, pockets, weigh systems, wing, etc... that's what it will always be, for as long as you own it. If you decide you want anything different in the future, you just have to buy another jacket BC.

 

[phoenix31tt]

My wife was diving her wing for the first time recently... it came pre-assembled from UDM Aquatics all we had to do was dial in the sizing which took all of 5 mins to be dive ready.

During her dives she said "this feels a little tight when i'm putting my hand in", no problemos, issue resolved in about 10 sec by adjusting the shoulder strap.

Thing is once that webbing is and crotch strap installed adjusting fit for a BP/W seems easier/quicker than a BCD. There are so man things to pull on a bcd sometimes people get confused. I've been on the boat alot with my instructor while he was training new students. His method of training sometimes is to let people figure out some stuff on their own, i've seen students struggling to get BCDs on.

 

[RJP]

You obviously still don't understand. In how many ways can a jacket BCD be adjusted? It has what, 3 straps that you can pull on? 4 if you count the cummerbund. You pull them tight and that's it. Other than that, either it fits or it doesn't. In how many ways can a BP/W be adjusted and customized? Hundreds? Several thousand? Millions? And don't even try to downplay this, because this is one of the strengths, if not the main strength, of the BP/W system that people continuously propagate. It's customizable, adjustable and replaceable to no end. And that's what makes it more complicated.

What is your actual experience diving a BP/W? Based on your comments it can't be much, if any.

 

[Ayisha]

The only people who seem to suggest that a BP/W is "too confusing" for OW students don't seem to have any actual experience with OW students diving in a BP/W.

Or perhaps any experience with a bp/w at all.

...So now instead of non-divers, take 10 newly certified divers. Show them jacket BCD's on the wall sizes small medium large and an un assembled BP/W. Which do you think they could get an adequate fit in a short time frame ?

First of all, why do the bp/w's need to be un-assembled? Many dive shops have some assembled already. How much or little you adjust it is up to you. Many shops also include the fitting with the purchase. Mine certainly did. Mine was also assembled before I ever bought it.

Having said that, I'm not technically inclined whatsoever but can easily disassemble my bp/w and put it back together again very easily. It's 2 bolts holding it together. Big deal.

Regarding your quick adequate fitting question, consider the Halcyon Infinity bp/w, although it's certainly not necessary. It adjusts simply by pulling the shoulder webbing or the waist strap. Even easier to quick-fit it than a non-bp/w, isn't it?

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Give me five minutes and I can fit one to someone. Most of my customers enjoying assembling their own. Gives them a sense of accomplishment and confidence. Structure classes correctly and they can do it themselves in a few minutes. I've seen people look at rangers and knighthawks and be thoroughly intimidated. Some jackets are a confusing conglomeration of buckles, straps, releases, etc.

 

[Rusty Roo]

quite the opposite... i could state multiple reasons why you should not go vertical to vent and worse during an uncontrolled ascent:

1. Going vertical makes it worse because now your fins are below you and since finning will not be perfect at this stage you are likely going to be finning yourself up

2. Staying horizontal or slightly head down while finning back down arrests your uncontrolled ascent (and to me that's just common sense, i wasn't thought that). While in this position it's very easy to pull the rear dump valve to release excess air.

3. Uncontrolled ascents cause people to panic, it is very easy to add more air into your bc rather than purge when using the hose to vent

as a matter of fact i think teaching people to go vertical and vent air can be a dangerous practice especially for reasons listed above... every-time I've seen an uncontrolled ascent it got worse when the person went vertical...

I can see your point but i think it lacks real world application.

1st, what if you're doing say protea bank baited dives where you're instructed to stay vertical. you would vent horizontally.

2nd what if you're doing a swim through where you're swimming up and have to be vertical, for example in gozo good swim through but will bring up about 5 metres. you need to vent whilst swimming up.

 

[phoenix31tt]

I can see your point but i think it lacks real world application.

1st, what if you're doing say protea bank baited dives where you're instructed to stay vertical. you would vent horizontally.

2nd what if you're doing a swim through where you're swimming up and have to be vertical, for example in gozo good swim through but will bring up about 5 metres. you need to vent whilst swimming up.

Point 1. U should already be negative or neutral so no need to vent there

Agreed at point 2. Although for me 5 meters change in depth I wouldn't need to vent during the ascent... If after I reach the top and realise I'm a little positive then I'll vent. But it's all up to how much air is in the bc to begin with


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MrsP]

Hi Mike! In fact I dove the next day and had a much better time. I did get heads-up vertical to dump air a few times when I was deep enough but I also used the lower valve (that really is on my left, how embarrassing, I'm glad my husband is not on this board). I'm quite sure that it is the Dive Rite recreational wing. I'm a nervous new diver at the age of 53, my husband and 18 year old son have been diving for 5 years and I trained this past spring with our 15 year old. The 15 year old has no problem with the wing or with anything else related to diving for that matter. Me, I suffered a barrotrauma to my ears in March from my confined water work and took some time off to recover. I finished my open water on my 29th wedding anniversary and left for our vacation in Grand Turk the next day. It was all so worth it to be on GT again. This is my first time as a diver. I loved diving around the coral heads with sandy bottom around them but the wall with the abyss was scaring me. It helped me to watch our depth on my dive computer as a cue to add or dump air.

I posted my question on our second-to-last diving day when I would get heads-up vertical, with my left are stretched up and not even a bubble emitting. But the next day after posting things went much better, perhaps because I spent hours reading about the issue that evening. Now I want to keep my skills fresh, and being land locked in middle Georgia, it will probably have to be in my dive shop's pool. I don't know if I will ever lose that feeling of imminent doom when I have all that weight on me and I'm about to roll in, but in a place like GT with my family with me and good DMs, diving really is sublime.

---------- Post added July 9th, 2015 at 08:09 PM ----------

Phil,

I had a lot of fun the next day and do feel that I want to continue with my recreational wing. I will experiment more with weight, that was my first saltwater experience and I'm thinking perhaps I was under weighted. I would put in what the DM gave me and they were aware of the weight from the back plate but maybe you are right, I needed more. I wish I was still on the island to try!