Small Double's Kit

[ianr33]

I used to dive double 80's all the time in a wetsuit and single bladder wing. Easy enough to swim them up in the event of a wing failure. Worst case shoot a bag and wind yourself up the line.

KISS !

 

[AndyNZ]

The only issue im fighting with now is,
why have two tanks if i only have a single bladder wing.....To be true redundancy,
i need a smallish dual bladder wing.

No, if you've got a properly balanced rig then dual bladder is not needed - they cause more problems than they solve.

For example, just say your wing starts to inflate whilst on a dive - which inflator do you disconnect? Maybe you'll decide that to prevent any confusion, you'll dive with the secondary disconnected - then at depth, you'll need to be able to connect that whilst still controlling you buoyancy. Not that easy if you've just had some form of manifold failure that means you've lost primary inflation.

Buy a drysuit. Perhaps you can get one that has a gold lamé outer?

Do some maths. Work out how much air you will need to make a safe, controlled ascent from 50'... it obviously depends on how much you breathe, but you'll probably find that a 19 cu ft pony is more than enough.

If you are solo diving, and really worried about equipment failure leading to catastrophic gas loss - dive sidemount. Manifolded twin are fine, but you need to be 110% confident that you can identify and resolve equipment failures that are occuring behind your head that you cannot see. If you are seriously thinking that mounting your tanks upside down is an option, my guess is that you will not have the the ability to resolve issues that you cannot see, or invest the time to practice.

With sidemount, you can see everything, all parts of the regulators, the tanks, the hoses - and it's all in reach. Makes problem identification and resolution a lot easier.

Standard scuba gear and 19 cu ft pony is a lot easier and quicker, though.

 

[Scubabill]

No, if you've got a properly balanced rig then dual bladder is not needed - they cause more problems than they solve.

For example, just say your wing starts to inflate whilst on a dive - which inflator do you disconnect? Maybe you'll decide that to prevent any confusion, you'll dive with the secondary disconnected - then at depth, you'll need to be able to connect that whilst still controlling you buoyancy. Not that easy if you've just had some form of manifold failure that means you've lost primary inflation.

Buy a drysuit. Perhaps you can get one that has a gold lamé outer?

Do some maths. Work out how much air you will need to make a safe, controlled ascent from 50'... it obviously depends on how much you breathe, but you'll probably find that a 19 cu ft pony is more than enough.

If you are solo diving, and really worried about equipment failure leading to catastrophic gas loss - dive sidemount. Manifolded twin are fine, but you need to be 110% confident that you can identify and resolve equipment failures that are occuring behind your head that you cannot see. If you are seriously thinking that mounting your tanks upside down is an option, my guess is that you will not have the the ability to resolve issues that you cannot see, or invest the time to practice.

With sidemount, you can see everything, all parts of the regulators, the tanks, the hoses - and it's all in reach. Makes problem identification and resolution a lot easier.

Standard scuba gear and 19 cu ft pony is a lot easier and quicker, though.

Thanks for the reply, and good advise. What the heck is a Gold lame' outer?
Is that like suggesting a hot pink wet suit, with scruffy DOG lining?
We dont use DOG hide in the US, only seen that were they love teams like the blacks!
LOL
Yea im jelious, i would love to spend about a year or more in New Zealand! I scuba dive obviolsy, and i also FLY fish for wild trout allot in
Central PA, on lime stone springs. I hear the fly fishing in your neck of the woods is unreal!

 

[Nemrod]

Thanks for the chart newbie! LOL J/K (im sure you knew that the first time)
you just gave me the tank i'm going to use.
Did not know that OMS has a 5.5" 50 LP +
SO there we have it, 25" long 5.5" wide -1. empty
and with a GOOD FILL around 3000psi ech
im over a 100 in capacity, with redundancy for shallow solo stuff,
And for deeper stuff with a buddy only, i can sling a 15-20 tank for emergency
use.
Thanks again.

Vertex *Signature* Series Just did some checking, and this a a 30# doubles wings
wish it was 20# but might work......oxycheq

You are welcome, I knew you were just pulling my string and took it as such. I did not know if you had that useful chart link so I provided it to you, it is good for all sorts of comparisons.

I like mini doubles and do dive them, I am not sure they are minimalist or lighter than a single but they often balance superbly and are lower profile and if you must have redundancy (please--not the pony thread) for whatever reason that may be a good route.

Good luck with you quest, pop a pic up sometime with the finished product.

I don't have as many dives as God, I don't get to dive as much as I used to as my career choices have taken me temporarily far from good diving habitat but making money is important because various people depend upon me to give them lot's of money and they are ultimately more important to me than scuba diving. But make no mistake, by almost any standard, I have done a lot of scuba diving and am thankful for having been able to have done so and hope to do a lot more yet.

N

 

[DaleC]

Here's my 2CW.

It's got that "no one else is diving this rig" look and is about as light weight as they come.

 

[Scubabill]

You are welcome, I knew you were just pulling my string and took it as such. I did not know if you had that useful chart link so I provided it to you, it is good for all sorts of comparisons.

I like mini doubles and do dive them, I am not sure they are minimalist or lighter than a single but they often balance superbly and are lower profile and if you must have redundancy (please--not the pony thread) for whatever reason that may be a good route.

Good luck with you quest, pop a pic up sometime with the finished product.

N

I would value your opinion on mounting these upside down, compared to
a regular mount style?

Less getting into the set, and taking it off, i see no real reason not to mount them facing down, you have a cleaner front edge (little less drag) with the proper DESIGN, you have the valves right at your hips (or close) for easy reaching. You take
the worry of knocking the regs/manifolds which in a rare case could lead to a two tank loss of air. I have a few people tell me no to mounting these upside down, but no real reasons why i shouldn't. I dont put much weight into because Joe Blow's dive shop
tells me its not right. We all know Joe Blow is just trying to market a semi proprietary equipment line!

 

[Scubabill]

Here's my 2CW.

It's got that "no one else is diving this rig" look and is about as light weight as they come.

That rig is just interesting. And thanks for posting it up. Not sure i understand much about it to be 100% honest.
But i think im 99.9% set on a double tank setup, for the
benefit of having two tanks for shallow solo diving. Then i can, with a sling/buddy,
dive deeper waters without changing up the rig to much. (within reason on deeper of course)


SO here is what i got so far. (not much but a start)

OMS 50 LP tanks x2
MK19/250v x2 (went with SP for the swirly torrent!) like the Apeks also.
I need a source for buying mk19's shipped to the US.....?????? ANYONE?
Alum/plastic back plate (don't feel i need the extra weight as the tanks= -3 lbs empty)
Typical 1 piece webbing with 1 good quality shoulder clip.....GASP!
2 ditchable weights in the smallest low profile pockets i can attach to the waist strap
1 Brass with glass front tank Pressure gauge. No plastic boot.

 

[Nemrod]

I would value your opinion on mounting these upside down, compared to
a regular mount style?

Less getting into the set, and taking it off, i see no real reason not to mount them facing down, you have a cleaner front edge (little less drag) with the proper DESIGN, you have the valves right at your hips (or close) for easy reaching. You take
the worry of knocking the regs/manifolds which in a rare case could lead to a two tank loss of air. I have a few people tell me no to mounting these upside down, but no real reasons why i shouldn't. I dont put much weight into because Joe Blow's dive shop
tells me its not right. We all know Joe Blow is just trying to market a semi proprietary equipment line!

As much as I go on about dogma I am guilty of it also. Long ago I tried mounting tanks upside down as a set of independent double 72s because I saw an older and wiser and more knowledgeable diver doing it I figured it must be a good thing. Because it is required to switch regs/tanks to balance your air (gas) as the dive progresses it made sense to me to go upside down. We were trying to figure out how to get in and out of caves alive. This was circa 1972ish and the highly developed methods of today's cave divers had not yet been developed, much equipment was homemade as well. With today's compact isolation manifolds I just don't see a real justification for going with the valve down set up but I am not totally against it either, especially if you were doing independents. Like the side mount thing outside of caving, I understand it but for regular sport diving in open water I just don't see the advantage but there are people who dive side mount in open water and they are not wrong and neither are upside down tank rigging--but why do you really want to do it? I think get a good isolation valve, a 200 bar unit maybe, with yoke inserts (your choice) and try that first, valves up. I don't know if that explains my thoughts on it or not but I tried.

BTW, I don't have a link but there are narrow isolation manifolds--closer c/c spacing for small tanks.
N

 

[Scubabill]

As much as I go on about dogma I am guilty of it also. Long ago I tried mounting tanks upside down as a set of independent double 72s because I saw an older and wiser and more knowledgeable diver doing it I figured it must be a good thing. Because it is required to switch regs/tanks to balance your air (gas) as the dive progresses it made sense to me to go upside down. We were trying to figure out how to get in and out of caves alive. This was circa 1972ish and the highly developed methods of today's cave divers had not yet been developed, much equipment was homemade as well. With today's compact isolation manifolds I just don't see a real justification for going with the valve down set up but I am not totally against it either, especially if you were doing independents. Like the side mount thing outside of caving, I understand it but for regular sport diving in open water I just don't see the advantage but there are people who dive side mount in open water and they are not wrong and neither are upside down tank rigging--but why do you really want to do it? I think get a good isolation valve, a 200 bar unit maybe, with yoke inserts (your choice) and try that first. I don't know if that explains my thoughts on it or not but I tried.

BTW, I don't have a link but there are narrow isolation manifolds--closer c/c spacing for small tanks.
N

Ok fair enough, ill mount them right side up. You and a few others agree on that.
I'm going to search out the narrow isolation manifolds. And when the rig is done,
i'm a photog nut, so pics will be big, clear, and many! :cool2:

 

[captain]

I would value your opinion on mounting these upside down, compared to
a regular mount style?

Less getting into the set, and taking it off, i see no real reason not to mount them facing down, you have a cleaner front edge (little less drag) with the proper DESIGN, you have the valves right at your hips (or close) for easy reaching. You take
the worry of knocking the regs/manifolds which in a rare case could lead to a two tank loss of air. I have a few people tell me no to mounting these upside down, but no real reasons why i shouldn't. I dont put much weight into because Joe Blow's dive shop
tells me its not right. We all know Joe Blow is just trying to market a semi proprietary equipment line!

Here is my configuration I would use if I were to step out of the envelope. Triple 40's one mounted upside down with the valve at the right hip. All connected by 1/4" stainless tubing and fitting. The valves would have to be drilled and threaded to accept the SS tube fittings. 80 cu/ft with 40 cu/ft kept isolated. Run the first two empty, open the third and call the dive. You could still stand the rig up right on two cylinders.