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Stop the Sea Shepherd

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I'm still awaiting any facts (or even educated guesses) that the number of whales the Japanese take are not a sustainable number of Minke whales
BTW .. H2O 70's Norwegian Minke graph shows the Norwegian quota, not a population "observation"
 
Two weeks ago I saw three episodes of Whale Wars. This was the first that I had sat down and watched the show. I came away with a few impressions that I found disturbing and depressing.

1) Watson is doing more harm than good.

I don't agree with harvesting any animal when it is unsustainable. Period. And I have no problem harvesting animals from populations that can support it. I support many environmental causes. But what I saw was a prime example of how environmentalists are given a bad name.

Like it or not, there is a stereotype of environmentalists, and it is one that the general public finds easy to dismiss - hippy / smelly / overzealous / irrational / hemp wearing / etc. While I believe that the SS is drawing attention to the 'research' harvest of whales, I also believe that he and his crew are furthing the env stereotype. The way they conducted meetings, planning sessions, etc along with the crew getting blitzed having a cabin crawl made me think of the unprofessional unfocused environmentalists I have met and worked with that turn mainstream people away from a cause.

Yes, awareness of a problem is worth something. Raising the public consciousness about an issue like illegal whaling is admirable. The methods used by Watson and the SS are criminal and negligent at worst and repulsively stereotypical at best.

We are having a debate and more people are talking about it, but it is a common theme to hear non-environmentalists, pro-environmentalists, and environmentalists alike describe the SS as a bunch of wahoos. Their actions, demeanor, exagerrated storytelling, and the like are hard for anyone other than a fringe group to understand. That group was already supporting them. Anyone who watches and is undecided is forced to see a raw form of the stereotype brought to life. It sickens me to know that many are pushed away from being more active/supportive in anything environmental because of the SS.

2) Watson shouldn't be the captain of a rubber ducky in his bathtub.

In the few short hours of WW that I watched, I couldn't believe the level of incompetence shown. I saw a ship not rated for ice poorly navigating into waters with iceburgs have to back up (and risk getting stranded by breaking props) because the hull couldn't take more impacts with the ice. On top of that I saw the 'captain' order the two newest volunteer 'crew members' to go into the lowest holds of the ship armed with ....(couldn't really tell if they had any equipment, certainly looked scared as though they had NO training and NO experience) ... to not let the water get in. Yes, to not let the water get in from the ICEBURGS that were pushing in the hull from incompetent decisions.

After that I saw them launch a smaller boat in such a way that you wondered if anyone had common sense. They even said to the camera 'we only got to practise this a little, and it was calm then'........ Totally unsafe.

When the launched boat finally got in the water, they could not perform simple navigation and headed in the wrong direction. Some crew members on board thought this was funny (remember the hippy irrational unprofessional stereotype that I mentioned was being reinforced...).

When the launched boat stopped communicating w/ the SS, the SS did not react. It did not alter course, and crew members started to either cry or pontificate that everyone was willing to die for a whale. Again, this level of ridiculousness can't help but raise the awareness of how incompetent the 'hippy enviro wackos' are to the mainstream. I actually yelled at the tv screen - 'you friggin @#%&^, call the launched boat back when they are clueless and lost, and at the very least alter your course to rescue them from icy waters after the likely capsize their boat in miserable conditions'. Sarcasm - glad they are brining attention to their cause........

Yes, Watson and the SS are 'gaining awareness', but I think the price is ultimately being paid by those who productively work on environmental issues.
 
Watson has been doing this for years, he gets lots of personal publicity but his actions haven't changed anything.

Except his bank account...I bet he doesn't work for free :wink: I am sure there are a lot of "couch" activists that dump $$ into his account.
 
I'm still awaiting any facts (or even educated guesses) that the number of whales the Japanese take are not a sustainable number of Minke whales
BTW .. H2O 70's Norwegian Minke graph shows the Norwegian quota, not a population "observation"

Whether it is the Norwegians, the Japanese, the Russians who are harvesting whales is irrelevant.

That graph shows their quotas of harvest. I'm sure there is a positive correlation between their quotas and availability. They are not idiots and don't want to cut off their nose to spite their face. If you actually look you will see that there are two lines that form after the mid 90's. One is quotas and one is actual. The actual is less than the quota. Why? Because there are fewer friggin whales to hunt.

So you want data showing that the amount of whales that the Japanese fleets harvest is not sustainable?
 
I must admit I have mixed feelings about hunting whales and the actions of those to trying and promote and stop it. I'm not adverse to anything being harvested/farmed so long as it can be 1.) sustainably managed, and, 2.) killed humanely.


The Japanese are not the only country that hunts whales.

They are also not the only ones to thumb their nose at the general view of the world of which they claim to be a part. I was disappointed to read this.
Canadian MPs to tuck into seal dinner

I could be wrong, but to my knowledge seals are killed by smashing them over the head with a bat.

Whether it is the Norwegians, the Japanese, the Russians who are harvesting whales is irrelevant.

That graph shows their quotas of harvest. I'm sure there is a positive correlation between their quotas and availability. They are not idiots and don't want to cut off their nose to spite their face. If you actually look you will see that there are two lines that form after the mid 90's. One is quotas and one is actual. The actual is less than the quota. Why? Because there are fewer friggin whales to hunt.

So you want data showing that the amount of whales that the Japanese fleets harvest is not sustainable?

I'm not sure I'd put too much faith in that. If there's money to be made people will hunt anything until they are either forced to stop/reduce or there are none left. This is why there is the current concern for tuna stocks.
 
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I'm not sure I'd put to much faith in that. If there's money to be made people will hunt anything until they are either forced to stop/reduce or there are none left. This is why there is the current concern for tuna stocks.

You're probably right.

Tuna. Here in the US at least, it seems that a lot of folks aren't really aware of the Tuna situation.
 
1. if the sea shepherd people were fully committed they'd sink the ships; ramming the whalers and throwing bottles is like having sex with your clothes on: entertaining, but totally useless.

2. the whalers should retaliate with equal or greater actions

drop the gloves, take off the helmet, and get it over with

SEAN
 
I could be wrong, but to my knowledge seals are killed by smashing them over the head with a bat.

Believe it or not...its extremely quick. That said, most of the hunting is done with firearms.


BTW...Roo taste way better then seal!:eyebrow:

That's all I will say about that topic...dont wanna start a hijacking.:wink:
 
Whether it is the Norwegians, the Japanese, the Russians who are harvesting whales is irrelevant.

That graph shows their quotas of harvest. I'm sure there is a positive correlation between their quotas and availability. They are not idiots and don't want to cut off their nose to spite their face. If you actually look you will see that there are two lines that form after the mid 90's. One is quotas and one is actual. The actual is less than the quota. Why? Because there are fewer friggin whales to hunt.

So you want data showing that the amount of whales that the Japanese fleets harvest is not sustainable?
I don't know that
.. quotas are not populations ... just because you are "sure" that there is a correlation, doesn't make one

Do you have any data that suggests that the number Japan is taking is not a sustainable number?
 
Do you have any data that suggests that the number Japan is taking is not a sustainable number?


I think the problem I have with this question, is my assumption that nobody has numbers that Japan supports what Japan is actually taking. Who owns the responsibility of providing evidence of sustainability? I would like to think that it is the responsibility of the hunter but that may be because I am not very trusting of their morals and ethics (assuming they have any).
 

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