Very confused on BP/W - requesting help for the newbie

[gcbryan]

Interesting. I was not aware of this. I have always tighten my jacket BC as tight as it can go and felt comfortable doing it. There will be adjustment period for me if it isn't worn tightly.

Given my herniated disc I'm aiming to keep as much lead off me as possible. A SS plate and no padding may very well be my best option even though neither were part of my original considerations.

Just a couple of points. The BP is wide and distributes the weight evenly so this is the reason why you probably won't feel the need for padding even with no exposure suit. Just something to try out of course.

I have a herniated disc as well. The answer there is just to strength your core muscles so that they are protecting your spine and of course just being sure to have proper form when you do lift something. Getting into a boat with your gear on is more about leaning forward and balancing the weight and not letting it affect your spine. Getting weight off the weight belt was a big benefit to me with a 5 lb ss plate (along with steel tanks).

When DevonDiver says that the shoulder straps aren't worn tightly that's because after you have the gear on the weight of the tank tightens the shoulder strap by dropping down. Then you tighten the crotch strap which keeps the tank in place. So it's basically the crotch strap that allows the shoulder strap to not have to be as tight when you are getting into the gear as is the case with a non-BP/W BC.

 

[CardShark]

>>> So do you sport the traditional HOG harness that has been discussed in this thread? Or a different brand? Thanks for the heads up on the Golem QR, I'll look it up.

My BP/W is classically Hogarthian :

Ultimate Hogarthian System - Dive Gear Express , other than the left-side QR.

As Sea Ledford mentioned, I installed the QR on the part of the strap that runs between your waist and where the chest d-ring traditionally goes (right over your ribs). Having it there, I can reach it with either hand.

 

[Rascally Rabbit]

Sloeber
Since you asked and rather than have others put words in my mouth I'll speak to you here directly.
First I'll tell you I am also a DM headed toward OWSI later this year. I've been diving a BP&W for 3 years. I do dive a deluxe harness with releases although without a backpad. I use a weight belt instead of dumpable harness pockets. I have however considered them for teaching although I prefer to use the belt to offset wetsuit buoyancy separately from overall kit buoyancy.
When I read your original post I thought to myself that you had a very good grasp of what you wanted your rig to be configured for. (teaching) Although there isn't a requirement that your gear be exactly the same as your students it is best that it be more similar than different. DD has been quoted many times on these forums as preferring to teach even OW students in HOG style rigs and although there is nothing wrong with that in itself you will find that most diveshops and instructors do not support that and most students are taught in jacket BCD.

With that in mind we can configure a BP&W to be more similar to the jacket BCD without effecting it's performance under water. Doing this would add the quick releases and dumpable weight to the harness. With these added you can teach students who have these items included in their jackets and when you don't need to teach ignore these items or remove them. I generally ignore my releases unless I surface in rough water in which case I opt to use a shoulder release to slide out of my kit in the easiest possible way. They also come in handy when playing rescue dummy for a rescue divers class.

So what do you lose by having these items? Besides extra cost you will have the extra failure points of releases. These extra failure points have been incorporated into every jacket style BCD you've used for years without problems. In fact the releases very rarely fail unless not taken care of, improperly or incompletely snapped together or having a tank dropped on them. The ones used on most of the deluxe harnesses are even heavier duty than those used on the average jacket BCD. Even if they were to fail a properly stocked save a dive kit could make short work of the repair if you have the foresight to add in replacements. Having these items will only limit your diving if you become involved in a specialized aspect of diving which require a specialized configuration and does not allow these items. Even without considering similarity for teaching there are reasons why some divers opt for releases. Some divers consider them a safety consideration to remove a kit in rough water or during a rescue.

Maybe some of those commenting on this thread have lost sight of dealing with vacation divers and average open water students. Maybe some are only considering what they consider an optimized kit without regard for the constraints of an OWSI. Again I thought your original post was highly insightful to your needs and showed you have a good grasp of what you will be using it for.

As other have stated extra padding isn't really needed and has negative effects on buoyancy. I've found that I prefer a shortie even in tropical waters and that is all the padding I need. YMMV.

For light weight travel I would suggest an aluminum backplate. I actually have both AL and SS to cover all my needs but if I were to be restrained to only 1 it would be AL first since you can add weight to it in many ways but can't easily remove weight from an SS plate.

 

[Sloeber]

First, I want to thank everyone who has participated in this thread. I can now search online, or walk into a retail outlet, and confidently know what I'm looking at and how it relates to my goals and the final package. Questions do remain, but they are much more specific, in regards to which item works better than another in a specific application.

Rabbit, thanks for re-posting to the thread with some additional thoughts. I think we are mostly on the same page. My understanding is for a BP/W, it can be modified to any way a particular diver likes. D rings anywhere, as many as they like, bags, clips, etc all added as one desires. And if you don't like it or you messed up, replace the cheap webbing and start from scratch. Given that, I don't see any reason to not at least try out the QR on my left shoulder. I will likely invest in the ditchable weight pouches and, as you said, simply remove them when I do not wish to use or demonstrate them. It sounds to me that is a large part of the beauty of a BP/W - the flexibility.

So again, thanks to all.

 

[Sloeber]

Apologies for bumping an old thread, but I wanted to circle back and share my experience with those of you who offered advice.

I drove up to Chicago and walked into Dive Right In Scuba on the southwest side. I was assisted at the store by a helpful employee who gave solid answers to all my questions. Having experience in sales I can easily read when an associate is reciting company lines. This guy wasn't, and it was appreciated. I completed my entire kit on my visit. It consits of:

Hollis SS Back Plate
- I liked the corners bent out. When fitted alongside BP without bent corners I could feel the difference. A few extra bucks but worth it so I never think, "boy I wish I didn't feel that corner diggin' in."

Hollis Elite 2 Harness
- With my broken clavicle I wanted some padding over the broken bone area. I figure I can always remove the padding from the far side if desired, but that doesn;t seem like it'll be the case.
- I like a tight-fitting rig. I like being able to cinch down my shoulder straps. The hiker in me loves a sternum strap.
- Quck-release will/does make it easy for me to exit my gear in water. Also for demonstration to (hopeful) future students.
- If I ever out-grow this rig and wanna ride without a quick-release or sternum strap, it's an inexpensive upgrade of nothing more than webbing.

Pair of Trident Tank Straps
- Liked the idea of the application/removal without lifting unit up and over air tank
- easily adjusted for different tank volumes

HOG Single Tank Adapter
- ease of switcing tanks, etc

XS Scuba Velcro Weight Pouches
- Wanted dumpable weights as I hate weight belts
- Demonstrate to (hopeful) future students

DRIS 28lbs Wing
- was plenty of lift for my intended use

Following the instructions I assembled the kit myself. Wasn't difficult save one quick phone call placed to DRIS for assitance. I was impressed with the overall fit I was able to dial-in (as much as one can do in their living room).

Finally got the chance to dive it tonight at my local FW pool. Mind you, I may live in Illinois, but I haven't dove FW in 10 years. First thing I notice is I do not need any lead whatsoever. Hahaha, sweet. The unit on land in hand feels heavy, but once kitted-up it feels much lighter overall than anything I have ever dove. I settled at 10' and hovered motionless at perfect trim upon first descending. It took all of 15 seconds on land and 30 seconds in the water to be exceptionally happy with my purchase. Specifically:

Backplate - Never once "felt" the backplate on my back. I was wearing a "stay-dry" t-shirt, no wetsuit. Woulnd't have guessed i had a plate of SS strapped to me.
Harness - Padding was appreciated over the clavicle where the broken bone is noticeable. I will likely leave the padding on the opposite side just cause. Never actually released the QR, but I did use the cinch-pull ti tighten/loosen and it worked as I had hoped. I was easily able to exit the unit without contorting my blown-out shoulder. First experience with a crotch strap. More use will likely have me prefering it. Sternum strap worked as intended. Between it and the shjoulder straps, I was able to make the unit and me "one," which is my preference. A shifty BCD always bothered me.

Tank straps - priceless. Gosh that was nice to easily strap up a very secure bottle, then drop it just as easily.

Weight pouches - Obviously didn't need to use them in the pool today, but I put them through the test anyway. I positioned them as the first think onto the waist webbing so they are all the way in the rear. They are completely out of my way, but also an easy dump. I tested my okd BC to a positive 5lbs bouyancy tonight, and combined with the negative bouyancy of my new rig, I expect to carry perhaps zero lead weight but maybe up to 4-6lbs depending on how negatively bouyany the new unit is. Even if I need zero lead, I will carry some when with students both to demostrate weight drops and provide added lead to students if/when needed. Additionally, weight in the rear kept me upright, whereas my old Rig2 always had my face first in the water from 14lbs of lead in front of me.

Thanks to everyone that helped me figure this out. I can't wait to log many more dives in my new BP/W.

 

[cps214]

This was very informative for me. Thanks so much for making such a great write up for us.

 

[t1n_2]

Sorry for bringing this old thread up but i reckon the review you have given is great for those looking to buy a new BP/W system. Especially for someone like me who has no experience with the BP/W. Thanks!

 

[ddmattos]

Updated link:

DRIS Dive Gear 28lb BP/W System - Dive Right In Scuba - Plainfield, IL

You can upgrade to a hollis plate and solo harness as well. Your going to love a bp/w.

Safe diving.

 

[Laval]

Thank you for sharing your experience.