Vytec

[SMKChef]

After doing a lot of research, reading on here, reading brochures, reading websites, I think the vytec has the most power per buck so far. And it tells time. I would love to get the VR3. I like the fact that it can be totally reprogrammed if an update comes along. But when will that happen?

I wrote to OMS,who sells it under their name, just asking about the "planned" AI interface. That was a month ago. Never got a response. So, I wonder how soon they will update the VR3. Probably never.

 

[madmole]

The VR3 has had several software updates in the last year

There is no planned AI module for it whatsoever (at least the manufacturers (Delta P) dont know about one). The unit is aimed at technical and rebreather divers who would find AI no use at all as they have more than one cylinder of gas. It does have an oxygen sensor attachement for real time monitoring and deco on a rebreather however

OMS dont know what they are doing with the VR3. You can buy them for <$1000 through www.simplyscuba.com

Vytec is great for Nitrox. Amphibian Sports in the UK are currently selling em for £240 (About $380) http://www.amphibiansports.com/

Save your money on the air integration and just buy 2 computers, then you have all the redundancy you need

 

[Genesis]

some problems.

There are people who have reported serious button trouble with them, and extraordinarily long repair times.

Then there is a serious DESIGN issue - their use of "indiglo" lighting. That's not cool for a device intended to last five or more years. That technology has a definite "half life" and will eventually fail. This is why they put it in $19.95 watches.

Why they did this instead of using LED backlight illumination is beyond me, but they did. It is NOT a good thing.

The "promised" AI has been "promised" since the unit was announced. Its still "promised."

I don't know what manufacturers think is an acceptable cycle time in this business, but considering that they never even bothered to tell anyone HOW they intend to do this - with a transmitter, with a wire, etc - and there is no evidence or documentation that the hardware exists in the unit to do wireless reception....

I would have bought a VR3 if there was reason to believe that the issues it has would be addressed, and I wouldn't end up eating the cost of a second one to GET them addressed. As it was I was assured of neither, and thus, they lost.

I've been burned MANY times in the "vaporware" game in the computer business. I'll be damned if I'm going to get burned by it in my diving!

With the known issues of the VR3, and its radically-higher cost over the Vytec, and the fact that I doubt I will be doing 'Mix anytime soon, I went for the Vytec.... if I decide to do 'Mix it'll make a good bottom timer for that function anyway.

BTW, for the shop who "never heard" of Scubaboard - wait until they hear about http://www.diversunion.org - oh my....

 

[SMKChef]

Genesis once bubbled...

BTW, for the shop who "never heard" of Scubaboard - wait until they hear about http://www.diversunion.org - oh my....

NIIIIICE Site Genesis!! Way to go. I will send them a link..

 

[jamiei]

I agree, sign me up for the petition... Is this your doing Genesis? If so, great job...

 

[madmole]

From Genesis: There are people who have reported serious button trouble with them, and extraordinarily long repair times.

Thats an issue with OMS not the VR3, there has been VERY FEW button problems, but as with a lot of things on the web one person posts, 80 people become experts and amplify the problem

Then there is a serious DESIGN issue - their use of "indiglo" lighting. That's not cool for a device intended to last five or more years. That technology has a definite "half life" and will eventually fail. This is why they put it in $19.95 watches..

And thats why its NOT used in the VR3. I just checked with Delta P. No Indiglo in the VR3. It does use Elecro luminescence, but a different system

Why they did this instead of using LED backlight illumination is beyond me, but they did. It is NOT a good thing..

Because the system they use works and works well. Its very readable at depth

The "promised" AI has been "promised" since the unit was announced. Its still "promised.".

Not Promised by the manufacturer. They are looking into it, but reckon non cable transmission is too unreliable. It will be cable done if ever. But no user wants it anyway. People who make good use of a VR3 have multiple cylinders and mixes. We'd want to monitor more than one tank. You're lack of technical diving experiance is showing up here

I don't know what manufacturers think is an acceptable cycle time in this business, but considering that they never even bothered to tell anyone HOW they intend to do this - with a transmitter, with a wire, etc - and there is no evidence or documentation that the hardware exists in the unit to do wireless reception....
.

Funny! my Infra Red wireless coms with the unit allows me to download all my profile information to my PC. And I just asked Delta P and got the answer within a day. By Wire, for the reasons above, IF they ever do it

The manufacturers are NOW aware of the comments on this and other forums about OMS's level of service in the US. Judging by the attitude they expressed about it, something will be being done very shortly

 

[Genesis]

But until they DO "something about it", the VR3 distribution and repair in the US will remain OMSs, and there is where the problem lies.

BTW, if they want me to believe that the EL screen issue is not real, then they can provide a warranty with some teeth against its failure. No, one year won't do it. Try five or ten, non-declining, no-quibbles. If it dims or goes out, they give me a new one. That'd satisfy me and silence the critics. (I'm not arguing that its not readable - its VERY readable. Its the service life issue that bothers me, and EL is EL - its the technology itself that is problematic compared to the alternatives in terms of service life)

As for the pressure transmission, some folks do both "highly technical" and "highly fun" dives, and perhaps they're not in the same place or the same exposures. Even if I do take "advanced mix" training in the future, that doesn't change the fact that I will still dive in "recreational" depths frequently - probably more than I would at technical depths and exposures. Why would I want to have different computers for each?

Yes, wireless SPGs monitor only your backgas. And? Your stage bottles still have SPGs. What does this change? For mixes you can breathe at or near the surface (that is, all of them!) computing the remaining duration and exact pressure (electronic transmission is WAY more accurate then a brass SPG) is quite valuable.

The "reliability" issue is a red herring. Yes, there have been issues with SOME manufacturer's transmission schemes. There have also been issues with SOME manufacturer's computers, regulators, and other pieces of kit. Just because someone has "done it wrong" does mean you can't "do it right".

The VR3 is a cool computer; I applaud their use of the matrix display, as it provides flexibility and options that nobody else has. But the distribution and service issues NEED to be fixed in the US. I briefly considered buying one as one of the few computers that could "grow" with me all the way from OC Nitrox to CC Trimix if I wanted to later on, but when there are open issues of this type, and transatlantic shipping seems to be the only way to resolve some of them if there is trouble, I'll pass - for now.

 

[Conor]

If you are willing to get one from the UK then have a look at divebag the best price they list for the vytec alone is £240 (ca $360) and £200 (~$300) for the tansmitter. Being in the US you should be able to get them VAT free which reduces it by 17.5 % but I guess you will have to pay US import duty.

Happy shopping

 

[madmole]

Reply From Delta P regarding issues

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Hi Stephen

Have checked and apparently the life on the backlight is 5 years constant use, as most people only use theirs for about 10 seconds at a time, I think they should last!!

At the start of production (December 2001), we did have a few problems with the switches coming out, so we changed the design slightly and haven't had the problems lately.

I have heard some of these comments about OMS and the US market, we get people to send there computers to us directly for upgrades etc now.

We ask people to come directly to us if there are any problems, I think the majority of people like the product, but like most things, you can't please everyone all of the time!!

Thanks for your positive feedback.

Best Regards

Philippa

Delta P Technology
PO Box 5088, Poole, Dorset, BH16 6WJ
Tel: 00 44 1202 624478 Fax: 00 44 1202 625308 www.vr3.co.uk

 

[Scubaroo]

Genesis once bubbled...
For mixes you can breathe at or near the surface (that is, all of them!) computing the remaining duration and exact pressure (electronic transmission is WAY more accurate then a brass SPG) is quite valuable.

Actually the remaining duration calculations is the one feature I've found on the Vytec that I dislike - it simply isn't accurate. On several occasions I've had the computer telling me I had 0 minutes of gas left, when there's been 700psi or so remaining - not sure if it is using 500psi as an "empty" waterline or something, but it normally happens at the end of a shallow dive (<40'), when you ascend to 20' or so - I believe it uses a mini-history of your breathing rate to calculate your time remaining, but doesn't seem to take into account the change of depth (and resulting increase in time) as rapidly as it should. I don't like my computer telling me I should be dead when clearly I'm not

I work off the tank contents anyway, but that big fat 0 on the screen can be a bit disconcerting at times. It's a bit of a crutch for users with poor dive planning, and is a crooked one at that.