Canadian diver and buddy rescued near Apo Island, Philippines

[Kevrumbo]

I don't think you know what "iniquity" means any better than you know what "specious" means, but, whatever. If you dispute any of the statements I (and others) have made, you're welcome to cite your evidence.

My point is really simple: if there is no one in reach equipped to receive and act on the position, the signal is damn-near useless. These things work great when the USCG can pick it up. They won't work in most of Indonesia and the Philippines.

Fancy language like "activate your contingency resources" means absolutely jack if your contingency resources turn out to be two local boat captains who can't read a chart or communicate with their home base, a marine commando unit 150km away with their long-range boat out of action, and some arse-coverer in Jakarta/Manila lying to your embassy about the massive SAR efforts taking place around the island because they're too embarrassed to admit they don't have gas/spare parts/men/phone signal. If this sounds like exaggeration to you, can I suggest you spend some time in the places you're currently arguing about?

You get what you deserve then, @PygmySeahorse . . .

 

[Kevrumbo]

Another account where a PLB should have been a back-up and the preferred last best chance of rescue:

. . .We had launched an SMB during deco, but we were too far away for them to see it, and they were expecting us along the wall, rather than a few miles away in an orthogonal direction. The strongest swimmer in our group then decided to swim towards the entry point and try to get the boat's attention. After swimming for 2 hours, he reached the boat and 20 minutes later the boat reached us. . .

Minimum gas, underwater climbing and drifting away ...

 

[tridacna]

Kev,

Has there ever been a single instance in the Philippines or Indonesia of a PLB rescuing a diver?

I see your point about taking one after updating your travel info but I’ve dived in both areas and agree with PH that even if you successfully alerted someone, it would serve no purpose. They simply don’t have the means to look for you.

 

[Dogbowl]

I agree with @PygmySeahorse here.

I’ve tried to ignore this thread because there comes a point where you realize someone is so set in their view that their mind is no longer “open” to others’ view, even when facts are presented. Their view of the situation is THE correct view and anyone else’s is “you get what you deserve”? Really?

I don’t think anyone is arguing that you shouldn’t carry a PLB. I don’t think anyone is saying your “preparation” plans are foolish. In fact, many people thanked you and said they were “smart” plans. At least I did. I would follow what you suggested to increase my chances of being found.

But I think you’ve missed the point that’s being made all along, which is:

A PLB has its limits, especially in places like Indo and the Philippines.

That is all.

 

[Dan]

Dan you may want to read @IyaDiver's post #181 in the 7 divers lost off Bali thread, regarding SEA boats which don't have their own radios. Not instead of your list - in addition to.

Wow, lots of posts on this thread when I woke up & check it this morning. My office work is slow today, so I have some catching up to read on this.

First of all, thanks for the link to the prolific @IyaDiver post. Here is another thoughtful @IyaDiver post to read on how to minimize his risk of being lost at Indonesian sea: Scuba diver's Personal Locator Beacon - how never to be lost at sea

In there he spoke about having satellite phone too. What an adventurous diver

Heating up a popcorn bag in the microwave now

 

[Dan]

I hope you got the smaller of the two. It's good that he offers the larger one for those who need it for something else, and at the same price - but those are much too big for a PLB.

Yes, the bolt snap is a good idea. I wanted a little more flexibility so I used a heavy key ring plus a bolt snap. And I don't want the bolt snap easily removed from the canister.

Do not use the nylon pouch in the water! It's not designed for that and will not hold up. I don't know why he includes those? Maybe his GF sells them and he is supportive; who knows?

Those have a high failure rate, and if they do work - they only reach as far as you can see, much less than claimed. Some people like to talk to their boats, if the boats have a radio turned on loud enough.

True for the old Nautilus Lifeline (NLL) on high failure rate, but not on the new one, that is called Marine Rescue GPS (MRG), that has 5 year warranty battery life & half the size of the old NLL. The MRG is now a bit smaller than the size of my old camera case containing my PLB1.

The MRG, although has no longer 2-way radio capability, it has both DSC & AIS. The old NLL has only the DSC, which is pretty much useless in Indonesian water if you are not in the path of big ships, according to @IyaDiver

The AIS technology lets you load the ship MMSI. So, when you pull up the antenna & push the red button, the boat will know who you are & where you are. That’s why Palau Aggressor II are now renting MRG for free to its guests to carry it during the trip.

Time is of the essence due to the limited direct path distance of the radio signal. So, as soon as you come up to the surface & don’t see the dingy or see only tiny-weeny of the mother boat, you need to launch that little gizmo within minutes.

I’m going to get one of these MRG in addition to my PLB1. I’m going to check Blue Manta if they carry them for their guests to rent for my next trip to Indonesia (Ring of Fire: Maumere - Alor - Manuk - Banda - Ambon) that is known for the treacherous deep trench sea. If Blue Manta doesn’t rent MRG, at least I can load its MMSI to my MRG

 

[Dan]

Crystal Bay is a funny one - just like Gili Tepekong, it has this terrifying reputation, but there are routes to dive it which make it much less of an advanced dive, although you do still need to watch for the downs. (I've only ever experienced a mild down breeze there.)

I don't know why more Indonesian liveaboards don't do the Nautilus lifeline thing. Lord knows, we have enough high-current sites in the middle of bloody nowhere.

6 years ago I went to Alor & experiences the opposite, up current in one of the dive site, may be Kal’s Dream. I jumped in with negative entry, bleeded off all of my air out of my BCD & finned like mad to the bottom without avail. Finally had to thumb the dive.

 

[Dogbowl]

True for the old Nautilus Lifeline (NLL) on high failure rate, but not on the new one, that is called Marine Rescue GPS (MRG), that has 5 year warranty battery life & half the size of the old NLL. The MRG is now a bit smaller than the size of my old camera case containing my PLB1.

The MRG, although has no longer 2-way radio capability, it has both DSC & AIS. The old NLL has only the DSC, which is pretty much useless in Indonesian water if you are not in the path of big ships, according to @IyaDiver

The AIS technology lets you load the ship MMSI. So, when you pull up the antenna & push the red button, the boat will know who you are & where you are. That’s why Palau Aggressor II are now renting MRG for free to its guests to carry it during the trip.

Time is of the essence due to the limited direct path distance of the radio signal. So, as soon as you come up to the surface & don’t see the dingy or see only tiny-weeny of the mother boat, you need to launch that little gizmo within minutes.

I’m going to get one of these MRG in addition to my PLB1. I’m going to check Blue Manta if they carry them for their guests to rent for my next trip to Indonesia (Ring of Fire: Maumere - Alor - Manuk - Banda - Ambon) that is known for the treacherous deep trench sea. If Blue Manta doesn’t rent MRG, at least I can load its MMSI to my MRG

Since we are talking about Nautilus Marine Rescue GPS, I want to provide info related to the Belize Aggressors. The Belize Aggressors have Nautilus Lifeline Radios (NLL) (original discontinued version) for rent to passengers at $25/week. The yachts are equipped with DSC only as it was the technology compatible with the original NLL. They do not have AIS.

With respect to entering your boat’s MMSI into your 2nd generation Nautilus Marine Rescue GPS, they advised not to do so on the Belize Aggressors. If you enter your boat’s MMSI into your unit, your boat gets called first when you activate your unit, then only after 30 minutes, all boats in the area will get called. Since the 2 Aggressor boats in Belize work and travel pretty much “together”, not entering your own boat’s MMSI would ensure that BOTH Aggressor boats would be called as soon as possible. Either would effect the rescue ASAP without wasting the initial 30 minutes. I think this makes a lot of sense in this situation.

In fact, the more I think about it, the less I think I want to enter my boat’s MMSI. I don’t think I want to delay a universal distress call for 30 minutes.

If you are travelling on an LOB, I advise you contact the LOB to discuss how best to use your first or second generation Nautilus. Every boat is run differently and have different technologies available.

 

[Dan]

@PygmySeahorse , "By failing to prepare, you are preparing to fail. . ."

51m deep on the WWII Aircraft Carrier HMS Hermes sunk-in-action, off east coast Sri Lanka, Indian Ocean 2010. McMurdo Fastfind Plus PLB in Gold Dive Canister (on Right Hip), Diver's Life Raft attached to lower end of back plate; and a water container source mounted in between the 11L Twinset.
View attachment 445350
( @Dan_T , your 40m PLB housing O-ring would be compromised and leaking at this depth)

Sidemount in Palau, Gold PLB Dive Canister on Right Hip; Diver's Life Raft in pouch clipped onto Bottom D-ring and attached with shock cord to sidemount harness.
View attachment 445351

Since 2006 -All overseas trips and very far offshore Southern California home water excursions have always been planned with a PLB and rescue coordination resource contingencies.

That’s the beauty of this clear, see-through, case. I can see when it begins to leak.

What I learned in a pressure vessel design class, the vessel is designed at 1.5x of maximum allowable working pressure (MAWP). So, if this old camera case MAWP is the pressure at 40m depth, then the design pressure would be equivalent to the sea depth of about 60m. I tested it in Palau down to 44m without any leak to see a sleeping Zebra shark (see pix, below). Even though if the case leaks, the PLB1 is waterproof down to 15m. So small leak won’t be a problem.

 

[Dan]

Thanks for this. The ones I've looked at are overwhelmingly from the first world: US, Australia, New Zealand, France and Portugal, though I did see one rescue of a boat in Venezuela. I also didn't see any divers.

My point is not that these things don't work: they're AMAZING if you've got the USCG on the other end, or the British coastguard, or the French coastguard, or the Aussie coastguard, all of which are well-resourced, or mountain search and rescue, or whatever.

It's that they don't work in places like (most of) Indonesia and (most of) the Philippines, because there isn't the infrastructure, either at government level or at operator level, to receive and act on the information sent in a timely fashion.

Don’t forget about US Navy actively patrolling the South China Sea to ease off the tension amongst China (PRC & ROC), Malaysia, Philippines, Brunei, Vietnam & Indonesia in disputed “islands” that pop up during low tide with different flags. Territorial disputes in the South China Sea - Wikipedia

Also, US territory Guam is not that far off Raja Ampat, ~ 600 miles to the north of Sorong. Philippines, closed tie with USA, allows US Navy for cruising in Philippines seas.

Although I would never want to be lost at sea, as a US asset, I would think nearby US Navy would try to help the helpless local SAR authority, to rescue us, like the American diver who lost at sea in Malpelo, Colombia. 4 diveres went missing - Malpelo, Colombia