Potential problems with Divemaster class

[aceupmysleeve777]

I have emailed my instructor outlining the fact that I we need to go over my knowledge reviews (which we have failed to look at at all and I have been in the class for over a month), he says acedemics will come in time and I am to continue studying my course materials. He was also prepared to offer me more work assisting with more open water classes this weekend. The fact that we will not be going over my actual DM classwork disapoints me but I will use the opportunity this weekend to discuss my issues and hopefully develop a positive level of communication where we can start working on my class itself and stop the continuous assisting with OW divers. Of course assisting with classes is im sure part of the curiculum, I still feel that my own acedemics should be reviewed, especially after I have already been doing class work for over a month. I hope things go well this weekend, its looks like I have some hard work ahead of me but keeping a positive outlook is all I have left now.

Hopefully this will get better from here on for you. Like others have said this class takes months unless your getting a rubber stamp cert and nobody will hire you once they see you in action if done that way. I think your on the right track with talking to the instructor, I was aiming on the side of not jumping to the your getting screwed side but it does worry me that they want you to keep diving, diving, diving even with classes and you still haven't done the book work with the instructor. Usually they want to make sure you know what your talking about before they let you around students that are asking you questions. If this is a PADI class and things fall apart from here contact them and let them know the whole story. People like to talk crap about PADI but they get real serious real fast with this type of thing.

 

[Steve50]

I think you have defined Rip Off

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I have emailed my instructor outlining the fact that I we need to go over my knowledge reviews (which we have failed to look at at all and I have been in the class for over a month), he says acedemics will come in time and I am to continue studying my course materials. He was also prepared to offer me more work assisting with more open water classes this weekend. The fact that we will not be going over my actual DM classwork disapoints me but I will use the opportunity this weekend to discuss my issues and hopefully develop a positive level of communication where we can start working on my class itself and stop the continuous assisting with OW divers. Of course assisting with classes is im sure part of the curiculum, I still feel that my own acedemics should be reviewed, especially after I have already been doing class work for over a month. I hope things go well this weekend, its looks like I have some hard work ahead of me but keeping a positive outlook is all I have left now.

It used to be that you had to assist with at least 10 open water sessions/days with students, or more if you weren't getting the hang of it. I don't know what it is now. This was always the grey area and the part where instructors would milk DMC's for more internship. It's up to the instructor to decide when the DMC is proficient in assisting students and when they are done. This is where most of the abuse happens.

---------- Post Merged at 11:21 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 11:10 AM ----------

Hopefully this will get better from here on for you. Like others have said this class takes months unless your getting a rubber stamp cert and nobody will hire you once they see you in action if done that way. I think your on the right track with talking to the instructor, I was aiming on the side of not jumping to the your getting screwed side but it does worry me that they want you to keep diving, diving, diving even with classes and you still haven't done the book work with the instructor. Usually they want to make sure you know what your talking about before they let you around students that are asking you questions. If this is a PADI class and things fall apart from here contact them and let them know the whole story. People like to talk crap about PADI but they get real serious real fast with this type of thing.

You're right about PADI, if there's one thing they're good at it's taking care of problems really fast.
I know an instructor that had a one night fling with female DMC and the next day the instructor went around bragging about it (a real scum bag).
Anyway, the female DMC didn't really have enough to claim date rape with law enforcement because it leaned to much to being consentual, but she did contact PADI and voice her concerns that this guy was going around seducing his interns and coercing them to have sex with him.
The very next day the instructor was wiped clean from anything to do with PADI and lost every certification status he had with them. They don't mess around.
They also don't take kindly to hearing about abusive instructors with any level of classes/training.

 

[aceupmysleeve777]

It used to be that you had to assist with at least 10 open water sessions/days with students, or more if you weren't getting the hang of it. I don't know what it is now. This was always the grey area and the part where instructors would milk DMC's for more internship. It's up to the instructor to decide when the DMC is proficient in assisting students and when they are done. This is where most of the abuse happens.

I think now you have to do mapping, search & recovery dive, Deep dive, scuba review, 1 open water class (intern), 1 con. ed class(intern), 1 discover local diving(lead), 1 skin diver(lead) and a supervising certified divers. It's changed the last couple of years so this might not be this years requirements. And It's also depends what agency. And alot of the above is the open water portion which in DM class is just a small fraction of the class.

 

[EastCoastWreckDiver]

I have been done with mapping for the last two weeks, although challenging, after looking at previous DMC mapping projects I feel mine was more than enough to pass this particular test. I have done search and recovery dives for AOW so I feel confident about doing this again, I dive above 100ft on a weekly basis so deep diving shouldnt be a problem, I also have mapped a location of upwards of 121ft so again deep dives are no concern for me, my scuba review demonstration skills although not perfect are acceptible based on the level of review other instructors get paid to do, I feel confident in my demonstrations skills. I have interned in up to 3 OW classes and they all have went very well. the rest of the workshops I have not completed but my instructor says we will catch up to them in the next 1-2 months. Another concern is that in over a month of being in the class I have had no DM classwork, just assisting the shop and assisting OW students. I realize I should not be done right now and I have no problem continuing but another 2-3 months is unacceptable. I also realize that other students are put first sometimes and DM students are sometimes put on the backburner until other courses get caught up upon. Myself being a paying student I feel that although other classes may take precedent over my own, I do not expect to be brushed away until bussiness is at a standstill and im all thats left. I have contacted another dive shop who have seen my skiils underwater, I have shown them the work I have done thus far and they agree that my class should be close to being over, they have agreed that for a minmal cost of another $200 bucks that they can get me where I need to be. After spending thousands of dollars at my current dive shop in equipment, classes and boat charters I think an extra 200 bucks to get this class done with another shop is completely acceptable. Going to another shop however is my last resort, my funds are draining fast and it may be my only option, living on the beach even in a fleabag area is still expensive and the food and gas cost just add more stress to my already stressful diving classes and bank accounts. If I am overeaccting, please let me know, I know classwork can get some of us flustered and if I need to come back to reality please let me know. Again you are hearing my side of the story and not the dive shop so please read this with an unbiased review. I have no intention of ruining this shops reputation because I beleieve in supporting your local dive shop and not outsourcing to leisurepro or other online companies to get a better deal. I feel like I do support my shop but I hope the others who read this can weigh the pros and cons of what decisions I have and need to make.

 

[boulderjohn]

I have contacted another dive shop who have seen my skiils underwater, I have shown them the work I have done thus far and they agree that my class should be close to being over, they have agreed that for a minmal cost of another $200 bucks that they can get me where I need to be. After spending thousands of dollars at my current dive shop in equipment, classes and boat charters I think an extra 200 bucks to get this class done with another shop is completely acceptable. Going to another shop however is my last resort, my funds are draining fast and it may be my only option, living on the beach even in a fleabag area is still expensive and the food and gas cost just add more stress to my already stressful diving classes and bank accounts. If I am overeaccting, please let me know, I know classwork can get some of us flustered and if I need to come back to reality please let me know. Again you are hearing my side of the story and not the dive shop so please read this with an unbiased review. I have no intention of ruining this shops reputation because I beleieve in supporting your local dive shop and not outsourcing to leisurepro or other online companies to get a better deal. I feel like I do support my shop but I hope the others who read this can weigh the pros and cons of what decisions I have and need to make.

I fully understand your position. I myself was in a surprisingly similar situation once. I absolutely and truly believed that I should do everything I could to show my loyalty to a shop that had in the past been much, much better to me than this shop has been to you. I finally had to realize that I had to do what was best for me and make the jump. It was a very painful decision for me, for I had to walk away from old friends. I am in a new and exciting place now, and am quite happy I made the move.

Here is a thought. The practical reason you do not want to harm the reputation of such a shop is that you want to build a relationship with them. Given two options, would you prefer to build a relationship with a shop that screws its DMCs or one that treats them fairly?

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I have a feeling I know what's going on.
Are there any other DMC's in that shop that need to still do their academics or are you the only one?
I'll bet they are waiting for a few DMC's to sign up before they start academic classes so they can get several in the class to make it more efficient for them.
You need to quit being so concerned about the shop and start looking out for yourself. They ain't no top shop I can tell you, it sopunds like they are a bunch of greedy scumbags.
Buy stuff at leisure pro, screw them, it's your money and you're not an employee.
I would get your folder and go to the other shop and pay the $200 bucks, as long as it's a no strings attached deal and they promise in writing that they will finish you up for the $200.
It sounds like the current shop is going to take you for a ride for thousands more, and based on your financial situation you'll be broke and homeless before then. You gotta open you eyes man and see there's no end to it.

What I'd do if I were you would be to pull out of this shop now, take a little break, catch up on money, then go to the other shop and pay the 200 and finish up without the stress of worrying about being broke. There's nothing worse than worrying about money.

I'd also still report them to the agency and at least get back something from the $1100 for the portion that they failed to provide.

Best of luck to you bro.

 

[EastCoastWreckDiver]

All the other DMC's have filled the requirments and are now almost done, I feel like I am being subjected that I am a "Rich kid" and can afford anything, not true, although my classes were obtained and paid for through a scholarship, I do not have a endless supply of money. It seems as if everyone in the shop is devoted to its progress, many friends I have made have voiced their opinions, when I bring them up to an instructor they seem to shy away and not talk to me anymore, I know this cant be as bad as I say, with such a reputable reputation there is no way this dive shop could be so corrupt. However , I feel I am being taken advantage of because a non profit foiundation has agered to help me out in my diving career, it also makes me wonder whats going on because an instructor recently told me that the dive boat they use is ein a court case for proper ownership, totaling over 100K in due payments. This may be why they are so after money. Another thing, yes I complain a lot but my ship will not service or inspect any equipment not purchased from them, I think this is BS, if I buy a reg in cali and need it inspected for an atlantic dive they should be respincible, wether you bought it at the shop or not. maybe at a charge but that is reasonable.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Wow dude, they really think they own you.
That shop doesn't sound reputabloe at all, they sound like a bunch of bullies.
And the other DMC's won't talk to you after you bring them up to talk to an instructor? You're telling me they're running that scared?
What the hell kind of operation is this?

You still never mentioned what agency they are affiliated with, or maybe you did and I missed it?
What agency?

 

[tenover]

So what are the "official" work requirements for a DM Candidate? If I have a family and a full time, 9-5 job, are the work requirements something I could even complete?? I sure have learned a lot about DM training in general just from this thread already...Good luck to the OP.