Cramps, causes and prevention

[bowlofpetunias]

I'm with you NetDoc.. well we have dived together and I'd say our Slow Easy dive speed was a good match I sure had fun and it suited me to a T!

Yep TMHeimer I have the same issue... sitting watching tv and boom cramps.. they just happen at odd times. I have reached the point where I just accept it happens, deal with it and move on. The issue of cramps is in my I've got more important things to worry about category. Kinda like my arthritis I take reasonable measures but don't fixate.

Dan Interesting information but that just sounds too much like work to me. I dive for the Zen I don't think about my heart rate, I don't think about breath control I am in the moment. All I want to hear are the rice krispy crackle of pistol shrimp, sounds of the creatures around me and the sound of bubbles. No equipment beeping no buddies trying to "talk" underwater, just the sounds of the ocean and bubbles.

All I want to think about are the things I am seeing, keeping track of my buddy, monitoring my guages and relaxing. If my buddy wants to talk, sound alert horns and zip around at speed I am happy to be a good budding for that dive and find a one that suits my style for the next. To me cramping has been part of my life, an inconvenience but going to soft split fins which I did initially due to the arthritis in my knees, moving up in to the water column once in a while for a stretch has worked pretty well.

 

[Z Gear]

I'm with you NetDoc.. well we have dived together and I'd say our Slow Easy dive speed was a good match I sure had fun and it suited me to a T!Yep TMHeimer I have the same issue... sitting watching tv and boom cramps.. they just happen at odd times. I have reached the point where I just accept it happens, deal with it and move on. The issue of cramps is in my I've got more important things to worry about category. Kinda like my arthritis I take reasonable measures but don't fixate.Dan Interesting information but that just sounds too much like work to me. I dive for the Zen I don't think about my heart rate, I don't think about breath control I am in the moment. All I want to hear are the rice krispy crackle of pistol shrimp, sounds of the creatures around me and the sound of bubbles. No equipment beeping no buddies trying to "talk" underwater, just the sounds of the ocean and bubbles. All I want to think about are the things I am seeing, keeping track of my buddy, monitoring my guages and relaxing. If my buddy wants to talk, sound alert horns and zip around at speed I am happy to be a good budding for that dive and find a one that suits my style for the next. To me cramping has been part of my life, an inconvenience but going to soft split fins which I did initially due to the arthritis in my knees, moving up in to the water column once in a while for a stretch has worked pretty well.

Though I find the info Dan was providing really interesting I tend to feel as you and Net Doc do on this one. As far as taking it real slow that's for me and my wife as well. We both get foot cramps but we found relief once we switched to split fins. It has help us tremendously and we just have to watch out, not to over do it when we kick out on our shore dives and we are pain free!!!

 

[Neilwood]

I'm with you NetDoc.. well we have dived together and I'd say our Slow Easy dive speed was a good match I sure had fun and it suited me to a T!

Yep TMHeimer I have the same issue... sitting watching tv and boom cramps.. they just happen at odd times. I have reached the point where I just accept it happens, deal with it and move on. The issue of cramps is in my I've got more important things to worry about category. Kinda like my arthritis I take reasonable measures but don't fixate.

Dan Interesting information but that just sounds too much like work to me. I dive for the Zen I don't think about my heart rate, I don't think about breath control I am in the moment. All I want to hear are the rice krispy crackle of pistol shrimp, sounds of the creatures around me and the sound of bubbles. No equipment beeping no buddies trying to "talk" underwater, just the sounds of the ocean and bubbles.

All I want to think about are the things I am seeing, keeping track of my buddy, monitoring my guages and relaxing. If my buddy wants to talk, sound alert horns and zip around at speed I am happy to be a good budding for that dive and find a one that suits my style for the next. To me cramping has been part of my life, an inconvenience but going to soft split fins which I did initially due to the arthritis in my knees, moving up in to the water column once in a while for a stretch has worked pretty well.

That's why I dive - for the feeling of being away from the rush above. Anything I can do to extend that such as slow breathing, minimal kicks etc is what I am after. Being quicker underwater zipping around is the antithesis of why I am doing it.

If I cramp (same as above the surface) I take care of it, stretch as well as I can and keep going.

 

[Dnaber]

Also....get orthotics for your booties....so that the lever you create with your legs, does not overwhelm a weak base in your foot( where the power must transfer to)....Fins will often crush your arch down, and this ruins the stability of your foot and power use....orthotics will allow you to apply all the power you can handle, without losing it to a foot that is weakened by the arch having been flattened out by the fins, and with the foot no longer being a solid lever.

I also suffer form cramping but never thought of using my orthotics from my shoes. Actually I have several different types. The ones I favor are made of hard plastic with adjustable arch support. And as I just switched from a boot style fin to the open heel and a 5mm boot for support I think I can work this in very well!!!!! Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[billt4sf]

I haven't read all the posts, but I recently found out that taking statins can cause cramps (my Doc said so and the DAN med line agreed), which is why I am reading this thread.

I exercise a fair amount (stairs) and my calves are in great shape (for my age) but I get cramps in my calves every night while sleeping. Maybe I can get some relief by doing calf lifts, if I can figure out exactly what they are. Just go tippy-toes and repeat ad naseum?

- Bill

 

[danvolker]

I haven't read all the posts, but I recently found out that taking statins can cause cramps (my Doc said so and the DAN med line agreed), which is why I am reading this thread.

I exercise a fair amount (stairs) and my calves are in great shape (for my age) but I get cramps in my calves every night while sleeping. Maybe I can get some relief by doing calf lifts, if I can figure out exactly what they are. Just go tippy-toes and repeat ad naseum?

- Bill

I'd blame it on the statins.....Outdated and corrupt research studies led to the use of statins for Blood pressure....Even if you don't like Mercola, his bibliographies on all the research showing why you don't need statins, should give you an entirely different outlook.

Study Reveals Statins Not Very Effective or Safe

On drugs, by Mercola : "Drugs treat symptoms rather than underlying causes, many are unproven, and they can cause immense harm.“You have more than 100,000 people every year [in the United States] dying from taking legally prescribed drugs,” Mercola says, citing a 1994 study from the University of Toronto. “No people in a typical year are dying from vitamin supplements,” he continues, his voice rising. “And yet vitamins are vilified and drugs are identified as the hero. It doesn’t make sense.” (It’s not unknown for people to die from overusing supplements, which escape FDA review so long as they do not make health claims on the label.)
“Fraud. Kickbacks. Price-setting, bribery, and illegal sales activities,” Mercola rants in a characteristically scathing web posting. “Add in all the doctored and back-dated documents, federal and civil lawsuits, and billions of dollars in government sanctions, fines, and penalties—not to mention the deaths—and you’d think it was the script for a thriller global action movie. But no, it’s just Big Pharma at its deceitful best, dancing all the way to the bank while . . . endangering the lives of regular people like you and me.”

 

[The Chairman]

Yeah, I've never thought about orthotics either. I know I kick with my toes more than my entire foot. I wear socks, Navy Seal Boots (OTB) and the Hollis BatFin. The fit is so nice that I can feel anything that brushes against my fin though my toes. I'm worried that orthotics would interfere with that and I know they would interfere with the boot draining like it's designed to do. But, I just don't get cramps very often. When I do, I can usually point to other causes like aspartame or caffeine.

 

[danvolker]

Yeah, I've never thought about orthotics either. I know I kick with my toes more than my entire foot. I wear socks, Navy Seal Boots (OTB) and the Hollis BatFin. The fit is so nice that I can feel anything that brushes against my fin though my toes. I'm worried that orthotics would interfere with that and I know they would interfere with the boot draining like it's designed to do. But, I just don't get cramps very often. When I do, I can usually point to other causes like aspartame or caffeine.

Pete, If you have feet with flat bottoms, then the booties and fins are designed for YOU. If you have an arch, and you place your foot in this bootie with no support for your arch, then when your leg muscles push/pull your fins through the kick shape you use, and with your fins tight enough to stay on your feet, the posture of your foot is under constant stress to be "deformed" by the fin and bootie.
The harder you kick, the more that poor posture of the foot, will cause overwork of some muscles in the foot....also, with bad foot posture, some areas of the Calf muscle will be getting work load they should not be getting, as they will be effected by attachment points in the foot.

 

[The Chairman]

First, I don't wear 'booties'. I wear an actual boot.

OTBs (Over The Beach) were designed for Navy Seals to go from diving into combat on land. IOW, to take them "Over The Beach". I got them after I had ankle surgery and have never looked back. Lot's of ankle support as I climb ladders and they're designed for hiking over rugged terrain. Also, they drain completely and immediately. Rather than soaking my feet in water between dives, my feet are almost dry by the time I splash. They aren't that expensive and I've never had anyone who went to them want to go back. They were bought out by New Balance and they are still my boot of choice.

Secondly, the foot pocket of the Hollis fin fits the OTB like they were made for each other. I don't have a single 'pinch point' which is what gave me foot pain and cramps back when I wore booties and Jets. The soft and supple pocket combined with the padding of a high end boot and my feet are well protected with absolutely no slop.

Finally, how much force do you need to keep your fins on? Probably the biggest force will occur during the giant stride (which I never, ever do). In the water, the fins push the diver. With the proper technique and fit, you almost don't need a strap: just a gentle tug so the fins don't dislodge. After my ankle surgery, I found the lightest tension possible in an SS spring. I put this on my jets until I discovered the Hollis F1 (BatFin). That's probably when I stopped doing the giant stride and opted for simply sitting down into the ocean (modified back roll). I found that all my foot aches disappeared overnight with the light, light spring. almost moved them to the Hollis, but the freakishly comfy foot pocket means I could leave them original.

 

[The Chairman]

Follow up... it should also be noted that I frog kick almost exclusively. Rather than the power coming off the front of the foot during the down stroke, it comes off of my toes as I flex both my foot and ankle in order to control my kick. Yeah, I use my calves, knees and thighs too, but I feel the pressure on my toes. Anything that touches my fins gets telegraphed right to my toes. That includes the power of the water flow or even a diver that has gotten too close. It gives me a lot of precision in the water and I like that.