Diving Without certification...

[yosemite_sam]

Go to a pro to learn to dive

 

[lmurtha1]

I like this topic of discussion, because honestly when I read that statement of 15 ft not being a big deal, I had no idea the consequences of holding your breath at that depth?! Until someone brought it to light, I would of had no idea.. i knew that holding your breath on the way up while scubadiving breathing with a full set of lungs was a NO NO, but, I certainly didn't know that its biggest factor was in that last 15 ft!!!

Interesting and thank you for bringing it to light. Being a avid spearfisher, I know that you can hold your breath to your hearts desire, but even then, scubas a whole new world...

Note: I was talking to my wife's buddy (whose been diving for over 15 years) about the lung expansion, and even he didn't know that......wow. Again, a good reason to be certified.

 

[LeadTurn_SD]

I never realized that so many instructors are poor in their training ability. Is it that they are just ineffective in demonstrating the proper ways to dive, or are they just incompetent divers period?! It seems like a trend through this thread is that the certification process usually turns out to be more of a mess with sometimes poor instructors and a pool full of scared students that are not comfortable in the water:shocked2: I really hope that being in s. Florida, that their are some quality agencies out their with great instructors. I'm getting privately instructed down here with my wife, so that should take some of the stress out of it, ya think? Then again, the instructor could be crap also. Anyone know of a quality instructor in the Fort Lauderdale area that does private lessons?

Hi Imurtha1,

I think you stepped into the middle of a minefield as far as "then versus now" and the quality of scuba instruction. It is a big topic, a lot of emotions surround it; some of the folks in this thread "were there" as instructors when training changed, and have strong feelings (in my opinion justified) about it.

I'm not an instructor or dive pro of any kind, just an "oldish" diver. I did see a change in the way basic OW was conducted from when I took it (1976) to when my kids took it (2007).

If you have a competent instructor, you'll be just fine!

I did mention reading everything you can get your hands on regarding scuba, and that was the reason. You do need to learn as much as possible, and dive frequently, ideally with good, experienced divers that can act as mentors.... this will accelerate you learning curve dramatically.

Best wishes.

 

[extremedivers]

I introduce myself am mattias former navy seal combat diver, padi instructor, cmas 2 star instructor and technical diving instructor. I have over 10,000 dives and have seen so many diving accidents in my life whether serious or mere ones due to lack of knowledge, skill or recklessness. I would advise anyone who want to go for a dive to do it the proper way because even a discover scuba as mention in this forum before has a small theory part and skill practice in the pool. No one goes in the water for scuba diving without a bit of theory knowledge and a basic skill circuit practice e.g regulator clearing = not to drown if in case water gets in your regulator or in this situation some people start panicking , stop breathing and rush to the surface causing a lung over expansion injury. DO NOT FORGET DIVER FRIENDS THAT THE RELATION BETWEEN PRESSURE AND VOLUME CAN CAUSE MORE SERIOUS DAMAGES NEAR THE SURFACE THAN AT DEPTH, mask clearing + buco nasal practice = not to breath water through the nose and exhale through the nose to avoid a squeeze that can destroy your blood vessels in your eyes.

Now lets come to insurance policy matters. If the guy who is bringing you for scuba diving is a good diver but himself not certified or insured. In this case any problem cause to you will be at your own charge e.g hospital care or getting you back in your country in a medical plane and this can cost a very huge sum of money and am sure not everybody has this means readily available to save their life or family or friends life.I have been diving a lot in my life and I came across only one guy who really stick to the rules and know exactly what he is doing and why he is doing it like this and this guy is only 28yrs old and can answer correctly to your questions without opening a book to search for your answer. He is a british guy living on mauritius his name is Aktarkhan Gooskhan his mail is aktarg@hotmail.com any question contact him, he is very friendly and ready to help anyone.

ONE LAST THING SCUBA DIVING IS FUN AND SAFE ONLY IF WE STICK TO THE RULES AND PROCEDURES. SO GUYS ENJOY MAKING BUBBLES WE MEET LATER

 

[extremedivers]

Hi Imurtha1,

I think you stepped into the middle of a minefield as far as "then versus now" and the quality of scuba instruction. It is a big topic, a lot of emotions surround it; some of the folks in this thread "were there" as instructors when training changed, and have strong feelings (in my opinion justified) about it.

I'm not an instructor or dive pro of any kind, just an "oldish" diver. I did see a change in the way basic OW was conducted from when I took it (1976) to when my kids took it (2007).

If you have a competent instructor, you'll be just fine!

I did mention reading everything you can get your hands on regarding scuba, and that was the reason. You do need to learn as much as possible, and dive frequently, ideally with good, experienced divers that can act as mentors.... this will accelerate you learning curve dramatically.

Best wishes.

My dear friend there is two kind of instructors. A who just do it to earn their living and B does it because it is his passion and believes his help will produce better diver and promote divers safety and awarness. In case of A when they reach instructor level they stopped going forward because they think what they know is already enough to teach to earn money and B he never stop updating his knowledge and always looking every topic in diving even those that are not mentions in their own diving encyclopedia or manual just to give safety and awarness. Lots of instructor lack experience because they were always working under a diving manager who wanted them to work in his ways only and the manager will never accept new ideas because he is the boss and thinks that he knows the most. Diver friends as an instructor where you learn the most is with beginners because they make lots of mistakes which is not a blame at all because they are new to this underwater. Our aim as instructor is to look at their mistakes,explain them and help them to correct them. Diving with very good qualified divers is good but not instructive because you see fish only you do not see mistakes made by beginners that you can improve to good results.

Thank you guys

 

[extremedivers]

I like this topic of discussion, because honestly when I read that statement of 15 ft not being a big deal, I had no idea the consequences of holding your breath at that depth?! Until someone brought it to light, I would of had no idea.. i knew that holding your breath on the way up while scubadiving breathing with a full set of lungs was a NO NO, but, I certainly didn't know that its biggest factor was in that last 15 ft!!!

Interesting and thank you for bringing it to light. Being a avid spearfisher, I know that you can hold your breath to your hearts desire, but even then, scubas a whole new world...

Note: I was talking to my wife's buddy (whose been diving for over 15 years) about the lung expansion, and even he didn't know that......wow. Again, a good reason to be certified.

Friend being certified is the best way to learn and to dive. Lets go back to first generation of divers , how many of them died or became invalid due to deco accident or lung over expanssion injuries. All this happened because they knew how to dive physically but they did not have a good theory of the environment and materials around them in the scuba diving field.

 

[adurso]

Friend being certified is the best way to learn and to dive. Lets go back to first generation of divers , how many of them died or became invalid due to deco accident or lung over expanssion injuries. All this happened because they knew how to dive physically but they did not have a good theory of the environment and materials around them in the scuba diving field.

Good question; how many did die, or become invalids? Do you have a source?

 

[JamesBon92007]

I would not recommend anyone using scuba gear without first using it someplace such as a swimming pool and knowing about Boyle's Law and air embolisms. You can get an embolism in five feet of water or less. In a way it's sorta like taking somone whot's never driven a car or had any instruction and letting them loose on the freeway. I suggest you see if your local library has a diving instruction manual and read it. You can get away with not knowing the dive tables if you stay under the No Decompression Limits but if you are ever going to dive in deep water you really should know them. Of course nowadays they have dive computers to take the place of knowing what you are doing so you could get one of those. In any case I plan to teach my daughters how to scuba dive. Sooner or later they will need to get certified in order to get air or take a dive boat. But I believe I can teach them satisfactorily and, in some cases, better than many certified instructors. I will let them have the BCs and Dive Computers if they like, but I will teach them how te depend upon themselves and not their equipment.

 

[Akimbo]

Friend being certified is the best way to learn and to dive. Lets go back to first generation of divers , how many of them died or became invalid due to deco accident or lung over expanssion injuries. All this happened because they knew how to dive physically but they did not have a good theory of the environment and materials around them in the scuba diving field.

I question the assertion. Diving fatalities were not especially high among early Scuba divers. Diving physics and physiology were well understood and the information was widely published well before Cousteau and Gagnan met. The vast majority of early Scuba divers knew the importance of mastering these principles and most had a greater understanding than newly certified divers today. People who imported and later manufactured diving gear understood the importance of diver safety. Even waaaay back then, killing customers was considered bad for business.

Defining the best of anything always invites valid debate. Certification programs can be a good way to learn diving, but the best? Is it really better than being taught by your father who happens to be Navy Master Diver (pick your country) and has no certifying authority? How about a commercial diving superintendent with twenty years in the North Sea? Or maybe a high school science teacher that has been actively Scuba diving for 30 years?

A structured class is probably more time efficient, on average, for large groups if that is the definition of best. If competence in avoiding and minimizing hazards, ability to overcome equipment malfunctions, understanding the environment, and comfort in the ocean counts then the hypothesis weakens.

 

[Thalassamania]

Go to a pro to learn to dive

There are almost no "Pros," all that most are likely to find are possers who are just passing through the industry on a short vacation between their first real job and their next real job. Show me someone with twenty years in a real diving billet, that's a "Pro."

I never realized that so many instructors are poor in their training ability. Is it that they are just ineffective in demonstrating the proper ways to dive, or are they just incompetent divers period?! It seems like a trend through this thread is that the certification process usually turns out to be more of a mess with sometimes poor instructors and a pool full of scared students that are not comfortable in the water:shocked2: I really hope that being in s. Florida, that their are some quality agencies out their with great instructors. I'm getting privately instructed down here with my wife, so that should take some of the stress out of it, ya think? Then again, the instructor could be crap also. Anyone know of a quality instructor in the Fort Lauderdale area that does private lessons?

Find an instructor who's been at it for a couple of decades and who has both significant agency recognition as well as a reasonable number of non-agency publication credits. It's worth the extra cost.

Friend being certified is the best way to learn and to dive. Lets go back to first generation of divers , how many of them died or became invalid due to deco accident or lung over expanssion injuries. All this happened because they knew how to dive physically but they did not have a good theory of the environment and materials around them in the scuba diving field.

I'm one of them ... and I've never been bent of injured. Come to think of it, with the exception of some of my buds who were early cave divers, very few of my friends (or acquaintances) who part of the first generation of divers were bent or injured either.

Good question; how many did die, or become invalids? Do you have a source?

Perhaps the Journal of Irreproducible Results?