Suggestion Feedback on keeping ScubaBoard members

[gypsyjim]

This question is directed at all members, new and old. It is actually a multiple part question, and is designed to get us all thinking about what ScubaBoard is, or could be for someone just discovering us today or tomorrow.

Two weeks ago on Utila Colleen and I were part of 4 couples with no previous contact who were diving on the same boat for a week, so we had lots of time to chat. It turned out that 5 (6 including myself) of the 9 divers including the DM, were all members of ScubaBoard at one time or another, but I was the only actively participating SM user.

A subsequent conversation with a friend who is also a moderator, has had me thinking about this, so here are my questions:

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1) What attracted you to ScubaBoard in the first place?

2) Are you satisfied that the board addresses your needs adequately? And if not what would you change, if you could to make it do so

3) Why do you think other folks who have joined, have not stayed around?

4) Do you have ideas on what the board either did not provide well, or what might have done to scare them away, without becoming participating members?

5) Do you have ideas or suggestions of new ways to both attract and keep new members, new divers involved, and satisfied with this forum?
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---------- Post added March 3rd, 2014 at 08:30 AM ----------

I will start by adding my own 2 cents.

I discovered SB while researching a dive trip back in '05, and was not a terribly active member for some time. I did though, find the info I was seeking.

I did soon after that did make some friends on the board, as both DeputyDan and Herman offered advice and invited my family to join their group for a trip to Bonaire.

I also later asked for underwater photography advice, and got a lot of help from such diverse members as ScubaSteve and DandyDon, who were more than willing to help a struggling novice.

I had a few conflicts in some of the threads along the way, especially early on, with some of the more vocal know it alls, but while that slowed me down a bit and kept me quiet, it did not scare me off. I just spent more time lurking till I became more comfortable standing up for my beliefs, and not afraid of the loud mouths. It just took me time to realize by lurking that they were a small minority, and not particularly as well respected universally as they might have thought, which made me feel less the outsider.

(Note) I think a lot of that 'know it all' attitude seems to have disappeared from the boards, or at least become far less of an issue. I heard a lot of feedback from non member divers between '95 and about 2000 that this "slamming of 'stupid questions' " was a big turn off, but I do not sense this same complaint from my more recent contactsd, when discussing SB. Now it seems more like SB is not supplying what divers are seeking, and they are just moving on to other sources of info.

I know many folks have moved on to FB, but while I enjoy FB a lot myself, I have never seen it as having the potential to reach as many divers, or to serve as a useful search base for dive related questions.

 

[AfterDark]

1) What attracted you to ScubaBoard in the first place?

I had some down time at work and did a search on diving forums, SB came up 1^st so I checked it out. After checking several others it was clear the most active site was SB. I joined and have enjoyed it ever since.

2) Are you satisfied that the board addresses your needs adequately? And if not what would you change, if you could to make it do so

Until a few months ago, yes. A few months ago SB was blocked by my employer’s security programs as being dangerous to systems security. SB provided me an interesting site actively dealing with a subject that has been a life long interest to me,when I had down time at work, which we can have a lot of waiting for tests to complete, systems to initialize etc. SB kept me occupied and awake (3^rd shift) since the block this is no longer the case. So today no. I'd changed whatever is causing SB to be blocked.

3) Why do you think other folks who have joined, have not stayed around?

Most people are thin skinned and/or have the attention span of a 2 year old. Why would we want some of these people around? Remember IdocSteve? Anyone sorry to see him go?

4) Do you have ideas on what the board either did not provide well, or what might have done to scare them away, without becoming participating members?

No
5) Do you have ideas or suggestions of new ways to both attract and keep new members, new divers involved, and satisfied with this forum?

Diving isn't enough? No.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

1) What attracted you to ScubaBoard in the first place?

I was looking more information on diving so I could learn and avoid any mishaps experienced by others or previously experienced by myself. Still trying to get a clue.

2) Are you satisfied that the board addresses your needs adequately? And if not what would you change, if you could to make it do so

Overall yes. I don't currently have any suggestions for improvements of content.

3) Why do you think other folks who have joined, have not stayed around?

People who do not stay around is simply because they do not see value in the content here. That could be for many reasons, including but not limited to: not being able to dive due to life changes, lost interest in diving (which is a sign of insanity), or turned off by the occasional contentious thread in which people become less than civil, or not having thick enough skin, as sometimes people have come clean with their mistakes and they get beat up pretty good.

4) Do you have ideas on what the board either did not provide well, or what might have done to scare them away, without becoming participating members?

No

5) Do you have ideas or suggestions of new ways to both attract and keep new members, new divers involved, and satisfied with this forum?

No. There is a wealth of information here. It is up to people to decide for themselves whether to take advantage of it. From discussions that I've read on SB, I've invested in more safety equipment: Nautilus Lifeline, SpareAir 3.0, plan on picking up a mirror. I did get a pouch that I can strap to my leg, nicely out of the way, don't impact my streamlining, but will have my SMB, finger reel, Nautilus, SpareAire, whistle, and when I get it, a mirror (won't always be having that though, but if I go to Indonesia....). I already have a duck call ... ahem ... DiveAlert. I've also found instructors for specific training that I want.

 

[Darnold9999]

1) What attracted you to ScubaBoard in the first place?

Was on my way to the GBR after vacation diving only for 20 years or so and wanted information. Got connected to an on line forum in Australia and found it extremely useful in finding places to stay, things to see and do while there. Decided to do more diving both locally and dive travel trips (as opposed to diving while vacationing). Looked around the net for information and SB seemed to be the best resource. Have been a moderately active member since.

2) Are you satisfied that the board addresses your needs adequately? And if not what would you change, if you could to make it do so

I find it a great resource for travel tips and recommendations. Also have been surprised at how useful the threads analysing accidents has been. Makes me think about what if, and I think makes me a better diver. Also surprising is how relatively useless the gear selection/recommendation threads are. Too many people shouting with too little knowledge or too much bias.

3) Why do you think other folks who have joined, have not stayed around?

Nature of the sport, and nature of the net. Most people get into diving, get really excited about it, and then get bored and move on to the next exciting thing in their life. If you are not diving, no real reason to stay connected. People come to the site with a question, it gets answered and they move on. Not everyone feels strongly enough about any particular issue to feel the need or desire to comment or contribute. If you are not contributing, and don`t have any questions that are being answered then no real reason to stay. Some will continue as social connections are made, but that is going to be only useful for a very limited number of people. Making it a more social site might actually make it less useful for the majority of those connecting as you would then have to wade through a bunch of conversation to get to the useful.

4) Do you have ideas on what the board either did not provide well, or what might have done to scare them away, without becoming participating members?

Think the board does what it does very well.

5) Do you have ideas or suggestions of new ways to both attract and keep new members, new divers involved, and satisfied with this forum?

Keep reining in the more aggressive members when attacking or criticising other members. By and large the moderators do an excellent job at this.

 

[bowlofpetunias]

1) What attracted you to ScubaBoard in the first place?

A Good friend and dive buddy who was a Mod at the time suggested we check it out.

2) Are you satisfied that the board addresses your needs adequately? And if not what would you change, if you could to make it do so

Yes I

develop cherished friendships (SBF's)
dive vicariously with those SBF's,
have managed to meet a number of SBF's
have traveled to stay/meet and dive with SBF's
have had SBF's travel to meet us and stay/dive with us

SB also provides me with valuable information and a great deal of entertainment.

3) Why do you think other folks who have joined, have not stayed around?

I am afraid some join SB like me with an "Ultrapolite Canadian Attitude" and perhaps a bit of a thin skin. Unlike me they may not be pig headed and are "put off" by some of the more aggressive posting styles. These are the ones that I personally hate to lose because they can help set the tone of the board and may have a massive amount to contribute. Some just lose interest and move on to another sport. Scuba is a sport that seems to have a high turn over due to health, expense and lifestyle changes. Ages and Stages

4) Do you have ideas on what the board either did not provide well, or what might have done to scare them away, without becoming participating members?

That is the hardest job for the Mods I think. Finding the balance between between the needs of the prolific, aggressive posters, the prolific and more laid back posters and the sensitivity of the new members not used to internet forums.

5) Do you have ideas or suggestions of new ways to both attract and keep new members, new divers involved, and satisfied with this forum?

I'd say the trick is to find the balance in point 4).

It isn't just about expecting the MODs to keep it nice but also the membership making their contribution by helping the board and the MODs make the place the best it can be. I would challenge every member to be part of the solution to whatever problems they see not part of the problem. I guarantee every Mod or Advisor has taken on their role in hopes of making this place better. If there is a staff member you relate to.. drop them a PM to help them in their efforts. (or perhaps just say thank you for fixing the thread I have been frustrated by etc)

I posted something along this line a long time ago. People come to Scubaboard for different reasons. Some come to socialize and have discussions with like minded people. There is a place for them in The Pub, Surface Interval, the Chat room and other locations depending on the topics. Some people come to learn. There are places for them in Basic, A & I and specific forums. Some come to teach others and there are lots of places for that to happen. Some to find dive buddies, holidays, destinations, shops and gear. Do a search, you will find it all here and with the right attitude you will gain SBF's to enrich your life!

 

[Dirty-Dog]

+1 for those who think there are problems with erratic moderation. I recently had a post deleted with the PM

Stop it. This is rude and off colour.

The post in question was a joking, mildly off colour comment, on a par with things you will hear regularly heard on prime time network TV. When I asked for a citation of the section of the TOS the post violated, I was told

Moderators have the ability and authority to exercise judgement.

So, although my comment was within the standards of the TOS ("Keep it PG"), it was erased on the whim of a moderator.

Moderation is necessary, and it's a difficult, thankless job (I know, because it's a job I do on another busy forum). But I post a lot less here these days, in large part because it seems rather pointless to make anything other than the blandest possible posts, knowing that moderators can and do delete posts on a whim. On the forum I help moderate, any mod who did this wouldn't be a moderator any longer.

I still encourage new divers to check out SB for the wealth of information available, and several have. But they don't stay long.

 

[The Kraken]

Keeping members . . . those who are truly passionate about diving will remain.
Like anything else, a person's interest in a new found hobby/sport will wane with time and, as a result, his activity and participation on the Board will reflect his interest in the hobby.

As for moderation, the moderators on the Board do an excellent job! They are not paid, and, more often than not, garner a great deal of acrimony if they sanction or take moderator actions upon a member.

Most posts are OPINIONS about the various and sundry topics being discussed. Needless to say, those who offer up an opinion believe it is absolutely correct . . . there are those with open minds, however, who come to the board and, after listening to those who have greater experience and knowledge, will amend their opinions. When opinions differ often times the members start behaving like spoiled children and, after a while, something needs to be done, that's when the moderator comes into play.

Are the moderators always right, no, but they do the best they can.

One reason some threads are moved, purged or what have you, is that the thought of the OP becomes completely lost in the ever widening scope of the resulting discourse.

Moderators have been removed because of over zealous moderation. Pete, along with his advisors, do all they possibly can to keep a good balance among the moderators.

I belong to several boards of this nature, not scuba related, and I can attest to the fact that this is one of the most civil and evenly moderated boards in which I've ever participated.

Let's all take a step back, look at what it is, enjoy it, provide constructive criticism and promote our hobby.

Safe dives . . .
Safer ascents,

the K

 

[gypsyjim]

As I read so far, I am beginning to see two different issues emerging.

One is that some folks drift in, find little to keep them involved with ScubaBoard and then drift on, never becoming active members. This seems a natural process, although it does indicate that there may be ways that SB could get more of these folks to stay and become involved, by trying to understand what might capture the interest of these new folks when they first drop in. We do have new member, welcoming forums, etc and this has me wondering if/what else might attract and keep the interest of new folks who first come in feeling like outsiders entering someone else's playground or club house where everyone else knows each other already.

The second issue I am hearing involves more active membership becoming disillusioned by what they see as unequal, unfair or biased moderating by some of the mods. This second issue seems to be one of the strongest reasons for active members becoming inactive, ex-members of the board. In threads I have been reading this issue seems to come up a lot more than the unfriendly, flaming, charges that I used to read of in threads. The flaming, divisiveness seems to have become much less of an issue in recent times, while perceptions of uneven or unfair moderation seems to have taken it's place as a hot topic.

Just last evening there was an angry dialog flying around on FB discussing charges that a SB mod recently banned a SB member on charges that were not investigated fully first, charges that were said to be not true. While I have no way of knowing any of the back story here, or weighing the truth, the perception of mods playing favorites, and applying rules unequally, and/or based on personal friendships, is a charge that I have heard much more often recently.

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I came to SB looking for info, and advice nearly 10 years ago now. I found friendship and reason to continue stay and, eventually, become active. I still do research and ask questions, but I have also come to enjoy the camaraderie of just conversing, and even debating issues daily with other divers about nearly everything from diving to politics. While I have occasionally taken issue with a decision or action by staff, or a mod, my personal interaction with mods has for the most part been fair and even handed even when they are in my opinion off base or catering to a vocal, irritating minority who are simply looking to be offended.

Personally, I wish for SB to continue to be THE place to come to discuss diving, meet new divers, research new destinations, techniques and gear, find buddies, and to just chat about the general (even non diving) stuff that effects us all. I wish for SB to continue to attract, satisfy and hold the attention of both the newer diver, and the long time friends I have come to cherish here.

 

[Buoyant1]

1) What attracted you to ScubaBoard in the first place?

I was a newbie, heard it was a place to learn from experienced divers, ask questions you didn't want to come out and ask during your instruction, for whatever reason, hear of new places to dive, meet people, hook up with dive operators, etc.

2) Are you satisfied that the board addresses your needs adequately? And if not what would you change, if you could to make it do so

It DID way back, but once I learned a lot more, I decided that some people just gave out their exclusive opinions rather than good solid information, and some of it got tiring...In some cases, it would be good to have certain information "pinned" so that the constant threads of "what kind of ______ should I get" could be avoided (as well as the people that then post "search is your friend") As far as locations, I think that's still a good bet, I know if I decided to go somewhere I haven't visited, I'd check there and ask questions.


3) Why do you think other folks who have joined, have not stayed around?

In some cases? over moderation! Other cases, just getting tired of the same stuff being rehashed over and over. I got tired of it, it fails to meet my basic needs anymore, and I stopped coming around... I DID come back for a few years in the more "social" forums, but those are the ones that are really subject to over moderation! Keeping bashing (both equipment and personal) or things that are obscene in check is fine, but some cases it seemed to get a little quick on the draw, and didn't let legitimate conversations, or legitimate arguments run their course. (reminding people that typing is one dimensional and with the lack of vocal inflection, even sarcasm was wrongly judged) People having conversations that aren't always "puppies and rainbows" doesn't always happen, even in real life. Warnings seem to NOT come when things happen in a lot of cases, and some moderators just seemed to have personal issues with certain people. The fact that some people get banned because they can't get along with certain moderators is a joke, and sometimes maybe there is a need to review what the moderator did, as opposed to what the purported "offender" happened to do.


4) Do you have ideas on what the board either did not provide well, or what might have done to scare them away, without becoming participating members?

I think as people become more experienced, they find other ways of socializing with other divers (Facebook is where I stay in contact with most of the people I've met here) This was good as a newbie, but as a more experienced diver, I found other resources (Deco Stop, but I mostly just read over there) and just talking to people I know, as we've all grown as divers. There are a lot of people that just seem to hover over things and continually make smart-ass or sarcastic comments that turn a lot of people off and lend no insight into diving. As another friend once said to me "Too many 'GD' know it alls on there" And at times, and in some subjects, I'd have to agree. You see the same people doing the same things...

5) Do you have ideas or suggestions of new ways to both attract and keep new members, new divers involved, and satisfied with this forum?

One of the things I thoroughly enjoyed was when you had the podcasts by Jill Heinerth, those were very informative, some of the threads involving John Chatterton and the U-Who were interesting, and insightful. If anything push the dive sight threads so people have a place to go and discuss potential trips! (and potential meet ups with locals) Leave the "social forums" more social, and stop over moderating them. I get it...nudity and profanity aren't good things in a public setting, but some of the over moderation tends to be just pinpointed at certain people...Maybe some of the social forums either need to be made "Rated R" and access by proof that you're 18, or member only.


Just my 2 cents....

 

[Wayward Son]

9 years ago, I most likely found SB due to a search & found it to be a really good site.

I made a lot of friends & acquaintances here & enjoy keeping up with them. For the last 3 years I have done almost no diving due to having relocated too far from the coast & not really enjoying the local mud hole AKA Madison Quarry. But I have always expected to be able to become more active at some point, hopefully will do some this year now that I'm almost on the coast. In the meantime I've enjoyed having SB to keep up with my friends, even though I haven't had much reason to roam out into the diving forums very much.

 

[raftingtigger]

I'll add to my previous comments:

After my son's recent confirmation of Asperger's syndrome (a form of high functioning Autism with social interaction issues) I realized that I too have many of the same issues, just milder. SB and FB are the first times in my life I have had an active social life. It introduces me to people, allows me to interact with text (my preferred way), and in many cases I then get to meet and socially interact in person. It feels great.