fins for long surface swim/fins for current

[invertgirl]

Hey all
I have been on a neverending search for good fins...I can never seem to find a pair that I even tolerate. The problem with my current pair (Tusa Tri-Ex) is that they really hurt my ankles and they tire out my legs quickly. I'd like to find the best fins for shore dives with long surface swims...and then a different pair for boat diving with a lot of current.
I've never had split fins, but I've spoken with lots of people who just love the Atomic split fin so I've been considering those for the shore dives, but I'm not sure. They're pretty expensive, so I want to get a lot of input before I go out and buy them.
I heard the Mares Volos are pretty good for open water dives. Do they have a lot of power for diving in currents?
Any info at all would be great!
Thanks

 

[covediver]

I have used the Apollo split fins for long surface swims and current dives and find it to be an all around excellent fin. It too is expensive, but works well. Along with my scuba pro jet fins (classic) that is about all the fin I need or want. So if the Atomic split works as well as an Apollo and you have one fin that does the work of two, it is actual economical, especially if you consider that my apollo fins are now eight years old and show no signs of aging.

 

[meesier42]

Force Fins.... nuff said

 

[xeon_intel]

Hi Invertgirl, let me share my experience on this, the same thing happened to me around 4 years ago,..i was researching on the internet for the 'perfect' fins,...i started with aqualung caravelle upon certificaton, and moved on to scubapro jetfin, twin jet, mares avanti, slingshots, apollo, and still couldn't find the perfect fins for me (u can imagine how much money i spent on those fins),..not until i discovered force fins around 2.5 years ago in my LDS. They looked different, open toe pocket, fins shape, and they are not flat. I was fascinated by the design and ended up buying a pair for myself. Long story short, i Tested it, and loved it instantly, i have no trouble kicking, it's like it's not even there, the fins worked well in currents (1-1.5knots in my experience) and calm waters, and i would never imagine myself underwater without them,...i sold all my fins before ForceFins and would never considered wearing other fins.

But again, fins are personal choices, i suggest trying as much as u can at your LDS pool before buying one. Dont go fins frenzy shopping and wasting your money on some crappy product that dont work for u,..but for me Forcefins are still the best fins out there,..

Excuse my grammar and typos, its hard to type using ipad :/

 

[TECreation]

It has been a while since your post but we at TECreation Development have solved your problem. The MaxAir swim fin, which is still in prototype stage, has been tested and shown to be the most air efficient recreational swim fin in the world. (We welcome challenges but no-one has stepped up.) Our objective testing has shown the MaxAir to use less air and get you there faster than any other fin we have tested. Check out our testing process at our website.

 

[tursiops]

It has been a while since your post but we at TECreation Development have solved your problem. The MaxAir swim fin, which is still in prototype stage, has been tested and shown to be the most air efficient recreational swim fin in the world. (We welcome challenges but no-one has stepped up.) Our objective testing has shown the MaxAir to use less air and get you there faster than any other fin we have tested. Check out our testing process at our website.

LOL. Your website shows a test against a TUSA split fin, used by someone who has no idea how best to kick with a split fin.
You have shown nothing except a poorly designed test. The turbulence test is at the suface, with a snorkeler, the worst possible location for figuring out how a fin works.

If you are serious about testing, let people try them. Only idiots would sign up for crowdfunding something based on so little decent information, from a person and company with no track record.

 

[dmaziuk]

Hey all
I have been on a neverending search for good fins...I can never seem to find a pair that I even tolerate. The problem with my current pair (Tusa Tri-Ex) is that they really hurt my ankles and they tire out my legs quickly. I'd like to find the best fins for shore dives with long surface swims...and then a different pair for boat diving with a lot of current.

The power comes from your legs, the only deal with fins is how well they transfer it into forward push. For the most part: how much power they lose in the process. Splits will lose more and be easier on the legs because of it. The trade-off is they'll be less efficient against a current. Cressi ARAs will probably give you the most power without going full freediving/spearfishing length but they will be tiring.

You might find this post interesting: http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ad...-manoeuvrability-post7524111.html#post7524111 -- actually read his other posts in that thread, they're useful information.

 

[TECreation]

We welcome your input. Tusa was only one of many fins tested and more will be tested before the crowdfunding is launched. No doubt there are differences in how each person swims with any particular fin. Please enlighten us on the correct swimming technique for the Tusa X-Pert Zoom. It takes 6 hours to run through the series of runs to test 3 pairs of fins using the protocol outlined on our website. We have tested Oceanic V6, Mares X-Stream, Mares Excel+,Tusa X-Pert Zoom, Hollis Bat, and ScubaPro Seawing and found them all wanting. It would be difficult to say the tester does not know how to use any of them after diving for 45 years.

The only testing protocol which I have identified which is more accurate regarding fin efficiency was done by the Navy and cost thousands if not hundreds of thousands of dollars. That involved swimming in a circular tank (a problem from the get go.) with an air supply attached which monitored the actual oxygen consumption. Needless to say that is out of reach right now for a small unknown startup such as us.

Other people have tried these fins and they love them. We are in a design revision cycle right now and once we have produced enough prototype fins to allow people to do meaningful testing we will do that. Our most likely venue will be at Blue Heron Bridge in Palm Beach FL. It has the benefit of a regular diving schedule, beach entry, and the possibility of strong current if one would like to try that. What we are doing now is letting people know this technology exists so when we put out the call for testers they will be ready.

The surface turbulence testing was only a simple test in a very limited condition. It was testing the turbulent wake not the efficiency of the fin at depth. If you have a few years we can go over every test that has been tried so far but I expect I have already exceed most folks attention span.

Finally, we are not asking for crowdfunding now. We are asking if this sounds interesting enough to keep informed on the subject. If it is then sign up.

When the split fin came out everyone poo-pooed it until they realized they were actually easier. They have had their run. Now it is time for MaxAir.

---------- Post added November 23rd, 2015 at 07:15 PM ----------

The power comes from your legs, the only deal with fins is how well they transfer it into forward push.

That is absolutely correct. TECreation has been working on that second part. How well they transfer it into forward push. Take a look at this thread Please wait
to see how this problem has been solved.

 

[REVAN]

LOL. Your website shows a test against a TUSA split fin, used by someone who has no idea how best to kick with a split fin.
You have shown nothing except a poorly designed test. The turbulence test is at the suface, with a snorkeler, the worst possible location for figuring out how a fin works.

If you are serious about testing, let people try them. Only idiots would sign up for crowdfunding something based on so little decent information, from a person and company with no track record.

I tried the TECreation MaxAir fins a few weeks ago just prior to the DEMA show in Orlando. The fin works! IMO: if you like the concept and want something better than the commercially available fins that are disappointing you, getting behind this fin is a safe bet from a crowdfunding perspective. I fully believe the man behind this operation is a person of integrity, and have very good reasons to proclaim this. PM me if you want to talk privately about details.

I know of many "idiots", as you like to call them, that have bought scuba fins based on a lot less information than what has been provided to you from this "company with no track record". What information did you get before buying your fins? I seriously doubt there was any information at all beyond conjecture and, 'well, it looks cool'. At least this company has taken the step to actually perform standardized tests, take measurements and publish the data (far more than your claim of showing nothing more than a poorly designed test).

If you were to do this same test, you'd probably find that your favorite fins actually suck. This is a low risk claim as statistically most scuba fins sold actually do suck. They are usually amazingly inefficient. Most divers just don't realize it because they don't test for things like efficiency, and instead use the feeling of resistance to gauge how effective the fin is. This has lead to a lot of fins in the market that do nothing to improve efficiency, but instead they are optimized to waste energy so you can feel like you are working hard.

Bottom line is, don't be such a Negative Nancy! It makes you look petty.

Oh, one more thing: It is a little impossible to "let people try them" BEFORE funding the manufacturing to actually make them. It is not reasonable to run a large scale demo with rediculously expensive one-off prototypes. I was fortunate to get the opportunity to actually try it. It is my obligation as someone with rare information to speak up to disseminate that information, and I am glad to do it.

 

[tursiops]

I tried the TECreation MaxAir fins a few weeks ago just prior to the DEMA show in Orlando. The fin works! IMO: if you like the concept and want something better than the commercially available fins that are disappointing you, getting behind this fin is a safe bet from a crowdfunding perspective. I fully believe the man behind this operation is a person of integrity, and have very good reasons to proclaim this. PM me if you want to talk privately about details.

I know of many "idiots", as you like to call them, that have bought scuba fins based on a lot less information than what has been provided to you from this "company with no track record". What information did you get before buying your fins? I seriously doubt there was any information at all beyond conjecture and, 'well, it looks cool'. At least this company has taken the step to actually test and publish data (far more than your claim of showing nothing more than a poorly designed test).

If you were to do this same test, you'd probably find that your favorite fins actually suck. This is a low risk claim as statistically most scuba fins sold actually do suck. They are usually amazingly inefficient. Most divers just don't realize it because they don't test for things like efficiency, and instead use the feeling of resistance to gauge how effective the fin is. This has lead to a lot of fins in the market that do nothing to improve efficiency, but instead they are optimized to waste energy so you can feel like you are working hard.

Bottom line is, don't be such a Negative Nancy! It makes you look petty.

Oh, one more thing: It is a little impossible to "let people try them" BEFORE funding the manufacturing to actually make them. It is not reasonable to run a large scale demo with rediculously expensive one-off prototypes. I was fortunate to get the opportunity to actually try it. It is my obligation as someone with rare information to speak up to disseminate that information, and I am glad to do it.

I'm not impugning his integrity. I'm impugning his business plan and his lack of a technical description of how he thinks his fins work. Saying he has little airfoils is disingenuous and really unhelpful....saying he has run a CFD program on it is interesting but meaningless without an explanation of what he did. And saying over and over that they are wonderful and people like them is both irritating and uninformative. People like broccoli too; I don't. Give us fluid-dynamic technical types a break and give us some real information. Oh, and just how is it that people like them but they are not available to try? Carefully picked acquaintances as testers is not compelling. His test videos are turnoffs; horrible kicks. Can you frog kick with them? Split fins require rapid short strokes to be efficient, since all you are doing is kicking off lots of counter-rotating shed vortices, each providing a little propulsion. That whole "nature's wing" thing is a misunderstanding and thus misrepresentation of how they work. I'm guessing the same confusion exists with these.