Florida Fossil Permit

[Fossilbabe]

Quote: Of course it looks like they can "request" that you "donate" some of your finds to them.
This is a good point but really they have most of the things you finding. Most likely in way better shape than whats been rolling around on the ocean floor. It has never been a problem to donate something to them. I'm sure if you showed them some of the things that have been found they wouldnt want you to donate it. Humm lets see I found 300+ Dugone rib bones how many do you think the flmnh would want? Even better yet what if ever diver found 300+ dugone rib bones as well. FLMNH can only hold so many dugone rib bones. Now if it is a complete mammoth was laying on the ocean floor undisturbed, they would send someone out to check it out. Hope that this helps everyone. Thanks for the input everyone,we are all learning here today...

 

[FLRiverDiver]

If you google "Florida Fossil Permit" your first selection will be the FLMNH web page citing the pertinent info on the permit. The main points on a permit for vertebrate collecting hinges on whether you would be classified as a "systematic" collector or not. Reading the conditions for being a systematic collector you will see that practically all casual diving would not fall under those requirements-- and thus would not require a pemit.

As stated in the previous post, the Museum has more fossils in storage than you could believe. Being a past President of the FL Paleontological Society and having visited the museum's fossil storage areas many times back in the late 70's and 80's I can assure you they have (even back then) countless specimens. This isn't to say that something of interest to them cannot still be found, and if suspected to be something noteworthy, by all means, permit or not, they should be made aware of it. In this instance, more than likely if they need to keep the specimen--you can possibly expect a cast of the find.

Back during the promulgation of these rules I argued against the gallon volume portion of the rule--as, to me, it is too subjective and arbituary. I know systematic collectors of small vertebrate fossils that will hardly collect a "gallon" of fossils in their lifetime, and conversly a one time visitor (hardly a systematic collector) could stumble onto a mammoth legbone and be in need of a permit as it's volume exceeds a "gallon." Reading the rules you'll see I lost the argument!

FLRiverDiver

 

[Law5Guy]

"Systematic collection" is hereby characterized by one or more of the following three features:

3. the collection, acquisition, excavation, salvage, exhumation or restoration of vertebrate fossils at a site on more than three days or a maximum of twenty-four hours during a period of one year.

So.. if I go to to Venice more than three days per year... I become a 'systematic' collector... and thus need a permit, no?

In looking further.. Florida Statutes 1004.576 Destruction, purchase, and sale of vertebrate fossils prohibited, exceptions; field investigation permits required; penalty for violation states:

2) Any person who, in violation of this section, engages in any of the activities described in subsection (1) without first having obtained a permit to engage in such activity commits a misdemeanor, punishable by a fine not to exceed $500 or by imprisonment in the county jail for a period not to exceed 6 months, or both; and, in addition, he or she shall forfeit to the state all specimens, objects, and materials collected and excavated in violation of this section, together with all photographs and records relating to such materials.

(3) The Florida Museum of Natural History may institute a civil action in the appropriate circuit court for recovery of any unlawfully taken vertebrate fossil. The fossil shall be forfeited to the state if the Florida Museum of Natural History shows by the greater weight of the evidence that the fossil has been taken from a particular site within this state and that the person found in possession of the fossil is not authorized by law to possess such fossil.


Hmm... better to play safe than sorry. Spending $5 now can save me $500 and 6 months in jail and ... my prized manatee rib bone.

 

[Gilldiver]

That's true in the Atlantic, but this is the Gulf where state waters extend 9 miles.

but in no event shall the term "boundaries" or the term "lands beneath navigable waters" be interpreted as extending from the coast line more than three geographical miles into the Atlantic Ocean or the Pacific Ocean, or more than three marine leagues into the Gulf of Mexico, except that any boundary between a State and the United States under this Act [43 USC § § 1301-1315] which has been or is hereafter fixed by coordinates under a final decree of the United States Supreme Court shall remain immobilized at the coordinates provided under such decree and shall not be ambulatory;
From Section 1301—Definitions Submerged Lands Act.

Well, you learn something new ever day. I had never heard of a special condition for the Gulf. The 3 leagues goes back to a court case in 1960. I bet it has some parts that date back to the Spanish and French ocupation along the Texas and La coasts.

 

[Sh@rkW@tcher]

The state waters of Texas extend out 12 miles as agreed on by annexation treaty between the Republic of Texas and the United States in 1846 when Texas agreed to join the Union. Texas was also granted the right to fly it's state flag the same height as the US Flag. When oil was discovered offshore of Texas the federal gov't attempted to claim that "submerged land" for revenue and tax purposes. Federal court upheld the treaty and states rights in a 1960 court case.

 

[pjohnson]

The permit is $5 and you are helping to track fossilized natural history, rather than just storing rocks in your closet. I for one think it is well worth the effort and expense. Whether or not it is required is immaterial in my opinion, I think it is pretty cool that information and fossils we find may be included in record of prehistoric material. Pay the fee and submit the required information on your finds (maybe even give away some of your cool stuff). Am I right in thinking that sharing information, research and education is really what this is all about anyway?

 

[vtownmike]

haha i dont have one... arrest me

 

[pjohnson]

You probably won't get arrested, but what is the right thing to do? Be a hoarder or share your knowledge and finds?

 

[Fossilbabe]

In florida if you picking up a arrowhead it was legal. Or a musket ball,old bottles ect in florida rivers.
The state asked everyone that found anything like this to report it to them so they could keep a record of such finds. Letting the state do some research on the area ,learn more about florida history. Instead they got: ( found these points on the river) (and being sold on ebay, and various shows) Well we are no longer allowed to pick up points,old bottles,ect. Its something that I didnt want to happen but it did. No matter how many thousands of signatures I got put on the petitions, they still passed the law. Its just point to ponder..........

 

[CaptEsteban]

Yep ! Fl. is quite liberal with those who collect fossils. I hated it too, when they stopped the collecting & reporting of artifacts,,, but that was mostly the fault of some divers . Hopefully, fossil collecting will remain open to us. Just please GO ahead & pay the $5 .