Getting the right equipment and setup for future solo / self reliance

[Darrel Conger]

I don't solo dive yet and may never technically but I was born the cautious type and really admire solo divers and the self reliance and safety aspects they bring to everyone who will listen and learn. I may take the SDI course next year but I need to log more dives.

As the season get close to ending here, I am considering what equipment to buy this winter/fall and what to modify on current setup. Here is what I basically have now.

Zeagle Brigade (Ranger with a 35lb Bladder)
Aeris ION Second, Swiv Octo, and DT-400 1st Stage
SMB with Spool in zipper mount in deploy bag between jacket and wing
Spare Air in zipper mount between wing and jacket (don't groan I only use it on dives to 30 feet. Its my air till I grab my buddy. Just in case)
Tech bag on BC with EMT Knife, Teflon coated EMT Shears, Mirror, Whistle.

I have borrowed a 19cf pony tank and dived with it slung under my chest. It was a workable size. I worry about the 30 being too large.

For sure I intend to purchase a 19 or a 30 pony bottle. Most of my diving is 30 feet but I would like to be good for an emergency at 70 to 80 the max I care to dive to right now.


My questions:

Should I guy a 19 or 30?

Slung or mounted to side of AL80. Zeagle sells a great mount for these. The 19 can be held with just 1 strap and the 30 requires 2 and removing the weight pocket on that side.

Buy a 1st stage and attach my current oct with a small spg or buy whole new first stage and 2nd stage regulator and one of those small spg's that screw into the 1st stage? How long a hose for upside down mount on BC or bungeed on Pony bottle for slinging.

During annual service should I have my regular regulator put on a longer hose.

Should I wear the regulator from the Pony on a necklace if its slung or just if its back mounted?

Buy and expensive regulator with bells and whistles or just a well made unbalanced one?

There are not a lot of pics around of the sling setups and I have not really seen anyone at the local lake/quarry with them. Any pics would be appreciated.

Thanks everyone.

 

[DevonDiver]

Sidemount is a useful option for solo divers - and provides a 'one-stop' solution to many of the risks faced when solo diving, with ample gas capacity and redundancy. Training and equipment for sidemount is increasingly available now.

Failing that, a large capacity back-mounted cylinder, in addition to a calculated reserve/pony, is the fall-back.

How big should the pony be? What's your SAC (and elevated SAC) and what depth/conditions will you be using it under?

Many will agree that the pony should be slung. There's plenty of threads and web article describing the proper configuration for a slung tank.

and finally....

 

[vladimir]

Spare Air in zipper mount between wing and jacket (don't groan I only use it on dives to 30 feet. Its my air till I grab my buddy. Just in case)

It's pretty easy to swim to the surface from 30 feet, isn't it?

 

[Searcaigh]

A 30 cu ft is manageable, I have moved to this from a 13 cu ft and carry a housed camera with double strobes. It is the same diameter as a 13 but longer.

As DD mentions above you need to calculate your SAC rate in order to determine what size pony you need for a specific depth.

As for mounting, you can mount it on your main tank, however you will have better control and access if you side mount it, I tried both options years ago and then settled with side mounting a 13, but now I use the 30 since I did the PADI Self Reliant course, as it suits my SAC rate and the general maximum depth I normally dive to locally (22M). For deeper diving (30M) I will side sling and AL50.

Buy a 1st stage and attach my current oct with a small spg or buy whole new first stage and 2nd stage regulator and one of those small spg's that screw into the 1st stage? How long a hose for upside down mount on BC or bungeed on Pony bottle for slinging.

First stage with Octo is fine, however I prefer an SPG on a 6" hose, easier to read than one of these button ones.

The hose on my second stage is 7' for easier donation should that happen. It is bungeed appropriately for quick release.

During annual service should I have my regular regulator put on a longer hose.

Up to you, but it is not required, however think about it this way if an OOA diver grabs your primary second stage, do you want them right in your face? My second stage is also on a 7' hose, I do not have an Octopus on my primary first stage.

Should I wear the regulator from the Pony on a necklace if its slung or just if its back mounted?

Again up to you, what are you comfortable with? However if side slung, best bungeed IMHO, you can bungee a back mount too provided you are able to reach it easily, and if you go that way, you need to practice retrieving it. If it came loose for some reason would you be aware of this? => Side mount is the best option

Buy and expensive regulator with bells and whistles or just a well made unbalanced one?

Assume this is for the pony, use a simple one, or if you want to replace your current one, move that to the pony and buy the new bells and whistles one for your primary set up ..... I sense that you want to spend money on this go ahead and do it if it makes you happy, retail therapy is not just for women in shopping malls, us guys at least spend it on stuff that is useful (No offence to any of SB female members)

There are not a lot of pics around of the sling setups and I have not really seen anyone at the local lake/quarry with them. Any pics would be appreciated.

I will post mine once Photobucket starts behaving, but have posted it previously elsewhere on SB


Edited to add:

You need a second SMB, and preferably a second mask, it's all about redundancy

 

[Darrel Conger]

I don't know about getting up from 30 feet in a fully ooa accident. My feeling is a lot of people are sure they could do it who probably can't. Panic is powerful enemy. One factor I don't think they factor in is that in a fully ooa moment they are not going to be able to put air in their BC except manually. Look at the DAN statistics on divers who drown and most still had their weights on. Since its something most don't practice its easily put to the back of the task list in an emergency where the next breath is the #1 priority.

Very good points. Thanks everyone. Especially about sac rate. I tend to be a heavy breather as it is. I am going to try and borrow a 30 to at least sling for a trial. I would bet my LDS would probably let me at least harness one up in their pool. They are pretty good about that sort of stuff.

I had not really thought about side mount for the pony but I am sure I can find some training in the Dallas area. I need to do some more reading. I also just bought my first camera so side mount may have other advantages.

I am not into retail therapy at all just willing to spend a little extra for a little bit more safety.

Thanks for the tip on the spg. My first thought was just a small one screwed into the port on the first stage.

I have been carrying an extra mask that actually the same as my primary a Hog Predator. I keep it an extra EMT knife and a folding snorkel in a pouch off my cummerbund. I also stick my "death clip" caribener from my D ring that I hang my mask and fins on when getting into the water while diving.

I think at the moment it sounds like at the very least I should I get dependable first stage to connect my current octo to with a longer hose that can be bungeed. Another SPG with a 6 foot hose (can you bungee a high pressure hose easily?) I will also get a 7 foot hose put on my primary when things go in for service this winter.
I will probably get a 30 but I want to try one first. Slung or Side mount I need to get some training either way. Sound like fun and thank you all.

One item I am curious about is the tank valve. All of the ones I have seen lately are the XS scuba ones with red green indicators. They are huge. Do they make a smaller format K value? Since I am going to buy at least a 1st stage should I consider a din valve for my pony?

I may be overcautious but I think there are a lot of lessons to be learned from the solo and tech diving communities. Even though I have a great dive buddy for 90 percent of my dives, I have played the mental game of how long would it take for me to get his attention and get his octo in my head over and over. In all cases it was longer than I cared for if I was panicked. I have come to really think that a fully redundant air supply should be taught from the beginning right along with air sharing with your buddy. I know it adds extra cost and time but it seems like the right thing to do.

Thanks everyone. I appreciate your taking your time. I love reading your adventures and advice in the forum.

---------- Post Merged at 10:58 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 10:41 AM ----------

I have been accused of being overcautious before but I saw something kind of funny at a high end bike shop in San Antonio. They sell a device called a "Restube" made in Germany that are popular with people biking around the river. It straps around the waist and is about the size of cell phone. It has a self deploying water rescue tube for those cyclist who suddenly find themselves in the water. I never knew that was a problem. Its also evidently popular with open water swimmers. Never would have thought of needing a flotation device for cycling.

 

[DevonDiver]

I don't know about getting up from 30 feet in a fully ooa accident. My feeling is a lot of people are sure they could do it who probably can't.

I suggest the 30 seconds taken to ascent from 30ft to the surface is quite comparable to the amount of time it'd take to recognize your OOA issue, look around for your buddy, make a decision on what to do, then deploy your Spare Air...

Panic is powerful enemy.

Tell me about it... which is why many would suggest that deploying a Spare Air is neither the simplest, nor most panic-reducing option.

One factor I don't think they factor in is that in a fully ooa moment they are not going to be able to put air in their BC except manually. Look at the DAN statistics on divers who drown and most still had their weights on. Since its something most don't practice its easily put to the back of the task list in an emergency where the next breath is the #1 priority.

Unless you regularly dive negatively buoyant... you don't need to add air to a BCD on ascent... do you?

It's kind 'factored in', on that basis..

Especially about sac rate. I tend to be a heavy breather as it is. I am going to try and borrow a 30 to at least sling for a trial. I would bet my LDS would probably let me at least harness one up in their pool.

Just remember to account for the issue of panic. There's little point judging an emergency air source capacity based on a non-emergency breathing rate.

I had not really thought about side mount for the pony but I am sure I can find some training in the Dallas area. I need to do some more reading. I also just bought my first camera so side mount may have other advantages.

Here's an outline article on sidemount: Sidemount Diving | Course Notes | Advanced Scuba

There's no need for a pony at all with sidemount... you have two primary cylinders - both of which retain ample air to allow a leisurely ascent in the event of the other failing..

Thanks for the tip on the spg. My first thought was just a small one screwed into the port on the first stage.

IMHO, they're notorious for unreliability.

Also.. bear in mind that on an emergency air source... you need the function in an emergency. When that happens, allowing for existing stress, you will value simplicity and ease of access. A slung pony, with metal SPG on a 6" hose, allows for greater ease of access... to both the gas supply, the regulator and for reading the SPG. Don't underestimate how easy access to read your SPG can help reduce stress... you don't want to be guessing/worrying about your air in an emergency... and reading the contents shouldn't prove difficult or add undue demands on the diver.

I have been carrying an extra mask that actually the same as my primary a Hog Predator. I keep it an extra EMT knife and a folding snorkel in a pouch off my cummerbund. I also stick my "death clip" caribener from my D ring that I hang my mask and fins on when getting into the water while diving.

I think at the moment it sounds like at the very least I should I get dependable first stage to connect my current octo to with a longer hose that can be bungeed. Another SPG with a 6 foot hose (can you bungee a high pressure hose easily?) I will also get a 7 foot hose put on my primary when things go in for service this winter.

You don't need a 7' hose if solo diving is your aim. Neither do you need a longer pony/stage regulator hose, for any aim... if it is staged.

Hose management is another stress factor in an emergency. K.I.S.S.

I may be overcautious but I think there are a lot of lessons to be learned from the solo and tech diving communities.

True - but keep in mind that the benefits primarily arise from practical fluency - not hypothetical understanding gleaned from the internet.

Decent tech/solo training provides the greatest benefits from allowing exposure to high degrees of task-loading and simulated scenarios that increase stress. Discovering your true ability level under those demands can be considered a starting point into advanced diving. It's far too easy to convince yourself of perceived ability without such experiences... and that can lead to a very flawed risk-capability relationship.

It's the old Sun Tzu wisdom... know your enemy, know yourself. Risk and capability both need to be understood.

 

[Searcaigh]

Another SPG with a 6 foot hose

That would be a 6 inch hose

 

[DevonDiver]

That would be a 6 inch hose

Some guys have trouble defining an accurate 6" LMAO

 

[Searcaigh]

Some guys have trouble defining an accurate 6" LMAO

That's why women are bad at parking cars

 

[Darrel Conger]

To my defense I have never actually seen side mounts except on the extreme cave diving video from National Geographic. I was thinking of something totally different. I think slung will have to do. Okay six inches. Thanks everyone.