Have you ever done anything on a dive that you KNEW you weren't supposed to?

[kathydee]

I learned to dive in SE Asia where I was taught to let DM's plan and guide our dives. There was a cavern zone at Sipadan, Malaysia Borneo which the DM said was safe. Disregarding my OW training, which explicitly said no overhead diving, we entered and penetrated past the warning sign on budget rental equipment. As our only light source, my very supportive instabuddy and I shared a very weak dive light which barely illuminated the bottom. We did keep the cavern opening in sight but it seemed to recede into the distance.

From what I can recall, the cavern zone of Turtle Cave has a gravel bottom and there are no off-shoot tunnels except in the back. I have no idea how far we penetrated, in reality probably not that far (but deep enough to surpass training limits).

In retrospect I know the main problems were that it was a trust-me dive beyond my training limits with a new to me dive buddy, we passed the warning sign, had no decent lighting or training in overhead procedure, were using questionable rental equipment and the space was packed with divers and chaos.

I remember holding the hand of my partner to make sure he was there if I needed him. I don't think we could have seen each other in the dark or signaled for help to solve the issues if our equipment had failed, which thankfully it didn't.

At the time I knew I was exceeding OW training limits and felt nervous about doing so. I really didn't want to put the advice of the DM above my instructor and training material. However, at 35ish logged dives I had no way to comprehend the actual risks, and caved in to the peer pressure to follow because all the other clients were doing so (which I recognize now to be a recipe for potential disaster).

Having logged about 800 dives and earned full cave and wreck penetration certification since Turtle Cave - I can clearly see the dangers of having wandered into an overhead without training.

If a diver feels the passion/desire/compulsion to move past the limits stamped on their certification card, I highly recommend seeking proper training before launching the new adventure,

Some wise diver once said: "If you have the feeling underwater - I really shouldn't be doing this - then you probably shouldn't "

 

[TMHeimer]

I have touched the reef there I said it please recommend a penance.

No penance fro me, being a shell collector. I have broken my self-imposed rule of no more than 30' on a solo dive several times--when it looked benign. As mentioned, I assume few of us have not broken rules or pushed the limits once or twice.

 

[lamont]

I've been good since 2008. Of course that means that between 2003 and 2008 i was bad at least once.

The problem that I have with these threads is that it can be seen as encouraging this kind of behavior in newer divers. It starts to become "everybody does it" and that may lead to some abuse. You start seeing cave 1 divers creeping off to do cave 2 dives with cave 2 divers (and sometimes C1 divers going into C2 cave by themselves), people pushing depth limits when they're not ready -- and running off and trying to get the quickest and cheapest and lowest bar training in order to get helium to go to 150-180 feet and be one of the cool kids too. None of that is very smart, though, so I don't really want to encourage it.

And as a C2 diver I've never broken a C1 diver's limits, and never pushed a rec diver beyond their depth limits or capacity, and that's a line which I'm aiming to hold.

I also didn't have a change of heart due to any one incident, I just came to see it as sophomoric, and that you should just get the experience and get the training.

 

[Token]

I really appreciate people listing the things they've done that they weren't supposed to do. But what I would really like to hear is how you convinced yourself that it was okay . . . if other divers are to learn anything from what we have done, they have to recognize the syndrome of "I know I'm not supposed to, but . . . "

Okay... A while back I was doing my first serious cold-water dive [Vancouver Is.] I was having trouble with my new gear, but the people I was diving with were very tolerant, even when I called a couple of dives for myself [I was wearing a 7-mil semidry and was having huge problems with buoyancy.

Anyway, this one dive, I was supposed to go down the anchor buoy line, in bad viz, and wait at the bottom [50-60 ft] for another couple [instructor and student] and we would do a wall transit as a trio. I went down...I waited, dunno how long but it seemed like many minutes. My buddies didn't show up.

Viz was okay at my depth; my wall was right there, and I knew the direction we were all going. Buddies still didn't show up. My buoyancy at that depth seemed [at last!] pretty good. My gear [new reg set and computer AND BCD along with the semidry] seemed to be preforming the way it should [at last!]. Still no buddies.

At this point I knew I faced a choice. I should surface and see what was going on. If I did this, however, I would probably miss my buddies for sure and for sure they would miss me and my dive would be over after barely beginning. Since my party was was all heading in the same direction along the wall at the same depth for 30 min, chances were I'd meet up with them if I did the same thing. Had the boat moved? I wasn't sure. Soooo....

I took off and did a solo wall dive. I saw an octopus, and fish, and some weird anemones. After about 25 minutes, I was down to 700psi, so I headed for the surface. I did a partial safety stop [gave up fighting my buoyancy at 15ft.] and surfaced about 100 yds. from the boat...I was the first person out of the water.

State of mind? I knew I was in a somewhat tricky spot, but I didn't feel I was in any real danger. I wasn't terribly deep, I had air, and surfacing was far from a problem...my semidry wanted to bob like a cork [not really a weighting problem...at depth, I was too heavy by a bit]. Topside weather was calm and I felt certain my boat captain would pick me up with no problems...our dive route wasn't that long. In fact, I suspected I'd meet up with my dive party at some point [I was wrong, but hey...]. And I WANTED to do that dive. My trip was shaping up for a big disappointment, and _any_ dive that seemed at all successful was looking like a major win. So I did it. The safer alternatives didn't look that good to me, at least not at the time. And let's face it, does anybody go diving if they aren't looking for a bit of an adventure, and can accept some risks?

No repercussions. Since I was the most inexperienced diver in the group, I'd been sent to the surface alone for pickup before. The buddies I was supposed to hook up with seemed puzzled that I had disappeared on them, but figured I had joined another dive team in the party. I was feeling embarrassed about the whole thing and avoided discussing the matter.

I think the basic thing is that you don't really feel you're in danger...until you really are. I suppose I could have come to grief...but I didn't. I don't think I'd do this again though.

 

[Teamcasa]

I've been pretty good lately but I only dive recreationally, I rarely go below 100' and am vigilant in my slow accents and safety stops. As for cave diving, it just not my cup of tea so no worries there. I do however, bend a few rules, like using brass snaps and flip-fins.

In the spirit of telling about my mistakes, here goes one. I rushed getting setup and somehow missed the loop on my crotch strap. After splashing and descending to 60 or so, I noticed the problem. Well, like a dumbass, I pulled the weight belt buckle instead. Down it went and up I began to go. Luckily, I was quick to dump all the air in my BC and kicked down hard as my lovely bride reached for me with one hand and my weight belt with the other. Problem solved and the buckles are now in different places and one is painted foe easy ID.

 

[freewillie]

I've been good since 2008. Of course that means that between 2003 and 2008 i was bad at least once.

The problem that I have with these threads is that it can be seen as encouraging this kind of behavior in newer divers. It starts to become "everybody does it" and that may lead to some abuse. You start seeing cave 1 divers creeping off to do cave 2 dives with cave 2 divers (and sometimes C1 divers going into C2 cave by themselves), people pushing depth limits when they're not ready -- and running off and trying to get the quickest and cheapest and lowest bar training in order to get helium to go to 150-180 feet and be one of the cool kids too. None of that is very smart, though, so I don't really want to encourage it.

And as a C2 diver I've never broken a C1 diver's limits, and never pushed a rec diver beyond their depth limits or capacity, and that's a line which I'm aiming to hold.

I also didn't have a change of heart due to any one incident, I just came to see it as sophomoric, and that you should just get the experience and get the training.

I wouldn't say that these threads encourage risk taking behavior or cutting safety corners in new divers. I'm still fairly new to this sport, and I like these threads as a way to avoid other's mistakes in my own diving. Is there anything here on this thread or in SB in general that I can apply to my own routines either before, during, or after that makes diving safer.

It is one thing to get the training and experience, it is another to adhere to training. In keeping with this thread is there a deviation from training that you knew you were doing but did anyways. And the problem with experience is you just have to get out and do it.

I have a saying about experience. Good judgement comes from experience, experience comes from poor judgement.

Did I do something I knew was wrong but did anyways? Maybe in retrospect that wasnt' the best of ideas. Sometimes we don't know until we don't think is was that bad until we look back and say, "what the heck was I thinking."

Me, I like these threads because I get to add wisdom without having the deal with dubious situations myself.

 

[lamont]

I wouldn't say that these threads encourage risk taking behavior or cutting safety corners in new divers. I'm still fairly new to this sport, and I like these threads as a way to avoid other's mistakes in my own diving. Is there anything here on this thread or in SB in general that I can apply to my own routines either before, during, or after that makes diving safer.

It is one thing to get the training and experience, it is another to adhere to training. In keeping with this thread is there a deviation from training that you knew you were doing but did anyways. And the problem with experience is you just have to get out and do it.

I have a saying about experience. Good judgement comes from experience, experience comes from poor judgement.

Did I do something I knew was wrong but did anyways? Maybe in retrospect that wasnt' the best of ideas. Sometimes we don't know until we don't think is was that bad until we look back and say, "what the heck was I thinking."

Me, I like these threads because I get to add wisdom without having the deal with dubious situations myself.

Well, it may be that >90% of divers deal with the info responsibly.

But there seems to be a prevalent attitude of the <10% who knowingly break the rules that 'everyone does it'. So, I just don't want to be part of that message that *those* people are hearing.

 

[DaleC]

I really don't believe in social engineering. We could say that knowledge can be used by those it shouldn't be used by but at the same time we could say that knowledge withheld could have be used by those it could have helped.

I don't tell people to either do or don't do what I have done but personally I still believe that, if given the opportunity, most people will do the right thing, most of the time.

 

[Dirty-Dog]

Well, it may be that >90% of divers deal with the info responsibly.

But there seems to be a prevalent attitude of the <10% who knowingly break the rules that 'everyone does it'. So, I just don't want to be part of that message that *those* people are hearing.

Those people are going to take insane risks and ignore every safety standard regardless of the existence of non- of this (or similar) thread. Like Lynne I find it interesting to hear what thinking (or lack of) went into peoples decision to bend or ignore the usual guidelines. I've done it myself, with the cenote tours, and I'll likely do it again under the same circumstances. These specific, carefully controlled circumstances are, in my opinion, a fine example of why guidelines are guidelines and not Commandments From On High.

As we say in EMS... you can't fix stupid.

 

[Bob DBF]

Your notion is that unless you recieve training for a certain specialty you will never be competent to undertake said specialty.......an that is insane.

I truly don't understand where you got that out of what I wrote. If it was the "4 dives makes you a wreck diver", that was just to point out the absurdity of the concept.

Diving my first 17 years without a card, I believe less in formal training and more in research and gradually removing limitations on one's actions underwater. Diving with more experienced divers, aquireing an understanding of dangers of a planned dive, knowing my own abilities, and being able to say F*** you to more "experienced" divers stupid dive plans have kept me out of a real jackpot.

I have picked up cards recently, but with the exception of Nitrox, the purpose was not for my diving although I did pick up a few things.



Bob
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I may be old, but I’m not dead yet.

A man's got to know his limitations.
Harry Callahan