I'm the Pariah again

[TSandM]

I think Matt needs to see the dynamics of good buddy teams in action. How they communicate, how they plan a dive or dives, how they move in the water together, and in so doing may end of developing a new outlook himself and perhaps learn more effective measures of picking a buddy and planning a dive with them. As well as some new methods of communicating with the boat and others who may be part of the dive. What myself and others want to see is no more posts from him about how a dive went south or he got his feelings hurt.

The whole post is beautiful, Jim, but this is the best part.

 

[AaronRiot]

I dunno...I felt like my AOW was an extension of OW...and I had no issues. Maybe it's an individual kinda thing and Certs shouldn't come with a guaranteed green light. But that's a different topic...

And the thread/dive being referred to, Mike, wasn't Devils Throat... Palancar Caves.

 

[redacted]

She's good at that.

And regardless of what Matt wants he is going to find out that there are times when it's not always wise to have your mind set in stone when it comes to this activity. Unless it involves not using a spare air. That's a good rule.

Given a choice between spare air and no air, I think I could make an exception.

---------- Post Merged at 11:10 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 11:10 AM ----------

Where is Matt? All these invitations....


I think the forum rules need to be changed.

I think the OP should be required to make a post to any thread they initiate on a frequency not less than once every 2,000 posts..

And they should respond to an OK signal.

 

[The Chairman]

OK, so far I gave you offers for me to drive down to meet for lunch, a Belmar Basin dive that probably wouldn't hit 7 feet at high tide, and now a popular 60' training site. No courtesy of reply for any...

There are a lot of ways to say "No thanks" and a non-reply is one of them. I offered to dive with Matt in Cozumel and we had two very enjoyable dives and a bit of conversation about going deep. You know, I don't think Matt took all of my advice to heart, but that doesn't make him a bad person or even a bad diver. Awareness takes time to develop and often the logic and wisdom of some advice will elude those who don't have enough experience. It's easy to get upset when someone does not follow your advice or accept an offer, but what's the real message being sent by them? They just don't trust you enough to take you up on the offer. Trust is a two way street and it's rarely won by a display of anger or aggression. Trust comes with experience with a mentor and is augmented by the mentor's patience.

If you don't like divers, why do you continue to throw bait into the water? Just do what you want and stop trying to justify it to yourself.

It's my opinion that Matt likes people and even likes divers. He actually expresses a number of fears and disappointments that any number of newish divers have to deal with but most are afraid or are unable to express. Yeah, I get that there are a number of respondents that just don't have the insight or patience to deal with his insecurities, but surely you can see that playing whack-a-mole is mostly counter productive in these cases. Not to single you out, but Matt's intention was not to throw bait in the water to be attacked. I believe he wants to chanxge his behavior so he doesn't become the "pariah" over and over again. He's looking for answers he can understand and not some sort of cyber smack down.

I put you on "Ignore".

Oh the drama! Ya, rly. There's no need to tell someone this unless you're trying to elicit a negative response of some sort. It's condescending and anything but helpful. But that's just my opinion.

 

[lowviz]

...//... Trust is a two way street and it's rarely won by a display of anger or aggression. ...//...

Anyone that knows me (internet or IRL) would not see this as anger or aggression. Frustration, maybe.

...//... It's my opinion that Matt likes people and even likes divers. He actually expresses a number of fears and disappointments that any number of newish divers have to deal with but most are afraid or are unable to express. ...//...

That's what keeps me coming back. Imagine meeting Matt at a Baltimore Harbor restaurant and talking things over.

...//... Not to single you out, but Matt's intention was not to throw bait in the water to be attacked. I believe he wants to chanxge his behavior so he doesn't become the "pariah" over and over again. He's looking for answers he can understand and not some sort of cyber smack down. ...//...

Single me out, I'm a big boy and can take honest criticism. This is a community, nice one too. I'll do my part to keep it that way.

Matt appears to be window shopping for advice, never makes it to the cash register...

...//... Oh the drama!...//...

Indeed, the drama was intentional. My attempt to meet Matt on his own playing field.


All being said, I will let this drop. A quick review of progress vs. time spent tells me I have better things to do. I am leaving Matt on "Ignore".

-nice feature that option for voluntary censorship, just a message telling me that I can's see what Matt wrote. Good for both Matt and I.

 

[diversteve]

Matt has a part-time buddy - his wife dives. Just not as frequently as he does.

And he also has expressed repeatedly that he doesn't want to dive in cold water.

So I think most of those suggestions fall on deaf ears...

 

[SeaHorse81]

I'm really hoping Matt will rethink local diving, and here's why. Things keep getting overly dramatic and difficult for him here on SB, and that is likey because some discussions are just better had in person than online. Matt is likely someone who comes across better as a whole person, rather than as simple typing on a screen. If he would dive locally and maybe join a club, he could have face-to-face discussions with people who would love to share their knowledge and help him along. Such people would not be in a position of having shelled out thousands of dollars to make a dive trip, only to find themselves dealing with someone with lots of questions and need for discussion/assistance. If he connects with people locally, he'll get people who can take some time with him. He'll get experience learning how to sort out the people who really know their stuff vs. the people who just talk a good game, and he'll do that while not putting a pricey dive trip at risk. He'll develop skills that will help him enjoy the trips more when he takes them.

Most importantly though, perhaps in-person discussions will work better than an Internet forum. On the other hand, if he ends up still feeling like a pariah all the time, then maybe the world is trying to tell him something, and life will get easier if he starts to listen.

The first ten years of my dive career were vacation dives only. My skills really didn't develop much at all over that decade. I was comfortable being in the water and not a problem to anyone, but not especially talented, and definitely not growing as a diver. It's only since I've begun practicing locally in the last few years that I've "gotten it" about really becoming a diver. My real education didn't even start until after I'd already logged 100 dives. Compared to what I've learned in the most recent 100, I feel like the first 100 don't even count. I am sure that would never have changed if I'd stuck with vacation-only diving. As much as I liked diving before, I like it a LOT more now.

Matt, if you're reading this, I hope you find your way, and I wish you a great lifetime of diving.

 

[FPDocMatt]

I'm totally amazed at how long this thread has become. Wow!

Things keep getting overly dramatic and difficult for him here on SB, and that is likey because some discussions are just better had in person than online.

I don't know. I think the people who have responded negatively to me online are the same people who would respond negatively to me in person.

The thing is, people who are less than polite on-line sometimes restrict themselves to polite behavior in person. But if they're impolite on-line, then that's who they are, and I'd like to know about it so that I'll know to stay away from them.

Matt is likely someone who comes across better as a whole person, rather than as simple typing on a screen.

Actually, I used to think this, but after what happened last week I'm thinking otherwise. There I was, thinking I was getting along with the other people on the boat, I got into a disagreement with the captain of the boat, and there I was, ignored for the rest of the trip. It was an awful experience, and it was not on-line at all.

Also, I've been impressed with the number of people who have seen my side of all this. Granted they're in the minority, but at least there are some here on SB who think I did exactly what I should have done in the situation.

Most importantly though, perhaps in-person discussions will work better than an Internet forum. On the other hand, if he ends up still feeling like a pariah all the time, then maybe the world is trying to tell him something, and life will get easier if he starts to listen.

I don't know. This whole thing is weird. I'm a well loved and well respected member of my community. It's just when interacting with scuba divers that I have problems.

Matt, if you're reading this, I hope you find your way, and I wish you a great lifetime of diving.

Thank-you.

 

[drrich2]

Actually, I used to think this, but after what happened last week I'm thinking otherwise. There I was, thinking I was getting along with the other people on the boat, I got into a disagreement with the captain of the boat, and there I was, ignored for the rest of the trip.

I think the relevant points in the thread have been covered (often repeatedly). I re-emphasize one point, though, regarding the above. Often people who are upset and have their feelings hurt want to be left alone until they sort through it or escape a situation they consider embarrassing, and often observers find it awkward and don't know how to try to help, so they may figure the best way to help is to give the injured party his space and not make him feel worse - this comes across as 'ignoring' him.

It's sometimes done out of respect and compassion, not contempt.

Richard.

 

[Pauly854]

All of this :boxing: and leaves meand makes me wanna...can't we all just:grouphug: and , instead of?