Master.........Really?

[divad]

there are no "Master Divers" and never will be.

This makes sense. Captain Obvious?

 

[drrich2]

The word "master" has been watered down and many realize that certification does not quite hold the merit that it may have in the past. It is a shame.

Actually, it may serve a point. The title 'sounds cool' and likely appeals to a substantial number of recreational divers, encouraging them to go through a range of certifications to attain it, at the end of which while for the most part not world class cutting edge experts, they will probably still be better divers than had they stopped with OW.

Look at the rescue certification, for example, which is required to obtain MSD. I imagine a lot of people would, at first glance, shy away from it, perhaps not being the Type A or highly conscientious sorts who wish/feel compelled to intervene in emergencies. It can be rather liberating to be unable to help in an emergency. But Rescue is perhaps the most well-spoken of cert. on this forum, particularly for enhancing peoples' dive skill level & self-rescue capability. Plus, they're more likely to rescue a buddy in a crisis. Maybe even somebody else, if so inclined.

If a 'Master Diver' certification lures & encourages more people to take Rescue Diver, then who cares if it has a 'lofty' title? I don't care if they call them 'Jedi Divers,' or 'Scuba Lords.' Not if it encourages more extensive training, making divers better than they'd otherwise be.

Richard.

 

[BDSC]

Good point Richard.

 

[Akimbo]

Certainly it is. And it's all about a semantic niggle.

Who cares what training is called? Seriously. Does it harm you in any way?

I suppose the significance of the word depends on personal experiences. I have had the pleasure to know a number of individuals in several different professions who have earned the prefix in the classic sense through a lifetime of accomplishment. It is hard for me to look at a 12 year old with 50 dives and a few merit badges with the same reverence.

Does that mean that the next merit badge should be a PhD since that follows the Masters degree? How long before dive shops offer the doctor, professor, and laureate courses? Will diving merit badges start to resemble the US Congressional Medal of Honor? Does getting all the answers right on the Nitrox course qualify for magna cum laude honors?

Is it disrespectful to individuals who have spent many years earning any of these honors to bestow them on barely accomplished beginners? All of these questions come down to individual value judgments.

 

[lowviz]

..............

If I were to not have any knowledge of diving and someone were to tell me they were a "Master Diver" immediately, I would envision someone with years of diving experience and training, not someone who may have a year or two, or less under his/her belt and a couple of classes or passed a course after they got 50 dives.

.....................

Well, I must admit you got the marketing figured out. It really is about impressing non-divers.

So why are you complaining (in another thread) that boat captains want you to show up with redundant gas supplies before you demonstrate your skills? They didn't "buy" your certs?

Try to remember that this is recreational diving.

 

[DaleC]

In the PADI system, the MSD rating is the pinnacle of non-professional, non-technical diving. That's a fair claim....it is exactly that.

Which is true in a training sense and where I think PADI and other agencies fall short (except two). There seems to be no ongoing component wherein one can practice and refine ones newly gained knowledge. People, honestly wanting to become better divers yet lacking the length of time to develop mentor and fellow diver relationships, take course after course and become MSD's or DM's and even instructors before they are really ready to assume the responsability that comes with the title (in the case of the latter two).

Actually, it may serve a point. The title 'sounds cool' and likely appeals to a substantial number of recreational divers, encouraging them to go through a range of certifications to attain it, at the end of which while for the most part not world class cutting edge experts, they will probably still be better divers than had they stopped with OW...If a 'Master Diver' certification lures & encourages more people to take Rescue Diver, then who cares if it has a 'lofty' title? I don't care if they call them 'Jedi Divers,' or 'Scuba Lords.' Not if it encourages more extensive training, making divers better than they'd otherwise be.

Richard.

Isn't that sad. What does it say about the state of todays diver when we think we have to trick people and ego stroke them into gaining an education. Is a deluded diver a better diver?

 

[DevonDiver]

Which is true in a training sense and where I think PADI and other agencies fall short (except two). There seems to be no ongoing component wherein one can practice and refine ones newly gained knowledge.

I guess that PADI feel the 50 dive minimum requirement would address that issue. Of course, that is open to debate...and depends entirely on perspective.

People, honestly wanting to become better divers yet lacking the length of time to develop mentor and fellow diver relationships, take course after course and become MSD's or DM's and even instructors before they are really ready to assume the responsability that comes with the title (in the case of the latter two).

There's nothing wrong with training. But a development that is only comprised of training...and no chance to utilise that training.... leads the diver to a very incomplete end-product. If nothing else, it leads to over-confidence and/or a tendancy for reliance on a supervisor.

Isn't that sad. What does it say about the state of todays diver when we think we have to trick people and ego stroke them into gaining an education. Is a deluded diver a better diver?

Trickery and motivation are different beasts. Providing a structure for attainment is used in many areas of education and other endeavours. MSD doesnt appeal to everyone... but then some people easily associate this with other things they are used to in life. Ever been a boy scout? They have badges too. So do the military.

Do military medals represent trickery and delusion? Or something to aspire to?

 

[DaleC]

Ever been a boy scout? They have badges too. So do the military.

Do military medals represent trickery and delusion? Or something to aspire to?

I was a boy scout and leader and the similarities don't escape me. I'm not against training or even a structure, just the notion that one might appeal to ego to encourage training. The result, along with some increase in knowledge, could be an increase in ego which is counter productive to safe diving IMO.

I also think the guys who earn metals in the military are not thinking about earning metals when they are doing the things that earn them, if you know what I mean.

 

[gmanstan]

I'm a "Master Diver" and a certified "Rescue Diver"...Which to anyone not a diver sounds so cool.When you say master diver they're like oooohhh, but when you say Rescue Diver it conjures up images of navy seals rescuing people,just like the commercials...lol.. Genius marketing. Gotta give'm that.But it probably does inspire some to take more class's they need but might not have been motivated to take.

 

[BobbyT22]

Actually, it may serve a point. The title 'sounds cool' and likely appeals to a substantial number of recreational divers, encouraging them to go through a range of certifications to attain it, at the end of which while for the most part not world class cutting edge experts, they will probably still be better divers than had they stopped with OW.

Look at the rescue certification, for example, which is required to obtain MSD. I imagine a lot of people would, at first glance, shy away from it, perhaps not being the Type A or highly conscientious sorts who wish/feel compelled to intervene in emergencies. It can be rather liberating to be unable to help in an emergency. But Rescue is perhaps the most well-spoken of cert. on this forum, particularly for enhancing peoples' dive skill level & self-rescue capability. Plus, they're more likely to rescue a buddy in a crisis. Maybe even somebody else, if so inclined.

If a 'Master Diver' certification lures & encourages more people to take Rescue Diver, then who cares if it has a 'lofty' title? I don't care if they call them 'Jedi Divers,' or 'Scuba Lords.' Not if it encourages more extensive training, making divers better than they'd otherwise be.

Richard.

Scuba Lord...I like that! But I was sold at Master Baiter....