No jacket BP/W Sidemount?

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I think BP+W is a great way to start, in fact we stopped using jackets a few years back and now teach all courses exclusively in BP+W set-ups. Most of us who made the poodle jacket mistake after certification did so as we learned in the same poodle jackets?

If you really want to use sidemount I don't think there is any more difficulty in learning in a sidemount set-up, as Andy said the hardest part would be rental after certification so you'd really need to look at purchasing your own gear at day 1 - learning in the same gear you'd use is also highly recommended. That said, other than using the same equipment from day 1 I can't see any other real advantages, the back pain issues are relevant but could also be solved by donning/removing a regular backmount system in the water (with help from boat crew or buddies).

Most divers without technical diving experience tend to be a little confused by hose configurations in sidemount, especially if hoses are routed around the rear of the neck (as they should be in my opinion). This would probably be a little too much for most OW level divers, that said it would be no problem for some also.

The trim is more important in sidemount is just an urban myth, trim is important in any form of diving, it's just easier to maintain trim in sidemount for most people so tends to be linked to 'good trim'.

In terms of harnesses I'd broadly categorise most harnesses into one of three categories:

1 - Warm Water Harnesses
Low lift and configured with aluminium tanks in mind - i.e. Razor/Z-Trim

2 - Cold Water Harnesses
Increased lift and configured with steel tanks in mind (door handles and butt plate) - i.e. Nomad and Armadillo

3 - $hit Harnesses
Try to combine features from both system and end up with a ton of useless features or not enough lift to use them - i.e. SMS50 and Nomad LT

I'd recommend choosing from the first two groups ;-)

Hope that helps!

Karl

One issue that can arise from minimalist systems is the provision of redundant buoyancy. Regardless of a divers' opinions on the need for redundant buoyancy, many tech-level classes do insist upon it. In cold water drysuits cover that option, but if diving in warm water/tropics (i.e. wetsuits), you will probably want redundancy integral to the BCD. IMHO, none of the minimalist sidemount BCDs have created an optimal solution for this yet.

The Razor 2 has a pretty neat dual bladder solution, it's by far the best options out there right now if you don't use a dry suit for the course - otherwise it's a case of bringing a spare MSR bladder in the pouch to act as a back-up during the course - then common sense can apply and one isn't required diving in tropical waters after the course. The real problem is the standards calling for the dual bladder, not the dual bladder itself :-(
 
I would say go single backmount first, then SM later. I went single BM, double BM, then SM.

I would recommend the Nomad XT if diving cold water; I had a Razor 2 and sold it after 5 dives, as it is horrible with drygloves. The dump valve is under the wing edge and the rear D rings for the tanks are hard to manage in cold water as well.
 
Smiffyfour, that's interesting -- I had a conversation with a local friend who jettisoned his Razor-type setup for the same reason, and is now using a Hollis.
 
Smiffyfour, that's interesting -- I had a conversation with a local friend who jettisoned his Razor-type setup for the same reason, and is now using a Hollis.

I liked the concept of the Razor, minimalist, etc. But I didn't feel safe in it in cold water (33f). Due to cold hands and an obscured wing dump, I blew to the surface from 20 ft because I couldn't get ahold of the dump. Not serious from 20 ft, but made me re-think my gear.

Sent from my HTC Desire HD A9191 using Tapatalk 2
 
I liked the concept of the Razor, minimalist, etc. But I didn't feel safe in it in cold water (33f). Due to cold hands and an obscured wing dump, I blew to the surface from 20 ft because I couldn't get ahold of the dump. Not serious from 20 ft, but made me re-think my gear.

It sounds like you have the wing on the wrong way around? The dump should be on the outside, not the inside. It's positioned on the side of the wing rather than the top so is intended to be used on the outside.

The biggest issue I could see with the Razor would be shifting tanks, if you're using heavy steel tanks this shouldn't be an issue?

I hate to say it but equipment solution to a skills problem springs to mind :-( That said, if the wing was the wrong way around the dump would be pretty hard to reach with any kind of gloves on.
 
It sounds like you have the wing on the wrong way around? The dump should be on the outside, not the inside. It's positioned on the side of the wing rather than the top so is intended to be used on the outside.

The biggest issue I could see with the Razor would be shifting tanks, if you're using heavy steel tanks this shouldn't be an issue?

I hate to say it but equipment solution to a skills problem springs to mind :-( That said, if the wing was the wrong way around the dump would be pretty hard to reach with any kind of gloves on.

Son of a gun. I just had a hard look at the pics on the Razor site and what do you know, the wing was on backwards. I have to say in my defense, that I bought it used, and that was how it was configured.
 
Son of a gun. I just had a hard look at the pics on the Razor site and what do you know, the wing was on backwards. I have to say in my defense, that I bought it used, and that was how it was configured.

That explains everything I think :) I'm impressed you managed to keep everything under control to 20ft with thick gloves and the dump valve hidden.

I think the term 'very difficult skill solution to an equipment problem' would be a much more appropriate term :)
 
Varied sidemount models/brands are so different in approach, that specific training/research does need to occur before successful use can be expected. I see a lot of rigs written off and/or criticized because of nothing more than than a lack of familiarity or appropriate technique.

That's not to say that various rigs don't have faults,... but I do see some novice sidemount divers confusing the pros/cons with either a rig-specific or general sidemount skill deficit.

Find it hard to locate a clip? Put your rig on whilst watching evening TV at home. For the duration, clip and unclip the snap. It's the "Mr Miyagi" approach, but it works. Muscle memory takes repetition...repetition takes time (and some dedication).
 
Another reason moving away from the Razor is no local SM instructors want to work with me using it. The Nomad is the rig of choice around here.

Sent from my HTC Desire HD A9191 using Tapatalk 2
 
Another reason moving away from the Razor is no local SM instructors want to work with me using it. The Nomad is the rig of choice around here.

Sent from my HTC Desire HD A9191 using Tapatalk 2

I have to wonder if that doesn't say something about those instructors abilities to effectively teach it in the first place?
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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