Pony bottle vs. Spare Air?

[DandyDon]

Is this a serious question? You list yourself as a "solo diver" with >500 dives.....

I don't think he listed himself as a solo diver, but that he belongs to that forum here on SB. I did miss the 500+ dives. His questions were borderline trolling perhaps. I suppose he has full knowledge of the differences and his own ideas.

 

[micklock]

When I got certified in 99 I wanted a spare air the LDS owner told me not to waste my money to get a pony. So I finished the class then took the advanced class the next month in sept. Then my family went to Fort Meyers Beach for Thanksgiving so I took my gear, not much diving going on got a guy's number he took me out, showed up in Venice he put his boat in and got a friend to go to be my buddy. First dive we dove together the next dive he said I'm going to go solo (I think he was just there to find stuff to sell to giftshops and was mad because I grabbed a shell that he was going for) he said I had good skills I would be fine (we were going to look for sharks teeth) so I had a choice to sit in the boat or go solo. It was my 16th dive ever, second in the ocean. Had a great dive 40 min at 30' found two sharks teeth one Megladon worth $200 dollars the other worth $75 he didn't find any. When I got back home I bought a pony bottle and reg used it ever since, I don't dive solo except when I got my drysuit and doubles and I was figuring out the weights and practicing valve drills in front of our cottage in the small lake we live on in about 20' of water. I think if If I dove a couple times a week in warm clear water with a lot less gear on I would feel more comfortable in the water and swimming over to my buddy, getting his attention, signaling out of air and getting his reg. But in the cold dark water up here I like to have my redundacy hanging just below my chin if I need it, then I get my buddies attention.

 

[diverDano]

wow..I don't think this was a thread to bash how people dive certain rigs. This was supposed to provide pros and cons of spare air and pony bottles. Anyone can look at anybody and criticize their rig setup. We are all different, and therefore dive different. What works for me, won't work for someone else, and visa versa. If I want to dive solo, YOU can't tell me I can't or shouldn't. And if you need to have a friend that you've known all your life as a dive buddy to be able to dive...so be it. I not gonna say boo. I wish people would get over themselves. Let people dive how they want, 'cause thats what you yourself are doing.

 

[DandyDon]

It's Alive...!!

This thread still lives!

 

[Alex777]

 

[Web Monkey]

right there with him, both were getting low on air (careless - they were photographing everything in sight using new equipment) when he noticed he motioned for his buddy and reached for Octo. Both were running low...diver error I know but it happens. If they had their pony bottles with them not problem but it turned out to be a race to the surface. Diver error occurs even to the experts.

I'm by no means perfect, but there's absolutely nothing underwater that's more deserving of your attention or more important than your dive plan (depth, time, remaining air) and buddy.

Keep track of the important stuff, and then if there's any mental currency left, take some pictures.

Sure, a pony would have helped, assuming it wasn't empty, worked OK, was turned on, and could be deployed in time. Not running out of gas would have worked better.

Terry

 

[LG Diver]

wow..I don't think this was a thread to bash how people dive certain rigs. This was supposed to provide pros and cons of spare air and pony bottles. Anyone can look at anybody and criticize their rig setup. We are all different, and therefore dive different. What works for me, won't work for someone else, and visa versa. If I want to dive solo, YOU can't tell me I can't or shouldn't. And if you need to have a friend that you've known all your life as a dive buddy to be able to dive...so be it. I not gonna say boo. I wish people would get over themselves. Let people dive how they want, 'cause thats what you yourself are doing.

As is often the case, I've apparently failed to properly convey what I was trying to say. Adobo did a very nice job of clarifying, but I'll take one more stab at it because, well, I'm a glutton for punishment. It wasn't my intent to bash anybody's gear config or dive style choice. if you want to dive solo and you're aware of, and comfortable with, the associated risks then by all means have at it. No skin off my nose.

My point in a far more general sense was this- if you examine nearly all dive accidents, they are rarely the result of one thing gone wrong. They are nearly always the result of 3 or 4 (or more) minor things that went overlooked or ignored until, by some unfortunate coincidence, they came together to create a bad situation. These seemingly minor things often get overlooked because of a sense of complacency, or a casual dismissal of their potential impact, or a total lack of awareness that they are even issues. They are, after all, just minor annoyances and 99.9999999% of the time they result in nothing..... until that one time that they result in something.

My opinion (and it's just that, so do with it whatever you wish) is that something like a pony bottle can often create a false sense of security that fosters the oversight of these seemingly minor things and inhibits the diligence in dive planning and plan execution that's critical to safe diving. "Why check the SPG regularly since I've got a pony bottle? I'm busy taking pictures, after all." That's fine, until that one time that you forgot to check if the pony was full, or if your buddy, who has no pony and is also busy taking pictures and hasn't been checking their SPG is also OOA.

What I've endeavored to say is that you simply need to ask yourself why you think you need a pony, and what problem you're trying to solve. If you need redundancy because you're solo diving- that's fine. If you need it in case "something" goes wrong- fix the stuff that can go wrong first.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I got a 40 cu ft stage and an al 80 that I can use as one as well. I still have my 19 and use it for singles dives to 100 ft or so. As for the spare air. I said it before, if the helicopter goes down on the way to the dive site use it to get out of the chopper then throw it away. Too bad we can't take em on the plane pressurized. It'd be good for getting out when the pilot has to ditch or for blowing the skirt up on the stewardesses. Might also be able to use it for blowing pretzel crumbs off the laptop.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

...

My opinion (and it's just that, so do with it whatever you wish) is that something like a pony bottle can often create a false sense of security that fosters the oversight of these seemingly minor things and inhibits the diligence in dive planning and plan execution that's critical to safe diving. "Why check the SPG regularly since I've got a pony bottle? I'm busy taking pictures, after all." That's fine, until that one time that you forgot to check if the pony was full, or if your buddy, who has no pony and is also busy taking pictures and hasn't been checking their SPG is also OOA.

What I've endeavored to say is that you simply need to ask yourself why you think you need a pony, and what problem you're trying to solve. If you need redundancy because you're solo diving- that's fine. If you need it in case "something" goes wrong- fix the stuff that can go wrong first.

I wonder if those DIR guys get complacent and rely upon the false sense of security provided by a buddy who is supposed to always be by their side. It's all fine until the ONE time when the buddy drifted off.....

Assuming that a pony bottle will promote inattention is pretty weak. You might be able to make a stronger arguement that pony bottle carrying divers are MORE safety concious and careful as demonstrated by their willingness to carry extra safety equipment.

 

[DandyDon]

I wonder if those DIR guys get complacent and rely upon the false sense of security provided by a buddy who is supposed to always be by their side. It's all fine until the ONE time when the buddy drifted off.....

Assuming that a pony bottle will promote inattention is pretty weak. You might be able to make a stronger arguement that pony bottle carrying divers are MORE safety concious and careful as demonstrated by their willingness to carry extra safety equipment.

And I've been both - the pony bottle diver who got complacent but survived my mistakes to learn, and now I hope the safer diver who lugs an extra 15# in my luggage and up that ladder after the dive is over - just in case anyone around me or I needs air unexpectedly. Haven't needed to use it in a long time, but not going to stop carrying it. Then there's the annual viz and reg service - still worth it to me. Not something I'd suggest to others usually, but a good consideration - especially for anyone who dives with a camera.