Rebreather problem in documentary

[Thalassamania]

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Each diver has the right to accept or reject any level of risk they are not comfortable with, it is not up to us to proclaim the validity of their decisions. What purpose does it serve having a "Greek chorus" wailing "You're gonna die!" whenever RBs are mentioned?
...

I agree, I just feel that potential RB users should know the facts before they take the risks or cough up the cash. Think of it as, "full disclosure," by folks who've been there. If you don't like our advise, you don't have to follow it now, do you? And I do recognize the problem with the construct of the discussion which does, at times, resemble those public service videos of the old drug addict telling the kid not to get hooked.

 

[Garth]

I agree, I just feel that potential RB users should know the facts before they take the risks or cough up the cash. Think of it as, "full disclosure," by folks who've been there. If you don't like our advise, you don't have to follow it now, do you? And I do recognize the problem with the construct of the discussion which does, at times, resemble those public service videos of the old drug addict telling the kid not to get hooked.

You've been there? You've died on a rebreather? I don't understand. Maybe you could explain

 

[Plumb bob]

Cool I think we are "unpacking" this somewhat T, and managing to avoid acrimony (fingers crossed )..

What I was (obtusely perhaps) getting at before was that a very large number of the fatalities that occurred early on in the initial flushes of wider RB adoption were probably due to ideas of operation and scope that were (as we now know) ill conceived. For example: Crossing over from very deep OC dives and immediately carrying out dives on CC to those same depths, bad habits developing over things like reusing sorb, pushing life cycles of cells. All those things that were part of the early learning curve (alas learnt the hard way for so many) that are now part of the established learning material for the neophyte.

So I agree with full disclosure but not if that includes presentation of an early adoption phase as the norm now.

 

[Thalassamania]

As far as rebreathers are concerned, I think I've said this three or four times before: "For what it's worth I suspect that I was a much safer rebreather user back during my first 50 hours. I might not have been able to do much more than maintain position in the water and stay alive, but I was far more vigilant and safety conscious than I am now that I have settled comfortably into being an "experienced beginner." I don't think that open circuit/open water is quite the same."

 

[Pullmyfinger]

Like many divers, I've been a little interested in "one day" gettig a rebreather. I've spent my share of time reading up on them just to satisfy my curiousity.

What Thal just hit on, and what strikes a chord with me is that if I don't fully commit to diving a rebreather, it's probably not the best move to make.

What I know from my previous experiences in shooting, as well as snow boarding and skiing (I moved to Utah JUST to ski, and later to Alaska JUST to ski)........is that skills are perishable.
I'm a vacation skiier now, and I'm no where near as good as I was when I lived right next to great skiing.
Skills just degrade if they aren't used regularly.

It seems reasonable to ME that unless I were going to exclusively dive a rebreather then it wouldn't make sense to get one.

I wouldn't want a perishing skill set to end up biting me in the ass.

Maybe one day, I'll decide that I CAN fully commit all of my dive time and resources to rebreather diving. But at this point, it's all OC diving.

Thanks Thal.......you just saved me a bunch of money.......you're like the Geico gekko of diving.

-Mitch

 

[Plumb bob]

You're right there! The battle against complacency is never ending. This is probably the biggest reason it will never be for everyone. Some folk just aren't interested in the monitoring requirements and will be put off when they find out.

If all I did were easier (warm, shallow and short) dives the benefit vs risk would come sharply down on the side of OC.

 

[Thalassamania]

You didn't need me ... just read your sig line, "When do YOU start to accept a lower standard of performance?"

 

[Mr.X]

There are a series of paintings (bear with me, there is a point) that are called " Most Wanted" They were painted in response to polling in 11 countries on what people most wanted to see in a painting. Each is unique to the country polled. Now the themes that were common are revealing of our desires. These included: Open spaces, the presence of water, evidence of animal and bird life, a diversity of greenery including flowering and fruiting plants and an opening up in at least one direction to an unimpeded vantage on the horizon or a path winding out of sight. All those desired attributes indicate the circumstances we preferred during our evolution. We Humans are hardwired, it's in our genetic make up to explore. You are just as likely to stop divers pushing the boundaries as you are stopping the incoming tide.

Each diver has the right to accept or reject any level of risk they are not comfortable with, it is not up to us to proclaim the validity of their decisions. What purpose does it serve having a "Greek chorus" wailing "You're gonna die!" whenever RBs are mentioned?

If you do not find RBs or caving interesting any more then fine that's your choice.

You're in the romance phase of RB diving. Keep at it long and hard enough and you'll come to understand some bits of my perspective. Again, I say this from the perspective of having been a RB instructor, diving multiple RB's during the early 'teething phase' of the previous generation (including what seems to be your Classic Kiss) and still questioning purpose for dubious projects like deep diving records, body retrievals in deep caves, solo penetrations etc.

 

[Plumb bob]

You're in the romance phase of RB diving. Keep at it long and hard enough and you'll come to understand some bits of my perspective. Again, I say this from the perspective of having been a RB instructor, diving multiple RB's during the early 'teething phase' of the previous generation (including what seems to be your Classic Kiss) and still questioning purpose for dubious projects like deep diving records, body retrievals in deep caves, solo penetrations etc.

"Romance Phase" And I was being condescending. C'mon!

I am not going to have an experience "pissing contest" with you as we both know claims of "this and that" are a dime a dozen on these boards.

Anyway let's stop there. We disagree mostly... What forum hasn't got enough of that.

Enjoy your diving.

 

[moneysavr]

I agree, I just feel that potential RB users should know the facts before they take the risks or cough up the cash. Think of it as, "full disclosure," by folks who've been there. If you don't like our advise, you don't have to follow it now, do you?



I agree with above, being OC but having dived with now departed RB divers I have followed it closely and do agree with many of the past post’s.
Not to kick the can down the road but this link DEEP LIFE LTD.
Deep Life Design Team: databases and analysis of rebreather accident data

I am sure you all have looked at the info, it is all on the line.
and any one diving a RB or know some one that is should pass it on and read it too! yes lots of it was HE or user error-but as said I quote “Nobody dies on a rebreather from user error, unless they take the
mouthpiece out of their mouth and do not replace it with something.”

,
Way too many thing's IMO can go wrong!
Its great to see all this information in one spot less taking sides with manufactures


As RB divers in my mind at one time were the cream of the crop,best of the best dive gurus! But after going thru countless tragedies and information I concluded a RB was not in my best interest but just a fun novelty to try at demo days,like other divers fit over priced dry suit on.