Swimming Skills Assessment

How strong a swimmer are you?

  • Strong Swimmer: Competitive high school, college, or masters swimmer, lifeguard, or WSI

    Votes: 88 21.0%
  • Fitness Swimmer: Not perfect, but routinely swim for fitness or compete in triathlons

    Votes: 101 24.1%
  • Average Swimmer: Learned as a child, but only swim occasionally

    Votes: 207 49.4%
  • Weak Swimmer: Not confident in swimming ability especially far from shore or in the ocean

    Votes: 23 5.5%

  • Total voters
    419

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V

As a welcoming gesture to the team on my first day of college lacrosse practice, a couple defense guys ran me face first into a tree near the field the moment I put on my helmet. There was a permanent dent in the mask. Every year when the equipment came out of storage, it was easy for me to find my helmet and the guy who ran me into the tree with the most delight became my best friend. Sometimes you just need to pay your dues and sometimes respect has to be earned.

The fact that you survived a bad incident does not make it good. What you described is reminiscent of the argument that school bullying is just "boys being boys," when research shows that it is a seriously damaging experience that has lifetime consequences, and I don't even mean in the cases of the people who commit suicide as a result.

As an educational theorist who has done countless presentations to teachers in an attempt to show what research says are the most effective methods of instruction, I assure you that the most common hostile encounter from the entrenched old guard features the "it worked for me" argument.

I used to use this story to describe the problem with that thinking. In the Civil War, perhaps the single most disastrous example of poor strategy was Pickett's Charge at Gettysburg, in which General Lee ordered Pickett to send his forces in a slow charge across a wide, open field into enemy fire. They suffered 60% casualties and accomplished nothing, as I recall. It was a classic example of outmoded strategy meeting new weaponry, but it was many, many years before the futility of this strategy was finally realized and removed from military instruction.

I asked people to imagine one of the survivors of that charge staying in the military and eventually teaching military strategy at an academy. One day he teaches his students the strategy of sending an entire army across a wide, open field while an entrenched enemy mows them down. In a staff meeting, another staff member questions the value of teaching this, and the instructor says, "It worked for me."

The phrase, "it worked for me" often means "I survived it," and it does not recognize that many others did not.
 
To show that I do understand the value and even the lure of challenging diving, I would like to describe my last ocean dive and then give a moral. For those uninterested in the details, you can skip right to the moral.

There were four of us on the dive to the RBJ in Florida--you may know it and may have even dived it. There was a ripping current, and in an attempt to maximize the chances that we would actually find this wreck, the crew did something I found remarkable--they sent the DM down to try to hit the wreck and give us a descent line. He succeeded, but that meant the captain could not tie off to that line while the DM was ascending on it. The captain therefore tried to drop us off as close to the balls as he could so we could get to the line. I was the 4th one in the water, and by the time I splashed, we were down current from the line.

I was in a dry suit with double steel 108s on my back. I was also carrying an AL 80 and two AL 40s. I was breathing from the AL 80. Swimming into the current with that load was incredibly difficult. I was not far from the line, but it seemed as if I could make no headway toward it. It was always just tantalizingly out of reach. I slowly edged past diver #3, who was also struggling, and I got close to the line just after diver #2 reached it. He reached back and hauled both of us in. I was huffing and puffing as never before at that point. Diver #3 had had enough. He gave the thumb and went back to the boat. The rest of us pulled our way down the line, which was extremely difficult in that current.

At about 170 feet I switched to back gas. When we got to the wreck, the current was much calmer, but my heart was still racing. When we ascended, we untied the line, which made everything much easier, even calm, for the ascent. I switched back to the AL 80 at 170, and all was routine after that. We had had plenty of gas for our plan, but it's a darn good thing we did, because we breathed through a lot more than expected on the descent and the dive. We expected to use a little more than half of the gas in the AL 80s, but we used it all. We also used up much more of our back gas than expected.

MORAL: I enjoyed the dive a lot, despite (and possible in part because of) the challenge. Because I know I might find myself in such situations on dives, I stay quite fit for a man my age. Other people, however, do not have any intention of diving like that and thus do not have the need for it. Other divers dive exclusively in calm and safe conditions. For most divers, a dive like the one I did is beyond both their training and their physical limitations. They therefore don't plan dives like that, and when situations beyond their abilities arise unexpectedly, they follow the wise example of Diver #3 and thumb the dive.

Divers prepare for the kind of diving they intend to do. Just because someone else thinks a more challenging kind of diving is enjoyable does not mean everyone should be forced to prepare for that kind of diving.
 
ScubaBoard is a large bladder evacuation contest mostly engaged in for sport, but stirs impassioned debate....

I can see some of that, but (thankfully, IMO), there are also friendly, helpful people who engage in respectful debate.

...As a welcoming gesture to the team on my first day of college lacrosse practice, a couple defense guys ran me face first into a tree near the field the moment I put on my helmet. There was a permanent dent in the mask. Every year when the equipment came out of storage, it was easy for me to find my helmet and the guy who ran me into the tree with the most delight became my best friend. Sometimes you just need to pay your dues and sometimes respect has to be earned.

Maybe I don't deserve to be a diver. I know that if I had read this prior to learning how to dive -- and if I thought it represented the overall gist of the sport -- I would not have been interested. And I don't think I can earn respect that way (by taking physical punishment type jokes).

Years ago, I rowed crew. The coach was a lot like what you describe, and the training had that boot-camp/hazing feel to it. It included exercises that I felt had long been proven to be un-necessarily hard on the anatomy (when similar gains could be achieved using other exercises), and a lot of browbeating. I'm sure some of the crew responded to it well, but I didn't, and I could see that others didn't either (not to mention that they were always wondering "How can we get more people into this sport and why aren't more people signing up?" Gee, I wonder....).

One day I took the coach aside and explained that yes, since I committed to the season I was going to show up on time each day and row. But that while I would row decently while he yelled and browbeat and boot-camped and hazed, if he *really* wanted me to row my guts out, with feeling, what he should do is just ask "Please do your best for me" and be a little bit more friendly. For that I would row my heart out until my hands were pulp.

You mentioned the possibility of attracting more young people to diving through a cross-interest with surfing. I'm not a surfer, but I have hung out with some surfers while sailing, and while I'm sure there is some cutthroat competition in there, I found the overall vibe to be one of "live and let live" and sort of an "isn't the world beautiful and let's enjoy what the ocean gives us" kind of feeling. That seems like the opposite sort of crowd than would be attracted to a "macho" type of diving/training.

I'm not saying that people should not be fit, nor that people should not practice and drill for potential problems. I believe both are good things. And I love competence. But I think I get there a different way, and personally, images of rough tough "survival-of-the-fittest" men aren't what motivate me.

I just hope there is room for people like me along with the people who do enjoy and thrive on the type of atmosphere and training you describe.
 
I know. Every kid gets a trophy today. We need them to feel safe.

Some of my fondest memories were angry coaches.

Lacrosse Coach: SCREAM, SCREAM, SCREAM, SPITTLE, SPITTLE, SPITTLE, SCREAM, SCREAM, SCREAM!!!

Me: Coach, I'm only saying this because I care. There are a lot of decaffeinated brands on the market that are just as tasty as the real thing. (I forget what movie I stole that from now.)

Coach: GLARE ... SILENCE ... FLARING NOSTRILS ... GLARE.

I used the same line on Ed Hayes once. I love that man. He's passionate.
 
I know. Every kid gets a trophy today. We need them to feel safe.

Wow. You really don't get it. I'm truly surprised.

The concept is looking at what works effectively in education and coaching. You do what works best, and, although it will apparently shock you, beating on people (etc.) is not necessarily the best way to do things. Just because something is harder for a student does not mean it is better.

But I appear to be wasting my time.
 
I know. Every kid gets a trophy today. We need them to feel safe.

If you're responding to me, well I am in complete disagreement (which my friends who have suffered my rants about incompetents would vouch for :wink:).

I *like* classes that have high standards, and I have zero desire to be given a pass. When I went abroad to study language while I was in college, my one request for my "family" was that they be the types who would correct my grammar. Please, let me know if I'm not up to snuff! And help me to understand how to get there. I have always liked strict/precise teachers, and not the ones who just wanted to play happy games without concern for the goal. No, I'm here to learn!

I don't see polite, friendly/respectful instruction as equating to "giving every kid a trophy." I think it's perfectly possible to politely-yet-firmly explain to someone that they are not going to pass, and then to let them know why, and what they need to do to change that. This can be firm and non-negotiable, and no-one need "get a pass" just in order to bolster their self-esteem.

Just don't browbeat or haze me, please; it doesn't work very well for me in reaching the goal. (Especially if I'm a grown adult who is a paying student.) That said, I don't say there is no place for the yelling/hazing type of instruction (clearly it works well for you and I'm sure you're not alone); just that I don't think it's the only way.
 
John,

I'm not forcing anyone to do anything. Students pay me to teach them. I try to exceed standards at every level and will keep teaching a student until he or she has reached the point at which he or she is done absorbing information.

Sometimes, I am forced to accept the minimum standard for my students. I once had to drop a pro hockey goalie from class. He couldn't swim. We rented a pool for several hours one night. I was just trying to get him to the most minimum standard of completing a 200. Nope. Didn't happen. But, I tried my hardest. I try my hardest for every student. Not every class goes the way I want it to go. Sometimes I'm not at my best and sometimes my best isn't good enough. But, at the end of the day I drive myself to be a good teacher far more than I drive my students.
 
John, I would bet you that most of my tech classes are far more fun than most discover scuba classes. It just doesn't come across that way on the Internet. When did I say anything about beating people? We're both wasting our time.

Sparkle, I was just replying in general commentary to the discourse of the thread, how we are such a picky Stuart Smalley society today, wanting everything just so, and we are so worried about how nice or professional or non-threatening someone is or some situation is when I think a little "Cowboy Upping" wouldn't hurt. If I came home and told my dad that my scuba instructor wanted me to swim a 500 in 10 minutes, he would reply, "So, swim it," and probably tell me that's an eternity. Your comment just brought that thought to mind.

I'm such an Inquisitor for suggesting divers become better swimmers.

:inquisition:
 
I find the implication that any training that isn't frankly abusive is coddling to be offensive.

I do not respond well to being screamed at, belittled, sworn at, or otherwise abused. On the other hand, I will work my heart out for someone who gives me the impression he believes I can do whatever it is, if I'm willing to work at it. AG was like that. Yes, he used profane language on occasion, but not abusively (usually with humor). And he never gave up on me, nor did I give up trying for him.

I believe that, for most people, the best inspiration is to set an example and simply, quietly expect them to meet it. Give them information or exercises to help them get there. Give them feedback, but measure what they are doing against what they can be expected to do tomorrow, and not what the best in the world can do today. All progress, for the talented and the untalented, is incremental. I can show my OW students the videos of Andrew, but I cannot reasonably expect them to dive like he does, because it will take time to develop those solid skills.

YOU may enjoy boot camp. Not everybody does. Not everybody aspires to be JJ, nor should they. I think everyone should be fit enough not to pose a threat to themselves or their buddies, and I will happily agree that cave diving requires fitness beyond what a relaxed reef cruise does.

But I'm with John. I fail to see how good technique in the crawl has anything to do with it. Cardiovascular fitness can be achieved by means other than swimming.
 
I find the implication that any training that isn't frankly abusive is coddling to be offensive.

I do not respond well to being screamed at, belittled, sworn at, or otherwise abused. On the other hand, I will work my heart out for someone who gives me the impression he believes I can do whatever it is, if I'm willing to work at it. AG was like that. Yes, he used profane language on occasion, but not abusively (usually with humor). And he never gave up on me, nor did I give up trying for him.

I believe that, for most people, the best inspiration is to set an example and simply, quietly expect them to meet it. Give them information or exercises to help them get there. Give them feedback, but measure what they are doing against what they can be expected to do tomorrow, and not what the best in the world can do today. All progress, for the talented and the untalented, is incremental. I can show my OW students the videos of Andrew, but I cannot reasonably expect them to dive like he does, because it will take time to develop those solid skills.

YOU may enjoy boot camp. Not everybody does. Not everybody aspires to be JJ, nor should they. I think everyone should be fit enough not to pose a threat to themselves or their buddies, and I will happily agree that cave diving requires fitness beyond what a relaxed reef cruise does.

But I'm with John. I fail to see how good technique in the crawl has anything to do with it. Cardiovascular fitness can be achieved by means other than swimming.

Where did I support abuse? Where did I say the crawl was the only stroke one should swim? Scuba can be a lifelong sport and so every participant can take a lifetime to master it. Dial in something. Fix the next weakness. You'd really be surprised if you did take one of my classes.
 
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