Thoughts on DIY Emergency Oxygen Kit?

[CuzzA]

I own a boat and since taking up diving I've retrofited her to accommodate scuba. I think it's wise to have emergency oxygen available to anyone who may be diving on my boat. In my area you have to travel a good distance to get into clean deep water. Anywhere from 1-8 hrs depending on the depth you're looking for and conditions. So obviously rescue could take a while.

That said, I picked up a package deal on 3 medical O2 tanks, M24 (2013 Hydro), that came with two regs that only go up to 8 lpm which I don't think is enough flow. I paid $60 for the lot and plan on selling one. So I'll replace the 2 regs with 0-25 lpm regs. I'll buy a few non rebreather masks and bag valve masks. I know a demand valve mask would be the way to go but man are they expensive. Perhaps I'll add one in the future. I plan on keeping both tanks on my boat (cuddy cabin) with the thought that if one diver comes up hurt there's a high possibility so will his/her buddy and we may need 2 setups.

So, my questions are, have I overlooked anything? I notice some regs come with a DISS(?) outlet. Can a standard second stage screw into that and perhaps with the addition of one of those cheap full face masks OR just the second stage and nose clamps sufice to be a demand O2 supply? If that would work, would a 25 lpm flow rate be enough? Any other suggestions?

 

[packrat12]

I am far from an expert here but a couple of thoughts. I believe most applications specify 8 lpm to 16 lpm. The M24 tank has 680 liters of O2 or roughly 1.4 hrs at 8 lpm. Your body consumes around 1 lpm to 1.5 lpm normal.

I looked into this also after a OOA happened on my boat. I never completed doing it though. I looked at the fact that giving a person O2 who had an OOA or other issue is very beneficial. I think anything is better then none.

 

[tbone1004]

how do you plan on getting them filled? Keep in mind that medical O2 bottles require an Rx to fill legally...

DISS outlets won't work with scuba fittings, so don't do that.

You have to be VERY careful with demand valves. MTV-100's are best but expensive
https://www.diversalertnetwork.org/dive-store/?id=38

Realistically you are far better off getting an AL80 with normal regulator and use one of these. Put a normal second stage on one side and a BC fitting on there, plug it in and now you have both options. The normal 80 can be used for in water deco or recompression, can get fills at normal dive shops, and you're good to go.
Product detail/order

 

[decompression]

I was going to suggest the Al80 with the rescue pod as Tbone said. It'll give you the best volume at an economical cost.


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[tbone1004]

Jay, you and I are agreeing far too frequently lately.....

 

[CuzzA]

I am far from an expert here but a couple of thoughts. I believe most applications specify 8 lpm to 16 lpm. The M24 tank has 680 liters of O2 or roughly 1.4 hrs at 8 lpm. Your body consumes around 1 lpm to 1.5 lpm normal.

I looked into this also after a OOA happened on my boat. I never completed doing it though. I looked at the fact that giving a person O2 who had an OOA or other issue is very beneficial. I think anything is better then none.

Yeah, as always I should probably run my own math rather than trying to research on the web. Thanks!

how do you plan on getting them filled? Keep in mind that medical O2 bottles require an Rx to fill legally...

DISS outlets won't work with scuba fittings, so don't do that.

You have to be VERY careful with demand valves. MTV-100's are best but expensive
https://www.diversalertnetwork.org/dive-store/?id=38

Realistically you are far better off getting an AL80 with normal regulator and use one of these. Put a normal second stage on one side and a BC fitting on there, plug it in and now you have both options. The normal 80 can be used for in water deco or recompression, can get fills at normal dive shops, and you're good to go.
Product detail/order

This was my original plan, of course not without extensive study, training and equipment considerations. I believe there is an IWR course available. I fully intended on doing the IWR setup. AL80/100 with 100% O2, 30 ft. tether line, full face mask, IWR table and only with a support diver assisting the victim. Or possibly even a lower mix and deeper depth, say 50% @ 60 fsw. I know some of the crazy rig divers in the Gulf will without hesitation slap on another "air" tank and drop to 60' and slowly ascend and then slam a beer to thin their blood (I'm not advocating this, just what I've read)... After reading THIS I felt it is the most logical thing to do if you're, for example, 8 hours out from rescue in the Gulf of Mexico Middle Grounds and start feeling hurt. However, after a conversation with my instructor at the LDS he grilled me pretty hard on ever attempting it unless I was fully trained and even then suggested it was a bad idea so that's why I went with the medical surface supplied route. However, seeing the product you linked seems like a really good option, simply because it gives you "options" and obviously the AL80 holds more gas which would be beneficial even if on the surface.

Now you got my wheels spinning. For what it's worth my LDS can fill the medical tank.

 

[tbone1004]

even if they can, the cost of a new high volume regulator can't save that much money, the bottles still have to be vip'd and o2 cleaned, and you don't have the ability to take them in the water.

For IWR that obviously is different, but the reason the pods are great is because a lot of divers carry O2 in with them for accelerated deco *highly recommend that ALL divers take an AN/DP course, whether they plan on needing it or not*, and if you have your own boat, there is no harm in putting an O2 bottle on the hang line just in case.

For bottles, I wouldn't use AL100's, only AL80's or LP72's. Cheap and have good in water characteristics.

An AL80 setup for this costs the following
Used AL80-$150 after O2 cleaning
New O2 Regulator-$200
O2 Deco Regulator - Dive Right in Scuba
or integrated valve with normal second stage
Dry Suit / Pony Bottle Valve "Nitrox Ready!"
EDGE Escape Octo
Extra inflator hose-$20-want anyway, all first stages should have one anyway for checking IP before use
Rescue EAN-$115
Misc O2 accessories $40

Total is around $500 for a system that can be used on any O2 bottle, can even use it with nitrox if that is all you have since it connects to a BC inflator. Gives you an O2 bottle that you can use in the water for normal diving, etc etc.

Current system would be a lot cheaper
Current system-wash if you sell one and the regulators
New regulator $35
Misc O2 accessories $40

but limits you to surface support, and if you add in a demand valve for $250-$350 it becomes a lot closer in price. Pros and cons. I have both, but if I had to have one, it would be a standard scuba oxygen system and a Pod

 

[CuzzA]

Thanks for the info. I think I'm going to keep one M24 setup as I can probably sell the other 2 tanks and accessories and cover my costs on everything and then go ahead and do what you suggested. I just so happened to find a very clean AL80 with a DIN valve for $120 today. I have a spare LP inflator hose so all I'll need is the first and second stage deco regs, a SPG and the pod. Wish I had know about this before, I probably wouldn't even have bothered with the medical tanks.

Are there any US retailers of the pod?

 

[The Chairman]

Keep in mind that medical O₂ bottles require an Rx to fill legally...

Not in Florida. Our law clearly states that all you need is an O2 provider's card. I used to keep up with my medical oxygen bottles, valves and such. Not any more. I'm certified to carry oxygen for deco, so I always have two 40 CF 0₂ bottles with regs in my truck and often one on any boat I'm on. Demand valves do so much better than a constant flow valve since there's no waste.

 

[rx7diver]

I own a boat ...

Cuzza,

A couple of things: Is your boat large enough for a K supply bottle of oxygen? I've always thought that the small oxygen bottles are good only if emergency services are either close by or can reach you reasonably quickly. Otherwise, will the small bottles have sufficient capacity for you to pull anchor and motor to shore where emergency services might be waiting? Especially if you have two divers (say) who are simultaneously needing emergency oxygen? You wrote, "In my area you have to travel a good distance to get into clean deep water. Anywhere from 1-8 hrs depending on the depth you're looking for and conditions."

Maybe a large supply bottle with a medical oxygen regulator that can drive several (two or more) emergency oxygen delivery devices simultaneously is a better choice.

One other thing: A couple of years ago I considered using one of my unused scuba bottles as a larger-capacity emergency bottle--using an appropriate oxygen valve (can't recall the number. CG-540, maybe? I'll look it up later). In the end, because of a couple of catastrophic accidents involving oxygen deco bottles, I decided against this. I decided that if I need a large emergency oxygen bottle, I'll use a "real" one, which has a protective metal cap that screws down onto the bottle over the valve.

Hope this helps.

Safe Diving,

rx7diver