Time for a new forum?

[John_B]

John, using your own source,

6. something one believes in and follows devotedly; a point or matter of ethics or conscience: to make a religion of fighting prejudice.

4. A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.

I'm not trying to start anything, just couln't resist.

I cited references #1 and #1 from two sources, you had to go to #6 and #4, respectively.

Alaska, if you were wondering why I would argue semantics, this is exactly why.

John

 

[Zieg]

I cited references #1 and #1 from two sources, you had to go to #6 and #4, respectively.

Alaska, if you were wondering why I would argue semantics, this is exactly why.

John

Aah John? You cited definition #1 and I cited #6 and #4. But I'm pretty sure that they are all valid definitions. If I'm wrong about how a dicitionary works, let me know. You can argue about semantics all you want, when you're right.

 

[lamont]

All this discussion over several threads has to make any reasonable person wonder two things. First: Can any congregation agree on precisely what DIR is? Second: Just what is the Scubaboard DIR forum?

It is not necessary to know precisely what is or is not DIR.

Make the forum opt-in. Then the people who do not opt-in are by definition not DIR or not interested in DIR. That'll solve a chunk of problems right there.

And its only the non-DIR pot-stirrers like you who are obsessed with the absolute precise definitions of DIR. Which is why I really want to encourage the non-DIR pot-stirrers to stay away from the DIR forum.

 

[lamont]

A congregation does not have to be a church. Your comment avoids addressing the key issues raised. Besides, from the passions displayed, DIR is anything but "just a method" to its's adherents.

As a person who spent a lot of time in the interdenominational world I can't help but see some very real similarities between the discussions here and the discussions there. Most of them are passionately presented to persuade or impress, not to express.

For a forum of any nature to be truly useful the goal of its' participants has to be to express ideas.

Any subculture will have similar features. A sociological analysis of the postings in the solo divers forum would also turn up similar patterns of group held beliefs, sacred cows, etc. It is just as much of a religion as DIR, buts its dogma is the one of the co-depedent buddies and the self-sufficient diver.

Also, any system of knowledge or practice will inevitably have at its roots core beliefs which are essentially unprovable and are accepted as axioms or dogma. This is a large reason why DIR either makes sense to divers or it completely doesn't, and why solo diving either makes sense to divers or it completely doesn't. A large part of it is how we're wired up physically and what our prior experience has been over the course of our entire life and how we accept or reject the basic axioms. Which is why endlessly debating all this crap never gets anywhere and why I'm tired of the free-for-all DIR forum. ArcticDiver, you will never be DIR, I will never convince you of anything, you will never convince me of anything, please go away.

 

[John_B]

Aah John? You cited definition #1 and I cited #6 and #4. But I'm pretty sure that they are all valid definitions. If I'm wrong about how a dicitionary works, let me know. You can argue about semantics all you want, when you're right.

Oh, sorry Zieg, I'm not picking on you (though I am arguing semantics with someone else).

Yes, definitions are ranked. You have to get pretty far down the references to get to the meanings you were looking for. And the fact that they are even there are because the terms have fallen into misuse e.g. using the term religious to describe something with somewhat religious-like tendencies.

But that's why I was discussing the semantics issue with Alaska. People will take a comment using definitions #6 and #4 and turn right around and use that context to paint with a broad brush back to definitions #1 and #1.

Yes, words matter.

John

 

[OneBrightGator]

I'm not saying that there shouldn't be a DIR forum, I do wonder what you guys would talk about if you already agree on everything and the answers are already figured out.

With all due respect, Ben ... you're the one to made it personal. In a thread where the OP asked for reasons why people chose to go DIR, you responded with your reasons why you chose not to ... and those reasons were purely personal, as they had nothing whatsoever to do with diving.

Fine, they are my stories, so I suppose it is personal. What I meant by personal is that there's only one person taking pot shots around here, and it ain't me. It's just too bad that you can't see that the stories were merely examples of principles of DIR, Rule #1 to be exact, being exercised in real life and I choose not to do that, so I choose not to be DIR. That's it, no more, no less.

 

[dsteding]

just too bad that you can't see that the stories were merely examples of principles of DIR, Rule #1 to be exact, being exercised in real life and I choose not to do that, so I choose not to be DIR. That's it, no more, no less.

You'll knowlingly dive with unsafe divers?

 

[Doc Intrepid]

After 14 pages of this erudite discussion, is there anyone in this thread who would be incensed and dismayed if it were closed?

Please speak now, or forever hold your peace - or until we find another thread to all go over and spill beer on and spit sunflower seed shells all over the floor and generally fling poo over there.

 

[OneBrightGator]

OneBrightGator, you are one of those prime examples of people who should have no place in this forum. You're completely misinformed, which can be read in many of your responses.

Cite them please. Feel free to correct them also.

When you take DIR-F, almost all that you learn can be answered in black and white. This is where you get the impression that this, either black or white answer must be all of DIR and there are no shades of gray.
But as you progress, the thinking diver is formed and there are many ways to get to the same result and they all could or could not be DIR, but you'd never understand, since you haven't been there.

Huh? So DIR training teaches you how to think and modify your diving to ways that are not DIR? Sounds like a circular reference more then enlightenment to me. How can you say that DIR training produces a thinking diver when all the answers are laid out in front of you, with reasoning slanted to justify them?

The only reason you come here is to disrupt and get into one of your useless arguments.

Not true, I have tried to get some of my DIR questions answered, but they have not been to date.

 

[OneBrightGator]

You'll knowlingly dive with unsafe divers?

My definition of unsafe and the DIR definition are vastly different.