- Messages
- 93,806
- Reaction score
- 92,506
- Location
- On the Fun Side of Trump's Wall
- # of dives
- 2500 - 4999
You comment about using the victim's BC to get bouyant (rather than your own) is better, because if you loose contact it is less likely that the victim will sink to the bottom is something I totally agree with.
However the advice you give for a freeflow (shuting down the "victim's" tank is not something i agree with in the recreational setting, particularly if the diver does not have redundant breathing system.
I don't agree that a freeflow is so disorienting (but it might be for a new diver), however, even if we accept the idea that it is a huge problem, why not just use the octopus and do a normal ascent? Why shut down someone's life support system?
The basic OW diver depends on the inflator working, but your advice is to remove their ability to independently breath and to control their bouyancy...This is a potential deadly situation to a paniced, inexpereinced diver, if they simply loose physical contact with their buddy, The last thing I want is new OW divers shuting off eachother's air underwater during real emergencies!
In my mind, If the freeflow is too distracting, then the diver can breath from their own octopus and ascend as quickly as possible, while accompanied with their buddy incase they run out of air which is not unlikely.
If we compare risk benefit ratio, obviously shutting down someone's life support system during an emergency has some risks, but what are the benefits of this potentially very dangerous proceedure? So no water can get in the tank? So he can fix the reg and do another dive that afternoon with the same tank?
Again my comments are directed at basic OW divers, this thread was started by a person who was not even taught to disconnect the inflator hose from a BC, yet you recommend they shut down the individual's entire life support system?
For me, if i were diving with a buddy (and I had a pony bottle) I would probably appreciate that they shut the valve off, because I have redundancy and it just wouldn't be a big deal for ME (or you I assume), but this is entirely inappropriate for a basic diver.
I know I said this before, but can you imagine explaining to a widow and her kids that you shut their father's air tank off and he had nothing to breath, disabled his bouyancy control system and simpy because he freaked out a little during the rescue and slapped you in your face, knocked off your mask, ripped your regulator out of your mouth causing you to momentarily lose contact with the diver and he just sank super fast.. and by the time you got it together, went down and found him in the current and bad visiility ..he was dead, And you did all this so his tank might not run out on a dive?
If you can't get the freeflow to stop by manipulating the second stage, the two divers should establish phydical contact, the victim can use either one of his regs, begin the ascent, stay together, go at a reasonable pace and IF the victim diver's tank runs out, THEN they can share air for the remainder of the ascent (but this loss of air will occur much closer to the surface).
In your OW class, do you train your divers how to do an air share ascent? You should be. So they should know ... coming out of OW ... how to manage an ascent using this procedure.
You ask why not breathe off the octopus? Well, here's why ...
- Breathing off the octopus does not remove the distraction of a freeflow. It only removes it from directly in front of your face.
- A freeflowing regulator will empty your cylinder in a hurry ... possibly faster than you can ... or should ... ascend to the surface.
- By turning off the tank valve, you can in many cases relieve the source of the freeflow by giving the reg a chance to "warm up" ... as an instructor, I'm fairly certain you know what happens inside a regulator when a free-flow is occurring ... it gets very cold. Often the reason for the freeflow is the formation of ice crystals on moving parts. Removing the pressure for a few seconds can often relieve this problem ... which is why I also suggested waiting for a while and then turning it back on again (you conveniently ignored that part of my statement, I notice).
- By turning off the tank valve, you are preserving the remaining gas in that cylinder in the event that something unforeseen occurs that requires you to use it before you reach the surface. By allowing the freeflow to continue, you're dumping all that gas out into the water, where you can no longer use it.
You keep making reference to the diver having nothing to breathe ... uh, excuse me ... the diver is breathing off his buddy's air tank. Under no circumstances should a diver turn off a person's tank unless they have another breathing source available ... nor did I suggest any such thing. I also suggested waiting a few seconds and turning the air source back on again prior to beginning the ascent. That may ... and often does ... resolve the problem, so that both divers can then make an orderly ascent on their own equipment. Again, you ignored that part of my statement in your rush to make an argument.
Your reference to the OOA diver sinking is also without merit ... they're ascending ... do you, as an instructor, understand what happens to air as you ascend? In fact, the OOA diver would have to be dumping air from their BCD as they ascend in order to control their rate of ascent. Furthermore, we aren't talking about an unconscious diver here ... if they were to seperate, both divers have the ability to take action to remedy that problem right away by swimming toward each other, or as a last resort by dumping weights ... they were supposed to have learned those skills in OW too.
If they follow their training ... the training that you, as an instructor, were supposed to provide ... then by turning off the freeflowing tank and ascending while sharing air they are doing this ascent exactly as they were trained to do, with the advantages and contingencies I described above.
Sure, your method will work ... but my method gives the divers more options for a succesful outcome ...
... Bob (Grateful Diver)
Last edited: