Whats happening to diving certification? Where have the standards gone?

[markr]

Dive tables and dive computers are just two tools that accomplish similar tasks in different ways. The goal of any course should not be to use the tool but rather to accomplish the task for which the tool is used. I can teach someone to use the tables without having them understand the information the tables provide. We've all seen people that can pass a test but not apply the information in a real world situation. It's more important that new divers understand the information being provided by either the tables or a computer then which one of these tools was used to obtain the information.

I would rather see a course that taught how to use a computer and understand what it's telling the diver then one that taught the tables without the understanding.

 

[JB]

I find this interesting. I learnt dive tables, but almost never did square profiles, so when it came to filling in my dive log it became ridiculous trying to fit a multilevel dive into a square, and the pressure groups became absolutely meaningless. I never did master the wheel, which I found restricting in that, you have to define 3 or more plateaus in your profile. I think by far the majority of divers are warm water vacation divers, and tables are just not at all practical for this type of dive. For this reason most operators insist on a computer, and will provide one for you if you don't have one. Tables do not teach or explain gas physiology and nitrogen loading and decompression. Lets face it when your computer fails so does your depth gauge, and perhaps your pressure gauge, and perhaps your timer!! It's time to surface!! The rate of failure mid dive is so miniscule, it would have to be a super critical mission that would require redundancy so that the task could be completed anyway. I wouldn't want to continue diving without a computer, would be whole lot of very short dives!
High level training is not necessary for these occasional vacation divers, so the OW course has to be accessible both in terms of cost and time as an intoduction to diving. Once hooked there is plenty of further training available. I think there is a disproportional number of diving accidents amongst the more experienced and tech groups than the occasional vacation diver group (given the relative sizes of the groups). I contend that tables are a relic from the past and of little practical use in modern multilevel dives. I can get the same information from my computer when planning a dive as to the maximum bottom time at a given depth, without having to note arbitrary pressure group letters. I am very unlikely to go to 40 meters for 5 minutes and surface with a total dive time of 10 minutes, so even armed with this knowledge it is not useful. I suspect that in the multigas, decompression dives, planning is done with the aid of a computer, and not tables anyway. Finally "top gun" divers, shun both tables and computers and prefer to calculate decompression on the fly in narcotised brains! So just what is the value of learning tables? I suspect tables will and should go the way of slide rules. I may just duck for cover now.

 

[redacted]

[*]They are more reliable. GIGO applies to tables as much as computers and tables rotting in a dive bag constitute a system failure every bit as much as a flooded battery compartment.

Which version of that acronym do you mean. The most common meaning seems to be "Garbage In - Garbage Out"; but in the context of computers the alternative meaning "Garbage In - Gospel Out" also applies and can be a big problem.

I think of dive table like standard transmissions in cars. Some drivers insist on them while others are unable to use them. Both are safely on the road.

 

[Thalassamania]

Thal, I'm wondering when you were seeing these dive computers fail for being in cold water. I dive in the great lakes and ice dive. I've never seen a computer failure on my own or any of my diving friends' computers or any of our rental gear in those conditions and the environment is certainly not hospitable. I've seen plenty of failures in cameras and other electronic gear using even "fresh" batteries, and I'm wondering if the failures you witnessed where long enough ago that those issues have largely been addressed with improvements in battery technology and energy demands of modern dive computers?

Fresh water is "warm" compared to high latitude salt water. This should not be a problem with Lithium batteries.

 

[Hawkwood]

...

I would rather see a course that taught how to use a computer and understand what it's telling the diver then one that taught the tables without the understanding.

For a PADI Instructor, when teaching using the computer-only option, that is what the focus is.

 

[klinc]

Last August we were taught how to use dive tables. We spent about 2-3 hours on them and reviewed the next night. There were also 10+ questions to wokr out on the test using the dive tables.

Our instructor called the dive table class, "Dive Computer Appreciation Class".

 

[lmorin]

I learned tables only to discover that they are ancient history. Do modern surveyors still use trigonometry, levels and compasses to calculate distances, angles and areas? Nope. Their tools have been upgraded to "robotic total stations," all measurements computerized and no assistant needed. New era. My wife and I usually dive together. Two computers, a backup for each of us. If I dive alone, I carry a spare. Computers make things easier and more accurate. I'd much rather have spent the time studying tables being instructed in computer use.

 

[sotgecho]

Basic buoyancy skills, situational awareness, self rescue, and rescue techniques should be stressed more. Then proceed onto more complex items like dive tables and understanding your computer. Those skills will help you out a lot more in the short term where more diving accidents take place statistically speaking.

 

[dbulmer]

Basic buoyancy skills, situational awareness, self rescue, and rescue techniques should be stressed more. Then proceed onto more complex items like dive tables and understanding your computer. Those skills will help you out a lot more in the short term where more diving accidents take place statistically speaking.

Disagree strongly.

Plan your dive and dive your plan.

Planning involves 2 people agreeing to dive to agreed parameters which do not exceed the limits recommended by their certifying agency - ie a common depth and duration and an understanding of how much breathing gas is needed for the planned dive. (this would be a bare minimum in planning terms)

The depth and duration parameters can be sourced from tables or from a dive computer though my own preference would be from a table as for the new diver tables are more affordable.

I do believe that setting parameters before a dive can be as important as in water skills - it reduces risk before anyone gets in the water.

I believe that planning is important for all divers irrespective - it helps divers to dive within their limits and this helps to keep us safe. All the other things you mentioned are important too but if a dive plan is flawed before you get in the water it rarely gets safer once you are diving.

 

[boulderjohn]

Anyone interested in reading a recent 1214-post thread on this topic should read this one.