Why the hating on Tech?

[gypsyjim]

Long story short, there is a large percentage of obnoxious, arrogant, vocal @-holes in the population at large. To expect that this portion of the overall population would not be reflected among any give sub-group - such as tech divers - is simply naive.

I do see a bit more of this type in some younger groups of "tech" or "DIR" divers. Young, gung ho, macho types, without a lot of real world experience under their belts. Get a taste of the "cool aid", and become non thinking converts or true believers, and their loud and arrogant behavior toward anyone who is different from them is irritating. Draws a like response from true believers on the other side.

Open mouths and closed minds, on both sides.

 

[Aerosynth]

@gypsyjim and everyone else - After reading all the posts and thinking about it, I think part of the problem may be my geographic location. For most of the year, I live in Oklahoma City, OK... which is where I am currently at and where I've done all my training. What kind of divers you get out here? It doesn't take a SCUBA instructor to figure out this one. Landlocked state... I'm probably interacting with a majority of recreational vacation divers have no need or desire for tech, and don't care too much about understanding it. I live/stay in Southern California a few months each year... so I will be excited and interested to check out the dive community when I get back out there, and talk to divers there for opinions on tech.

 

[Akimbo]

That's my thinking as well. Tech diving is beyond the skill level of most scuba instructors, who teach recreational diving. A good teacher is glad to see a student overtake them in skills, but many turn resentful.

Adam

This is the very kind of overblown rhetoric that generates the backlash the OP is asking about. A little perspective please.

World-class freedivers reach far greater depths on one breath than 99% of the world's tech divers. Younger "journeyman" level commercial divers have more time decompressing than the most tech divers have in the water. All the important tech diving "technology" was pioneered 30-50 years ago. On top of all that, diving is a pretty primitive profession in the grand scheme.

There are a lot of people involved in diving at a professional and nonprofessional level whose accomplishments and skills I admire and aspire to. Some have never been deeper than 160' while others have seen over 1,600'. Some of the best diving supervisors I have ever known are terrible in Scuba, but I guarantee that they are the ones you want running your treatment chamber and "the side". I wish I had the knowledge of the environment that more than a dozen amateur photographers I know exhibit and have never worn doubles in their lives. We all have much to learn.

 

[FritzCat66]

So my question... why the hating on technical diving?

Oh, that's an easy one: Because tech divers are a bunch of haughty, condescending, holier-than-thou a$$hats who presume all us rec divers want to be them.

I have to say that the only tech diver I've ever seen was a complete jerk. But the better-than-you jerks can't make up the entire tech community.

Pretty much par for the course for tech divers, and when they're not holding forth at your LDS they're posting all over ScubaBoard, because all tech divers are carefully trained to make sure everybody else knows precisely how much more knowledgeable and proper they are.



I'm joking of course! My friend who really got me interested in diving, and who became my first dive instructor, was a real guru in the tech world, wrote training manuals for TDI, etc.; I really liked him, in part because he liked nothing better than to poke fun at his own community of tech divers. MOST of them are aware of their oftentimes negative perception within the community and are actually decent people, once you get past the fact they're tech of course (sorry, couldn't resist...).

Here in Florida with the caves in one direction and reefs in the other, we get all kinds of divers from one extreme to another, and I must say, the discipline involved in tech diving is noticeable in the water even on rec dives - well, for MOST of the techies anyway (there are some real wannabes in that bunch, too, even more hilarious due to their own hypocrisy). They even talked me into doing Cavern just for some of those skills, and rec-oriented as I am, I did appreciate that, even though, as someone already said on this thread, to me, diving outside a reef is just all wet rocks and rusty metal (and I used to be a [non-diving] spelunker and NSS member, so I do know something of the beauty of caves).

I choose to stay within recreational limits because it's simpler and I get to see and do everything I want within those bounds, and I can't think of much that would turn me off of diving more than to hang around on a line just breathing gas. But I'm glad tech is an option for those who want to do diving that's, well, more technical in nature.

In fact, I would say most of my dive pals are tech-trained divers. And I have actually learned a few things from them.

When they deign to let me dive with them, anyway...

 

[DebbyDiver]

NAUI Solo???? PADI Solo???? Look in the mirror, you just described a perfect tech dive. Deco is only one facet of tech diving, not a requirement. It is all about mentality, skills, and self-reliance. (who were you gonna call?)

-DD, agree completely, why I went tech also.

(Inactive) NAUI Instructor #7188 (from back in the day when sex was safe and diving was dangerous) and I pretty much always feel safer diving solo than with a buddy, depending on the dive I'm doing. I had a great (tech trained and equipped) buddy for the Vandy in June, for instance, not a dive I'd do solo. OTOH, lobstering or picture snapping in warm, calm, shallow waters (60'-ish or less) I'm just more comfortable solo. I never thought of my solo diving as tech diving until you just pointed it out, I just thought of it as not having to worry about someone else while I enjoy my e-z style of diving. It is NOT for everyone and I pretty much discourage others from doing it (do as I say and not as I do).

There is plenty of water for every style of diver, yet I have heard both tech and rec put each other down. To me it is all diving, and there is room for us all to dive as we please.

WONDERFUL statement!!!

While I agree that not dying requires planning, do you have any statistics to show the number of "recreational diving" injuries/deaths vs the number of "technical diving" injuries/deaths? Granted the exact number of divers, and definitions of what's recreational vs technical are not really nailed down, but there are certainly enough "recreational" injuries/deaths for me not to assume injury/death does not occur to "recreational" divers.

I'd be willing to bet that there are far more rec deaths just because rec is far more accessible to the average out of shape, remote-control-clicking diver who only takes their gear out of the garage for mini-season or a trip to the Keys.

Thinking of rec vs. tec brings to mind the majority of divers in my very large, very long-established dive club. I've only been diving for 30 years and there are many members who have been diving for much longer. You would just laugh at the variety of gear seen on club dives, some of it purchased back in the 80's. Yet I'd trust my life on an average rec dive with any of them because we are comfortable and experienced with the equipment we have and use, and we dive frequently.

 

[karstdvr]

Oh, that's an easy one: Because tech divers are a bunch of haughty, condescending, holier-than-thou a$$hats who presume all us rec divers want to be them.

I guess I can relate. I have been a cave diver for over 15 years,with 1000+ cave dives,and that is generally all I do. Sometimes I will go diving with my wife in the springs or on a wreck,and look forward to getting rid of 100+++ pounds of gear in favor of my falling apart Dacor BC,and an Al80. At the springs I will encounter the move out of the way attitude because a real diver is coming through,or on a dive boat I will get a snear because I am not in a BP/W with a "techno look". If we respect the person having fun,no matter what the dive is that they are doing,then we lose the attitudes.

 

[tstormdiver]

If we respect the person having fun,no matter what the dive is that they are doing,then we lose the attitudes.

AMEN!:cool2:

 

[DennisS]

(Inactive) NAUI Instructor #7188 (from back in the day when sex was safe and diving was dangerous) and I pretty much always feel safer diving solo than with a buddy, depending on the dive I'm doing. I had a great (tech trained and equipped) buddy for the Vandy in June, for instance, not a dive I'd do solo. OTOH, lobstering or picture snapping in warm, calm, shallow waters (60'-ish or less) I'm just more comfortable solo. I never thought of my solo diving as tech diving until you just pointed it out, I just thought of it as not having to worry about someone else while I enjoy my e-z style of diving. It is NOT for everyone and I pretty much discourage others from doing it (do as I say and not as I do).

WONDERFUL statement!!!

I'd be willing to bet that there are far more rec deaths just because rec is far more accessible to the average out of shape, remote-control-clicking diver who only takes their gear out of the garage for mini-season or a trip to the Keys.

Thinking of rec vs. tec brings to mind the majority of divers in my very large, very long-established dive club. I've only been diving for 30 years and there are many members who have been diving for much longer. You would just laugh at the variety of gear seen on club dives, some of it purchased back in the 80's. Yet I'd trust my life on an average rec dive with any of them because we are comfortable and experienced with the equipment we have and use, and we dive frequently.

I like that term, E-Z Style, 5 minute drive, walk in, 20 or 30 ft depth, no one to keep track of, warm water, good visibility, lobsters, tropical fish and two hours of bottom time in a t-shirt. Yesterday the water near shore was bordering between warm and hot.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

One day of chilling at my LDS and you can meet world-class UTD, GUE, or TDI tech instructors and you can meet world-class recently DIR-F'd douchebags. Both types represent some personalities in tech diving, but the douchebag "tech divers" are the most visible and most vocal. They never seem to dive for fun, they have a HATE on for snorkels, and they slag every course that isn't one that they have taken. This is not good business for instructors or shops trying to make money by teaching divers, and it pains a new diver to be slagged, or have his "stoopit" brand new BC mocked by a "senior" diver. The recreational instructors resent this intrusion by the vocal (and usually relatively ignorant and new) "tech" contingent. IMO the "real" tech divers have reasons to go to depth, or extend bottom time. They don't talk about how "hard" or "cool" it was to do a tech dive, they talk about how cool it was to visit this wreck, or see that cave, or see certain kinds of deep life.

I'm not sure if I am making sense.

In short, there isn't a generic "hate on" for tech divers, it's that some folks appear to hate some tech divers or their attitudes, or distrust what they might be trying to do to their shops, customers, or clientele.

We used to have a group of cocky young men like that around here ... we referred to them as "the posse". They'd show up every Saturday, hang out on the sea wall snickering at all the OW students with their split fins and snorkels, and eventually go out and "practice" their back kick or shooting a bag. Never really seemed to go diving just for the fun of it.

They lasted about five years, and then one by one they stopped diving altogether. With one exception they're all off being "the best" at something else now. That sort of personality exists in every recreational endeavor known to mankind ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[fjpatrum]

I hear ya. I'm interested in cave diving and am *s l o w l y* working my way toward that and you cannot imagine the looks I get when others find out. You should know that the tech route is very expensive with the gear, training, gas etc. I may have to sell an organ to support my diving addiction.

Again, good luck with whichever path your diving passion takes you.

Make it a lung, that way you use less gas when you're down.