Wondering about the old Farmer Johns

[Eric Sedletzky]

M&B wetsuits in Long Beach, CA can make any vintage style wetsuit you want.
Don has the original patterns from the late 50's for beaver tail wetsuits, pants, pointy hoods, anything you want. His pointy hood pattern is the exact same pattern that was used to make the hoods for the Sea Hunt show. He even has original nickel zippers from that era, not reproduction zippers, the ACTUAL zippers that have been sitting in a drawer for years.
He can make skin both sides suits too if that's what you want.
Don't expect cheap though, the dude has to make a living and there's no way he can match chinese worker $2.00 a day prices. His suits start about $500 but they are worth every penny and they are custom fit to you.

Don just called me the other day and wondered why more vintage suit oficionados haven't called him. I said I don't know, I've tried to spread the word but you know how it is talk is cheap.

If you want a true classic new vintage style suit this is the place to get it.
M&B Wetsuits (562) 422-3493

Before anybody says anything, I'm not affiliated with M&B in any way and gain nothing for my plugs except maybe a little insurance that he'll remain in business so I can continue to get great suits.

Here are a couple pics of a classic beaver tail commercial urchin suit he made for me.:

 

[JamesBon92007]

I am pleased that it has been established and confirmed that neoprene shrinks over time. That was the only possible explanation I could come up with

Although "technically" the coverall pants may be the actual Farmer John portion, but I'd always heard the expression referring to the pants and the beavertail, long sleeve jacket.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I started in a Harvey's High Tide wet suit - a pair of high waist pants with a beaver tail jacket over the top.

Farmer john bottoms were big news and an improvement in terms of adding more material over the torso as well as more space to seal the joint between top and bottom of the suit.

At the time I remember first seeing them, farmer john suits came with beaver tail jackets. The next "new" feature was eliminating the metal twist fasteners and replacing them with velcro on the beaver tail. To me, that defines the end of the "vintage era". People think vintage diving is all about double hose regs, but in fact it is all about those iconic twist fasteners on vintage beaver tail wet suits. They exuded "cool".

Then came the use of a "shorty" style jacket with the farmer john bottoms. That made (and still makes) some sense as it allowed a much more comfortable long sleeve shorty if you opted to wear the jacket alone. They are a lot warmer, but not nearly as "cool".

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I started in a Harvey's High Tide wet suit - a pair of high waist pants with a beaver tail jacket over the top.

Farmer john bottoms were big news and an improvement in terms of adding more material over the torso as well as more space to seal the joint between top and bottom of the suit.

At the time I remember first seeing them, farmer john suits came with beaver tail jackets. The next "new" feature was eliminating the metal twist fasteners and replacing them with velcro on the beaver tail. To me, that defines the end of the "vintage era". People think vintage diving is all about double hose regs, but in fact it is all about those iconic twist fasteners on vintage beaver tail wet suits. They exuded "cool".

Then came the use of a "shorty" style jacket with the farmer john bottoms. That made (and still makes) some sense as it allowed a much more comfortable long sleeve shorty if you opted to wear the jacket alone. They are a lot warmer, but not nearly as "cool".

See my post above, notice the stainless twist lock fasteners?
They are stilll available, that's what I'm trying to explain to you guys, you can still get this stuff new. I wouldn't have velcro because it wears out.

The suits I have made aren't some guy saying "Well let me see, I think if I cut it like this it will kind of look retro". No, these are THE ACTUAL patterns from when his aunt and mom made the suits back in the 50's, so essentially you would be getting the exact same suit as what they would have made then. The only thing that is not vintage is the material but there's not a lot we can do about that.

The next suit I'm getting is going to be skin both sides. He can order neoprene without nylon.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

ZKY,

I wouldn't go back to a skin both sides wetsuit. I ripped mine so many times in the early '60s that I don't think I'd like that now. I remember one dive with a big rip on the back of my jacket (before Farmer Johns) in Clear Lake (37 degrees F year long). That was not pleasant.

My favorite is a Harvey's suit I had for years, and completely wore out. It was 3/16 inch on the torso, and 1/8 inch on the arms, with a 3/16 inch Farmer John bottom. That one gave me the flexibility to use it almost anywhere, and was pretty warm too. These suits were skin-in, nylon out (mine were black out with orange arms). They are extremely durable, and warm because with the skin-in, the seams are completely sealed. The skin-in requires either powder (corn starch--don't use talc as it is not great to breathe), or soapy water to get into it.

SeaRat

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

ZKY,

I wouldn't go back to a skin both sides wetsuit. I ripped mine so many times in the early '60s that I don't think I'd like that now. I remember one dive with a big rip on the back of my jacket (before Farmer Johns) in Clear Lake (37 degrees F year long). That was not pleasant.

My favorite is a Harvey's suit I had for years, and completely wore out. It was 3/16 inch on the torso, and 1/8 inch on the arms, with a 3/16 inch Farmer John bottom. That one gave me the flexibility to use it almost anywhere, and was pretty warm too. These suits were skin-in, nylon out (mine were black out with orange arms). They are extremely durable, and warm because with the skin-in, the seams are completely sealed. The skin-in requires either powder (corn starch--don't use talc as it is not great to breathe), or soapy water to get into it.

SeaRat

John,

The only time I would wear a skin both sides suit would be for vintage exhibitions. I know how tender they are and now with the softer stuff unlike Rubatex it would be even worse. But it would be cool.
The other thing that can be done is to use skin/nylon and build the suit for nylon in. But that kind of defeats the purpose of skin to skin for warmth, but for the retro look it could be done.
All my suits are skin in. One is lycra out and the other is nylon out. A skin in suit is absolutely the way to go, not to mention how comfortable and wonderful they feel worn commando with a water and hair conditioner lube

 

[duckbill]

I know that some were made with smooth skin out and nylon in, as my vintage smoothskin suit is that way. Also, the sharkskin suits I have and have seen all have nylon in and skin out, so I assume that was a transitional period before going to nylon on both sides.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

If you'll look at my avatar, I'm wearing a black wet suit in the 1980s in that photo. It is a pullover (hood attached) 1/4 inch jacket, with a Farmer John pants. It is nylon-in, skin-out with a "toughskin" type surface. This made it more flexible (the texture on the outside).

I'm wearing the 1/4 inch skin-in Harvey wetsuit. I liked both, but I still have this suit and have sold the other.

The transition from no nylon to nylon-in came to get ride of the need for powder to get into the suits, and also to strengthen the suits. There were even advertisements about how puncture-resistant the nylon-lined suits were. Nylon-in suits were very easy to get into, as long as they were dry. But once wet, they are a real pain--same goes today. And now, if you are not careful, the nylon-two suits have seals which leak like sives because the stitching goes through the seams. This makes the newer suits potentially much "colder" in cold water. Some of the new tropical suits apparently do not have a "skin" on the outside too, which means that they will absorb some water and the neoprene may not be completely "closed-cell" material.

SeaRat

 

[duckbill]

Nylon-in suits were very easy to get into, as long as they were dry. But once wet, they are a real pain--same goes today.

I have yet to try a skin-in suit, but isn't this equally true of them when using talc/cornstarch? I thought this is why some resort to soapy water instead. I do understand a skin-in suit dries much faster than a nylon lined one though.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I have yet to try a skin-in suit, but isn't this equally true of them when using talc/cornstarch? I thought this is why some resort to soapy water instead. I do understand a skin-in suit dries much faster than a nylon lined one though.

Most people who use skin in suits these days use a water/hair conditioner mixture, about 5:1 or 6:1 water to conditioner mix. The lube is kept in a spray bottle. I have taken it one step further and I fill a bucket with hot water and put the spray bottle in it then seal it with the lid. When I get to the dive site my suit lube is nice and warm and I avoid the shock of getting in an ice cold lubed up wetsuit.
Baby shampoo works too.
The suits never stink because they dry real quick and because the conditioner makes them smell nice.