Bad Dive Master

[LG Diver]

Now if you really want to get me going, tell me that I should be respecting a PADI Master Diver. While their skills should be a little higher than most, really all a PADI Master Diver is, is a person who spent a bunch of money on over priced specialties (What the heck is a Night Diver Specialty?)

I'll agree that the specialties are somewhat overpriced, but I think it's a function of economics. Most specialty courses only have a small number of students and the instructor has to make some money at it. I don't think that most instructors are too happy about dedicating an evening or two and a weekend to do a specialty with one student. In that sense, I'm happy to pay the fee if it means I get a better instructor. If the course only cost $40 you can guess what level of instruction you'd get.

I think that there are those that get the MSD cert because they are card-collecting, and there are those that have a goal in mind. I'll end up with an MSD cert by the end of August, but that's not my goal. I want to get into wreck diving and I put together a program with my instructor to do the following specialties: Nitrox (done), drysuit, deep, navigation, and finally wreck. My goal is to do penetration dives on the Yukon by the end of summer. The MSD card is a cool memento of the accomplishment, but nothing more. Scheduled to head out to San Diego August 13th and 14th. The anticipation is killing me!

 

[scratchmyback]

I am just finishing up my OW certification with my checkout dives this coming weekend. I checked with the club I belong to to see how soon I would be able to take the AOW and they told me I need a minimum of 10 logged dives (my 4 OW checkout dives count towards this total). The next course is in August so I will qualify for that. I will try to get some more dives in than the minimum.

I've seen so many differing points of view on when one should take this...or whether or not it's even necessary. My thinking is, I know I wouldn't want to take it, or be ready to take it without several dives under my belt. But I also wouldn't wait until I had so many dives to take it that it would seem redundant. Hopefully by the time I get those 10 or so dives completed I will have a better handle on my bouyancy and trim and will be able to enjoy the course.

The way I see it is, it's 5 dives, and I can either get some extra learning and practice with the AOW, or I can do 5 other dives on my own. The cost for me is not the issue. My own comfort and self-reliance are what is driving my decision.

Laura

 

[mntdiver]

Do a search on deep water blackout. It is not that uncommon.

Unusual under these circumstances. On SCUBA and less that 110 feet? We're not talking high ppo2 or apnea diving here. I'd like to see a printout from her computer, if she had one. I'm not a DiveMed Specialist and I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but, with these circumstances, it would be very unusual, barring any other factors such as medical conditions or equipment issues.

 

[Michael Schlink]

Catherine I'm calling you on your comment on the Coast Guard. Some day you may have to take it back when it hurts the most. Every "coastie" may not be as great in and on the water as you but there are quite a few of 'em that work hard, try hard and do a damn good job-I read some of your posts, you should be above this comment.

 

[c555]

The woman whho blacked out didn't know exactly how deep they were. They went down very fast, not just a casual descent. They were using computers but don't know the final depth because the computer locked them out from a too quick descent and they didn't bother to find her deapth on the bottom. I don't know if it was deep water blackout or just a very fast descent that caused this because I wasn't with them at the time, I was having a fung time (lol) with my divemaster.

 

[fishb0y]

Don't worry Catherine, I'll stand by your comment...

I've always wondered why most of their boats are inflatable and made of rubber...
:mooner:

 

[Cacia]

Catherine I'm calling you on your comment on the Coast Guard. Some day you may have to take it back when it hurts the most. Every "coastie" may not be as great in and on the water as you but there are quite a few of 'em that work hard, try hard and do a damn good job-I read some of your posts, you should be above this comment.

I value the Coast Guard and know there are lots of good people doing a great job...my apologies. I think I misspoke, I meant we make fun of some of the Coast Guard because they will insist on looking up current for people, and basically the problem the boat captains have, is that SOME of the Coast Guard insist on certain procedures on a search that are a waste of time. Everybody has some dopes, DM, nurses, doctors,...it is not an exclusive club! I have had about six captains tell me, Catherine, if you are in trouble call the fire department..they have a boat, a heli. From what I hear respond faster and are more effective. Could be that the Coast Guard is bogged down in too much red tape...I have no idea. Poor form for the way I put it out there though. Here, where I live...ask around, many boaters do not call them if they are in trouble, they call the fire department.

What happens in Hawaii has little to do with where you are. At the very least, I would say they have a PR issue here. I should have been more specific.

They require dive boats to have aspirin but not O2....there is a lot of material there but I am not saying the organization is no good. I do apologize.
Also, you have made me realize that I only hear the boat captains.....so I am probably a bit biased without even knowing it.
Not sure what the problems are but I have heard boaters BEG on the radio and get a not-very reassuring reply back. Conversing with the fire department has a more responsive, less bureaucratic feel, in an emergency, here...OAHU. It appears to others as though the fire department seems more invested in the community....And they are not really an enforcement arm either, which must effect the relationship on a rescue that is, optimally, a team effort.

And please acknowledge at least, that my comment was in the context of one poster saying "hey blame the Coast Guard" and me saying.."oh don't worry we do" (blame everybody at some point in time)

 

[fishb0y]

I'll agree that the specialties are somewhat overpriced, but I think it's a function of economics. Most specialty courses only have a small number of students and the instructor has to make some money at it. I don't think that most instructors are too happy about dedicating an evening or two and a weekend to do a specialty with one student. In that sense, I'm happy to pay the fee if it means I get a better instructor. If the course only cost $40 you can guess what level of instruction you'd get.

I think that there are those that get the MSD cert because they are card-collecting, and there are those that have a goal in mind. I'll end up with an MSD cert by the end of August, but that's not my goal. I want to get into wreck diving and I put together a program with my instructor to do the following specialties: Nitrox (done), drysuit, deep, navigation, and finally wreck. My goal is to do penetration dives on the Yukon by the end of summer. The MSD card is a cool memento of the accomplishment, but nothing more. Scheduled to head out to San Diego August 13th and 14th. The anticipation is killing me!

No need on telling me how the fee structure works... been there, done that. With just the basic courses (OW, AOW, Rescue) I have made as little as $40 a student (AOW here in Hawaii,) to $150 a student (AOW & Rescue in South Carolina). It isn't the fees that I am talking about, it is the fact that you take a "super AOW" class, consisting of Peak Performance Buoyancy, Boat Diver, Navigation, Deep & Night Diver and maybe a couple of other mamby pampy courses, and you come away with the PADI "I Spent Money to say I'm Great" Card. Of course you could say the same thing about an instructor, but people gave me the cash to say how great I was. But hey, if you have a goal, by all means go towards it, but remember, just because the card says you're a "Master Diver" doesn't always mean so. Get that experience now that you have some of the basic skills.

BTW, I quit teaching because of my work schedule, not for violating standards.

 

[LG Diver]

No need on telling me how the fee structure works... been there, done that. With just the basic courses (OW, AOW, Rescue) I have made as little as $40 a student (AOW here in Hawaii,) to $150 a student (AOW & Rescue in South Carolina). It isn't the fees that I am talking about, it is the fact that you take a "super AOW" class, consisting of Peak Performance Buoyancy, Boat Diver, Navigation, Deep & Night Diver and maybe a couple of other mamby pampy courses, and you come away with the PADI "I Spent Money to say I'm Great" Card. Of course you could say the same thing about an instructor, but people gave me the cash to say how great I was. But hey, if you have a goal, by all means go towards it, but remember, just because the card says you're a "Master Diver" doesn't always mean so. Get that experience now that you have some of the basic skills.

BTW, I quit teaching because of my work schedule, not for violating standards.

I don't disagree with anything you're saying. Like anything else in life, you'll get out of it what you put into it. If someone is just looking for another card to stroke their ego, it's all too easy to put down the platinum card and buy some bragging rights. If you find a good instructor, put together a sensible plan, and then build your experience I believe the cards can actually mean something.

 

[wedivebc]

Unusual under these circumstances. On SCUBA and less that 110 feet? We're not talking high ppo2 or apnea diving here. I'd like to see a printout from her computer, if she had one. I'm not a DiveMed Specialist and I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but, with these circumstances, it would be very unusual, barring any other factors such as medical conditions or equipment issues.

Deep water blackout is thought to be caused by a sudden increase in PPCO2. The rate of increase probably has more to do with it than the actual depth.
I don't know what equipment issues would cause someone to black out (at least on open circuit)