Can you "borrow" the crewpack for PADI OW?

[PhilEllis]

Its surprising every LDS doesn't do this -- just have a price for the class and include the materials and build that into the price.

I guess its one of those tatics to get people in the door.

Scuba Class for a dollar!*


*does not included all your required equipment that you must buy from us also or we have a hissy fit

In many states, combining would cause a sales tax problem. Combining non-taxable "services" like instruction and taxable products like a student kit would not be allowed. Of course, a store could elect to tax the entire course; but this would be a disservice to the customer who would be paying sales tax on services that might not be taxable.

In addition, a customer may choose from a variety of different presentations of the crew pack. Lumping them together would only make it more difficult.


Phil Ellis
Discount Scuba Gear at DiveSports.com - Buy Scuba Diving Equipment & Snorkeling Equipment

 

[vondo]

The reason for the required Hologram in some areas (chiefly Caribbean area) is that many resorts in those areas were loaning students books for the class. I got my OW training in such a resort. A few weeks after being certified, I wanted to go back and look some stuff up in the book and regretted not owning it. In all classes I have taken since then, I have gone back on at least one later occasion to check some information.

I got my AOW (do the rules differ by class?) in Thailand this way. But I had them order the book for me too which showed up after my class was done. I've looked back on it a few times, glad I have it. But if I was smart I would have got it mail order here and not have lugged it all over Thailand and Malaysia.

 

[driftin' by]

Consistancy is at the heart of all stardands. I'd like to hear from PADI directly what exactly constitutes 'personal copy'. If the intent is to fulfill the notion of building a resource library of diving manuals then unless I'm getting divorced our library will remain... 'until death do us part'.

I have no knowledge what PADI's standards are but it would appear that the majority of responses from those qualified to know (Instructors) is that the materials can be shared among family members and that the KR's do not need to be detached and tuned in. Therefore, just as I suspected, my new LDS is full of it and their truthfulness regarding the matter pales in comparison to my previous, legitimate, upstanding LDS in Ohio. Just this January, we were required to turn in our KR's for our Nx class. It's too bad because I've been holding off on pursuing my DM but have been getting the warm and fuzzies with another local shop that is SSI. This helps with my decision of going SSI now and the hassle of having to buy all new gear.

Yes we also got the crewpack for "free" IE -- It was included with the class.

I couldn't agree more with this concept. If you must have individual materials for each participant, it should be included in the price of the course since effectively the course is nothing without them. It's my same beef in the airline industry... why don't they just include all the BS taxes in the price of the flight up front. It's not like it's a option to not pay the taxes!

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I include materials in my course fee but due to state regs have to give two seperate receipts. One for materials and one for services. I also have no issue with students sharing manuals as they can buy it from me or from amazon, ebay, or Joe's bookstore. The student workbooks though are rerquired for each student to have their own. But in families I give a nice discount to ease the sting (and they are still way less than a crewpak, I know, I wasted a bunch of money on the ones I have,Used from ebay would have worked just fine.).

 

[knotical]

do the rules differ by class?

PADI's Instructor Guides for AOW, Rescue and DiveMaster have essentially the same words as OW - that the instructor:

must ensure that student divers have, in their possession, a personal set of materials for study and use during the course and for reference afterward

 

[Tigerman]

Personally I still USE my books still, both the OW and the AOW ones. I like browsing through them to refresh the theory every now and again, especially when its been a while since I last dived.
Im doing it less now than I did before, but the first year it was actually quite handy to have the books available when I was not certain of something.
I guess I need to put another dollar in soon and get the nitrox ones and take that course as well. Would be handy to be able to breathe some voodoo gas on certain dives..

 

[jmorriss]

Is there anyway for a lowly AOW to get a copy of this policy? My OW/AOW in FL keeps the original KR on file (torn out of book) and refuses to allow photocopies-kinda a PITA when the GF and I both take classes from him, we don't need 2 copies of the same reference book when things are said and done, and we especially don't need 2 of the same crappy DVD. Meanwhile when I did my Drysuit class my buddies PADI guy could care less, and just reviewed the KR.

 

[Pearldiver07]

Is there anyway for a lowly AOW to get a copy of this policy? My OW/AOW in FL keeps the original KR on file (torn out of book) and refuses to allow photocopies-kinda a PITA when the GF and I both take classes from him, we don't need 2 copies of the same reference book when things are said and done, and we especially don't need 2 of the same crappy DVD. Meanwhile when I did my Drysuit class my buddies PADI guy could care less, and just reviewed the KR.

To refuse photocopies has a legitimate place - copyright laws. But I see no reason that they wouldn't accept a blank piece of paper with the answers on them.

Each course has different standards, and OW is pretty clearly defined due to many law suits challenging whether the training was done or not.

That said, any shop can make up more stringent rules if they want - and if they think that they won't lose too much business over it.

And as an earlier post said, PADI doesn't make anything off of a training class except for the payment to create the certification card. So yes, they're going to do what they can to ensure that you have to buy the materials each time - they're in business to make $. Any business that isn't in it to make $ needs to file for not-for-profit status or consider why they're there. But as I said earlier... It's a matter of how many customers are you willing to lose?

 

[jmorriss]

To refuse photocopies has a legitimate place - copyright laws. But I see no reason that they wouldn't accept a blank piece of paper with the answers on them.

Each course has different standards, and OW is pretty clearly defined due to many law suits challenging whether the training was done or not.

That said, any shop can make up more stringent rules if they want - and if they think that they won't lose too much business over it.

And as an earlier post said, PADI doesn't make anything off of a training class except for the payment to create the certification card. So yes, they're going to do what they can to ensure that you have to buy the materials each time - they're in business to make $. Any business that isn't in it to make $ needs to file for not-for-profit status or consider why they're there. But as I said earlier... It's a matter of how many customers are you willing to lose?

Under copyright laws you are permitted to copy small sections of a work for things like education use. I am pretty sure this is called "fair use" ?

 

[300bar]

If you purchase a crewpack for cheap, then you must make sure that it has the pic application envelop inside. Otherwise, the dive shop will just have to sell you another crewpack so that you have the credit for the certification fee.

Without the pic credit, the manual is virtually useless...

I hope that makes sense?

No,it does not make sence.
In the 15 years I've been teaching PADI courses,I've NEVER seen a pic envelope IN a crewpack.And it never has been or ever will be.
IF that where thrue,someone buying a crewpack in any PADIshop would have the possibility,to get a cert. without taking the course.
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