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Dive Agencies PADI, SSI, SDI, NAUI, YMCA, ACUC, CMAS

Discussion in 'Basic Scuba Discussions' started by GDI, Dec 19, 2003.

  1. GDI

    GDI Artificer of Havoc & Kaos ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Florida & The World
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    :doctor:
    Has anyone ever really looked at the curriculums of these different agencies or others for that matter. Have you noticed how similar they are and the differences. PADI although they still call it AOW on the cert card has changed the program to Adventures in Diving. SDI requires that you complete 4 specialties and have 25 logged dives before being considered AOW. Yet I wonder that when looking at all the different agencies why do I not see any new secret skills. I guess it all comes back to the instructor/diveshop as to the quality of instruction a diver gets. PADI is the largest agency because of their system in the early years and their marketing, NAUI, SSI and SDI all have great programs. CMAS,YMCA and ACUC have longer but good programs as well. When I see a diver I have no idea what agency they have been trained through. I can in some cases fiqure out who their instructor was but until I see the card the agency remains a mystery. I have seen bad divers from all the above agencies and I have seen some good ones. We have seen this type of agency bashing on SB many times, Ladies, Gentleman lets get over it. Lets agree to disagree or to look at the individual diver and their particular instructor rather than poking the 60 psi finger at the agency.......
     
  2. Capt Jim Wyatt

    Capt Jim Wyatt Hanging at the 10 Foot Stop

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    I totally agree -- I have also seen absolutely unprepared divers from all the agencies & I have seen excellent divers from all agencies.

    Seems to me too..its the instructor & NOT the agency.
     
  3. AzAtty

    AzAtty Instructor, Scuba

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    Is that what it's called? I think I like that even better than "the timeworn salute of the impotently furious."
     
  4. Walter

    Walter Instructor, Scuba

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    Do you believe agencies should not be held accountable for low standards?
     
  5. boomx5

    boomx5 DIR Practitioner

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    I believe the agencies should be held accountable if their standards suck.
     
  6. Capt Jim Wyatt

    Capt Jim Wyatt Hanging at the 10 Foot Stop

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    I agree. As far as I can see none of the agencies standards suck.
     
  7. GDI

    GDI Artificer of Havoc & Kaos ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Florida & The World
    2,265
    185
    63
    The low standards really are the result of application of standards by the instructor and instructor trainers
     
  8. Capt Jim Wyatt

    Capt Jim Wyatt Hanging at the 10 Foot Stop

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    Yes indeed. I agree
     
  9. diverbrian

    diverbrian Instructor, Scuba

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Sanford, Michigan
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    I am not bashing any particular agency here, but Walter and Mike Ferrara have both pointed out problems where someone operating within the standards can produce unsafe divers and instructors. I realize that any instructor that I work with will temper those standards with common sense.

    The basic standard that I like that I don't see printed enough is IANTD's standard where "ATTITUDE" is listed in the standards and that an instructor doesn't feel forced that they have to pass anyone for anything if they can do the skills. I wish that more agencies had the statement that "you pay for training. You EARN certifications."

    But, the good instructors don't seem to run into this very often for some reason. They inspire their students to want to learn if the student has the motivation. So overall, I feel that standards could stand some improvement, but as they are written by humans and humans aren't perfect, neither will the standards ever be perfect. They will always need to be tweaked depending on what the times are. The only constant in life is change, right.

    This is why I avoid any bashing of any agencies standards, classes, etc. like the plague. They all have their areas where they are better than the others and also have their areas where they are not so good. In general, I have to agree that I have seen good and bad instructors from any of the three major agencies in the United States. Likewise, I have seen good and bad divers from all three.
     
  10. GQMedic

    GQMedic Instructor, Scuba

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: SoCal. (Yeah, baybee)
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    The Blame...

    Don't blame the agency, blame the INDUSTRY. (That would be US)

    When factoring in GREED, the fast buck shoots us all in the foot. Courses are cheaper (This is not a good thing) corners are being cut to push through numbers.

    "The Devil In a Box" is simply this: Factor in the above, Instructors are left with a decision, Make the course longer, charge more for it, train better divers and end up paying to teach, or go the "shake-n-bake" route and stay afloat in the numbers crunch. (Insert Jerry Maguire: SHOW ME THE MONEY)

    Until the industry decides it will COLLECTIVELY raise standards and prices (I don't see this happening anytime soon) this will always been an issue in the industry as a whole.

    Where to point the finger? PADI, SSI, SDI, NAUI, YMCA, ACUC, CMAS, etc, they don't suck, These agencies are just trying to stay alive while WE set the standards, the prices and compromise the same... We who cut the corners, push the numbers, etc, WE SUCK. We will continue to suck for as long as we sell "Diver In A Box" to the masses.

    **Footnote*** After I re-read what I wrote, I felt so strongly about it, I submitted it to NAUI "Sources" for publication.
     

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