Mid-Range BP/W Suggestions for Newbie

[ams511]

A few things: 1) Shoulder pads can always be added latter if you want. They run about $15-$35. 2) Unless you purchase an older plate most modern plates have slots for cam bands and can be used without a STA. Consequently it is the wing that usually determines if you need an STA. 3) You can also add a weighted STA to add about 6 lbs of non-ditchable weight. 4) For cold water diving you will probably need a wing with 35-40 lbs of lift. 5) Golem is another brand that has a good reputation.

 

[rivers]

Thanks Rivers- can you explain how the Hollis elite 2 is not a "one piece" harness? I don't know the difference. I also saw this one: Backplate, Harness and Wing Systems (BPW) by Dive Rite - Dive Gear Express like the padding on both this one and the Hollis, as well as the black connector buckles. I don't mind paying the extra $40 for these- and I don't need to put it together like the HOG (not that it is that much of a pain.) The HOG wing you suggest looks great- and cheaper than the DSS one. I'm looking to get a slightly longer regulator tube (maybe 16" instead of 12") for the inline octo.

Regarding the integrated octo- talked to a lot of people about it, and a dive instructor I worked with uses one when he dives(not when he is instructing students). One less hose I guess. I'm looking to streamline as much as I can, since I want to be able to focus on photography when I'm on the bottom. If you have any insights into them- I'm all ears.

One question I have is with these BP- many don't list whether you need an STA or not? The DSS plates specifically say you don't, but others don't say one way or the other. They all look like they have the tank strap holes already, so how do I tell which need STA's? Someone just suggested that you can add an STA anyway, for the extra weight for cold water diving.

Interestingly, also see one of the Dive Rite Wings can be used for both singles and doubles- which would mean no need to purchase another wing down the line(?):

DR Rec EXP Wing ({45 lb | 20.4 kg} Lift)

i think it was in about 4 or 5 pieces. Far too many d-rings, and it was just a faff. It never felt secure either. I would suggest trying a OPH without padding first, if you feel you need it, buy some after. Padding adds buoyancy as well. No doubt you will be able to drop some weight off the belt.
On my single tank set-up, I have weight pockets on my cam bands. Depending on which undersuit I use and whether I'm in salt or fresh water, I use 2-6kgs. Max of 4 in cam band (2 in each), and a 2kg weight belt.
regarding inline octos, never used one myself. But, from what I understand, they aren't the easiest breathing regs. I use the same reg on my long hose and bungied back-up. Great for streamllining, but there is nothing wrong with a standard reg set-up.
I use an sta on my single tank. The hog wing doesn't need one, but i think it feels more secure.
as others have said, don't get one of the combine single/double tank wings. It's not good for either. Buy a single tank wing now, and if you decide to move to twins, just get a new wing.

 

[fnfalman]

Even if your trim was perfect you'll have a 2 foot long regulator/bcd inflator dangling. Good luck taking macro photos with that elephant trunk dragging along the bottom.

I've dived with UW photographers who somehow can do macro without having the inline octo dragging along the reef.

Difficult to use? The tech setup has the octo on a bungee necklace around the neck, just how difficult is it to look down and put it onto your mouth?

I said that the inline octo is more difficult to use. Hence the OP needs to weighs one less hose versus usage.

Rec out of air drill, notice how close both divers have to be to do it?
SSI Scuba Skills Update 23 - Air Sharing Ascent (Primary) - YouTube

Once again, inline octo aren't as easy to use for air sharing BUT do-able. It's all about practicing with your equipment configuration.

Tech ooa drill
UTD Essentials of Recreational Diving DVD Skills Preview - S-Drill - YouTube

Don't care. I'm not a tech diver, and neither is the OP.

What could be simplier and safer?

Not diving with people who aren't skilled or care enough and run out of air?

It's ironic that you mention about the bump head issue, when your transpac sits the tank even closer to the body...

Did I claim that the Transpac doesn't have head bump issue? I was talking about how STA would put the tank out far enough so that there wouldn't be a head bump issue with BPW setup. However, the Transpac is a different animal. I have head bump with it, others don't. YMMV.

 

[SangP]

I've dived with UW photographers who somehow can do macro without having the inline octo dragging along the reef.

I said that the inline octo is more difficult to use. Hence the OP needs to weighs one less hose versus usage.

Once again, inline octo aren't as easy to use for air sharing BUT do-able. It's all about practicing with your equipment configuration.

I see so it's more difficult to use but cus it weights less and there's one less hose you advice it's usage. Ok got it.
The short octo air sharing is taught by PADI and many other rec schools so I'll leave it at that. Just cos it's do-able doesn't make it better. I can inflate my wing and breath from it too... what does that prove?

Don't care. I'm not a tech diver, and neither is the OP.

Not diving with people who aren't skilled or care enough and run out of air?

Lack of skill isn't the only reason why OOA happens, I'm sure you know that.

Did I claim that the Transpac doesn't have head bump issue? I was talking about how STA would put the tank out far enough so that there wouldn't be a head bump issue with BPW setup. However, the Transpac is a different animal. I have head bump with it, others don't. YMMV.

Some wings like DSS and I "think" Oxycheq have built in stubs to hold a single tank solid against the backplate thus do away the need for an STA. However, sometimes this configuration would have the tank sits too close to your back and you'd have the "regular bump head".

My bad, I understand now. To you, an STA eliminates the bump head issue because it sits further away.
My question to you then is how much further away would an sta push a tank away to eliminate the bump head? Of course everyone is different so YMMV.

 

[fnfalman]

I see so it's more difficult to use but cus it weights less and there's one less hose you advice it's usage. Ok got it.

It's a different configuration. If it's not better for you, then don't use it. You don't have to make sarcastic comments about it. Attitudes like yours is what turns people off from the DIR crowd. You may have a lot of good things to say, but people simply ignore your advice because of the holier-than-thou attitude.

The short octo air sharing is taught by PADI and many other rec schools so I'll leave it at that.

But you don't "leave it at that", do you?

Just cos it's do-able doesn't make it better.

Nobody claims that it's better. Just different. It's not that hard of a concept to grasp.

I can inflate my wing and breath from it too... what does that prove?

It proves that you have another technique to work with. Another solution in your brain for an emergency.

Lack of skill isn't the only reason why OOA happens, I'm sure you know that.

Inattention and equipment malfunction are also the reasons, however, there isn't too many cases of equipment malfunctions IF the diver were to take care of the equipment. So, it's back to lack of skills and inattention.

My bad, I understand now. To you, an STA eliminates the bump head issue because it sits further away.

No, TO ME, the STA is there to hold the tank tightly against the plate. The bump head issue is a bonus.

My question to you then is how much further away would an sta push a tank away to eliminate the bump head? Of course everyone is different so YMMV.

I don't know. I don't make it a point to go about and measure people's neck extensions then compare them to the heights of the various STAs available. I only know and care about my own configuration. Others are welcome to do their own research to find out which STA; if at all, would solve their head bump issue. Or maybe people simply don't care enough about head bump issue and go without STA. Don't know, don't care. Ain't my problem either way.

 

[Entacmaea]

Hey all- looks like I am converging on a Dive Rite TransPlate System at divegearexpress- looks like it has all of what I am looking for- nice harness, wing, and dumpable weights for cold water. I'll probably go with the HOG regulator set up as well- best price I could find.

Doing a little more research, I like the underarm hose routing for the primary with a swivel elbow. The last remaining questions I have are about the inline octo. I feel better realizing that I give my primary away and I use the inline octo (using a longer hose on the primary)- which somewhat eases concerns about a panicked buddy pressing the wrong inflator buttons. But, while breathing on the inline octo, does it retain the ability to fill and vent the wing (Dive Rite Voyager EXP 35lb) to control ascent?

 

[eelnoraa]

Most STA today actually make head bump issue worse. The reason is poorly design STA. Read one my thread : http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/bu...ble-intentional-just-no-one-thinks-about.html

To sum it up, STA does put another 1.5 inch space between your back and the tank. However, most if not all STA today also raise the tank mounting position higher, much higher. The end result is worse head bump. Now, if you are find one of the better design STA. Yeah, you will mitigate head bump problem

---------- Post Merged at 10:55 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 10:47 AM ----------

Hey all- looks like I am converging on a Dive Rite TransPlate System at divegearexpress- looks like it has all of what I am looking for- nice harness, wing, and dumpable weights for cold water. I'll probably go with the HOG regulator set up as well- best price I could find.

Doing a little more research, I like the underarm hose routing for the primary with a swivel elbow. The last remaining questions I have are about the inline octo. I feel better realizing that I give my primary away and I use the inline octo (using a longer hose on the primary)- which somewhat eases concerns about a panicked buddy pressing the wrong inflator buttons. But, while breathing on the inline octo, does it retain the ability to fill and vent the wing (Dive Rite Voyager EXP 35lb) to control ascent?

A few comment on your gear choice:
1. Being in SF bay area, HOG brand regulators are not widely support by local dive shop. In fact, the only one shop I know will service HOG is in Santa Cruz. So keep that in mind.
2. I would highly recommend getting Yoke first stage over Din for your first reg. Most if not all rental tank in this area is Yoke. So you will be using Din-to-Yoke adaptor with Din reg, which first eliminates all advantage of Din or even make it worse, and second push the 1st stage close to your head. If head bump is your issue, it will make it unbareable.

 

[avengerki]

Doing a little more research, I like the underarm hose routing for the primary with a swivel elbow. The last remaining questions I have are about the inline octo. I feel better realizing that I give my primary away and I use the inline octo (using a longer hose on the primary)- which somewhat eases concerns about a panicked buddy pressing the wrong inflator buttons. But, while breathing on the inline octo, does it retain the ability to fill and vent the wing (Dive Rite Voyager EXP 35lb) to control ascent?

While I have limited experience at least the Aqualung Airsource 3 you can fill and vent the wing while breathing on it as I have practiced with this inflator. This may not hold true for all others but most of the others I have researched appear to have the same functionality, it just doesn't make sense that you would need to remove the octo to fill or deflate your vest.

 

[fnfalman]

Hey all- looks like I am converging on a Dive Rite TransPlate System at divegearexpress- looks like it has all of what I am looking for- nice harness, wing, and dumpable weights for cold water. I'll probably go with the HOG regulator set up as well- best price I could find.

I have used the Transplate with steel plate the last four years and I liked it. I only went to the Halcyon just because I wanted something new to goof around with. If you like ditchable weight pouches then go for it, just remember to calculate your rig's weight correctly so that you can get the right wing for it (not too big, not too small). If you prefer to go with the smallest wing possible then consider wearing a weight belt.

Doing a little more research, I like the underarm hose routing for the primary with a swivel elbow. The last remaining questions I have are about the inline octo. I feel better realizing that I give my primary away and I use the inline octo (using a longer hose on the primary)- which somewhat eases concerns about a panicked buddy pressing the wrong inflator buttons. But, while breathing on the inline octo, does it retain the ability to fill and vent the wing (Dive Rite Voyager EXP 35lb) to control ascent?

You can breath and inflate your BC through the inline octo. HOWEVER, if you were to want to deflate, then you'd have to take it out of your mouth to deflate. Otherwise the air from the wing will go into your mouth.

There are a couple of ways to be able to handle this issue:

1. Take the inline octo off your mouth, deflate, stick it back in.

2. Get a pull dump instead of elbow. That way you can pull to vent and still breath through the inline octo.

3. Breath out, hit the deflate button, swallow the venting air, let the button go...repeat cycle.

It really is not as user friendly as a separate octo and regular power inflator. So you will really have to ask yourself whether or not the one less hose is worth the extra hassle. For me, it is. For others, they need to figure it out on their own. Whichever configuration you go with, practice, practice, practice, practice, practice.

PS I was talking about the Atomic Aquatics SS1 inline octo. The Air2 is similar in function. I don't know about the Air3. I'll defer it to those who have used the Air3.

 

[Entacmaea]

The continuing inline regulator debate! I guess it depends on the model that I get and its functions, the Airsource 3 does seem to have a dump valve to vent while using it, but others it is unclear. While I do think i would be able to master and adjusted technique to use one, I will have to ponder further.

Good to know about the HOG service issue- will have to check in with Bamboo Reef here to see what they service.

Also, Yes, planning for a DIN use down the line as the tank I ultimately want to dive is a HP Steel 117. Can I get a Yoke first stage now and switch out the actual valve to a DIN when I buy an HP tank, or would I need to buy a whole new fist stage if I didn't want to perpetually dive with an adapter?