Open Water Dives were today, and I Failed, yet passed.

[WillAbbott]

First a wee bit of background. I have not had a SINGLE problem with skills in the pool except one minor time. On the first time we did either partial flood, full flood, or mask removal/replace (I think it was the partial flood one) one of thoose I inhaled a little water and choked (little bit of panic for about .5-1seconds and I was fine) other than that I did great. Partial floods, full floods, mask removal/replace I could do with out a problem, easy as pie.

This last week I had a cold start (the saturday on the week before OW dives) it wasn't until our last pool session that my ears would finnaly equilize. I had minor equilization problems in the last pool session, and comming up no problems with the pressure comming out. The BIG problem I had, and BIG Surprise was that I all of a sudden was having a hard time doing mask clearing. I would feel like I was trying to blow out my nose but nothing was comming. The instructor worked with me on it once after that (I had signaled in the middle of skills I wanted to go up and talk to him) and he said I was doing fine, and air was comming out my nose, but for some reason I couldnt feel it, it felt like I wasn't getting air out. And I also was sort of choking and having trouble breathing.

Well I thought it was weird but didn't think too much of it other than I didn't get it. So OW Dives come around and we go and play in the lake, first dive nothing. Vis wasn't that great and I was pretty comfy in the water, got a few cool rushes of water but never anything I would call cold, just chilly. We did our first dive which was basically a look around dive other than surface skills. And we got out, hung out a little while (and I started to get cold) debrifed, briefed, geard up and went back in. As we went back in I didnt feel cool, or comfy, I felt cold, even before going down. So we went down sat on the bottom and started doing skills. As were sitting there (and I'm waiting patiently for my turn) I get colder and colder, to the point where I feel like I should be shivering but I don't seem to be. Oh also, not sure why but the whole day I seemed to have a little more trouble breathing than usual, especially deep full breaths. Anyways, its my turn. Partial flood and clear... I think nothing of it other than remembering to SLOWLY flood it as the instructor told us, since the water is really cold, and he doesn't want it to shock us and we spit our reg out. So I crack the top seal ever so slightly and my mask, Slowly but surely floods with water. Once about 1/3 full I push it back closed and begin to try and clear. Well as soon as water was up to my nose I seemed to have trouble breathing. It was taking all my mental strength and physical control just to breathe deeply. And again, I can't seem to get air out my nose. I try and try and just keep trying to get air into my lungs and breathe, and every 4th breath or so try and get it out my nose... Finnaly I get the mask cleared and I'm sitting there thinking WHOAH, WHAT THE HECK WAS THAT ALL ABOUT!... So next its onto complete flood and clear. So now I'm a little nervous as I've NEVER had soo much trouble breathing (with nose in water) or clearing. So I crack the seal again, and flood it, and its going ok. A little trouble breathing as its flooding, working as hard as I can to get full breaths and not choke (again taking all I have just to breathe) and its finnaly full. Again I can't seem to get the air out my nose, and I try and try. What seems like an eternity goes by (probably about 5-10mins) and I haven't cleared but a little if any of my mask, and Now I'm starting to hyperventalate, trying my hardest not to, and to get full breaths. Finnaly I decide if I don't get up now I'm going to be in trouble.

So I open my eyes enough to see my instructor and signal to ascend. Grab his sculder, and he grabs mine, grab my LPI, and I follow him up, staying at his ascent rate. We get to the surface, I hit my LPI to float, pull my mask down round my neck and reg out, and sit there probably 10mins just catching my breath.

We talk a little and he thinks its in my head (I don't think so, maybe it was/is but it just seemed odd I did it SOO easily in the first pool sessions and now I can't seem to do it) He makes me prove it by blowing out my nose at the surface. After about 10mins we descend, and skip this skill (we will do it after everyone finishes the skills). We get back to the bottom with the rest of the group and do Fin Pivot, Reg retrive, buddy breath, and finnaly buddy breath ascent.

After this we split up into a group of buddies with a DM or instructor for a short tour. I told him I was cold, which by this point I had been shivering in my hands and feet, probably arms, and legs also, for the past 5-10mins. So he sends my buddy to join another group so we can redo full mask flood and clear and get out. He has me tow him accross the chanel once to try and warm up, which warms me enough to stop the shivers and feel just cool instead of cold. We go down, this time in about 10feet of water instead of 20. And I go for it again. I slowly flood my mask fully... and SURE enough I can't breathe, its taking all I can to breathe fully and I finnaly choke out a couple breaths to purge my mask (not sure if it was my nose or not, I may have ended up pulling the bottom of my mask away and catching the bubles from my reg, I think I did, just don't remember) Finnaly I get it 2/3 clear and can't breate, so stop clearing for a min or 2 take about 5breaths, and finnaly choke out some air from my nose to completely clear it. We ascend, and call our break for lunch for 1.5hrs while he gets air fills.

So I'm really worried now, that no matter how hard I try I am failing to clear without chocking, and fighting to breathe and not hyperventalate. Knowing that we still have a mask removal to do in dive 4, and not knowing that in dive 3 (to take place same day as 1, and 2) to do another full flood and clear. I get back to my room, to get warm, warm my suit up, and eat, and I am still having trouble breathing. Now starting to think that maybe my cold is the problem with ALL that is going wrong, since its still in almost full force with my sinuses. And that maybe my cold has moved to my lungs in the form of Bronchitis or Pnumonia (which has happened to me more than a few times)

So I call my instructor on his cell and talk to him, and decide I want to not dive any more this weekend, I just don't feel like I can get through the skills because I'm having trouble getting air out my nose for some reason, and the fact that I'm still having trouble breathing, out of the water, out of my suit, and warm in my room.

Anyways, the finnal decision was/is that I didn't do dives 3or4 he will give me the PADI Scuba Diver, since I've met the requirements for it. And hopefully within the next year I'll tag along with another of his classes and complete dives 3 and 4 so I can get my PADI OW Cert. (The Scuba cert. was just so that I could dive if it ends up being a while before I can do dives 3 and 4, just have to go with a DM or Instructor)

So I have several problems. After this experince I'm not all that sure I want to try dives 3 and 4, EVER. At least not without trying it in the pool a time or 2 more and not being sick at the time of the dives. Also if I do them I'm requesting a dry suit, being as I was SOOOO COLD (I shouldn't have been shivering, no one else was, they were cold, but not as cold as I was, uncontrolable shivering isn't good, BTW I'm 6'0" and 160ish so I'm pretty much skin and bones) Not knowing why I couldn't clear with my nose and not knowing if it was in my head, physical, cold related, or WHAT? and the fact that after all this, I wasn't as happy as I thought I would be.

Most people do pool session 1 and breate off the tank and go WOW! This is amazing, and what not. I was like, yep kinda what I thought it would be only easier to breathe than I thought. and on our first OW dive tour, I was like the vis isn't that great, no biggy its the NW, but what are we doing, its all sandy/mud for the bottom and a few snags, and then a few crawfish, and 2 boats sunk by one of the dive shops for thier classes to have something to see. So I wasn't all that taken with it as most people say they are or as I thought I would be.

In the end I'm dissipointed and MAD at myself, whether it was a mental, physical, or cold related problem, I mad and dissipointed that I couldn't do it, that I had to give up, etc. But I also want to know WHY? Was it in my head, if so why? I had no reason to be afraid or doubt myself. Was it just the cold? and I couldn't do it no matter how hard I wanted to? Or what

Anyways, thats my long post. Thanks for reading, interested in what others have to say. But Honestly (and lets be honest for goodness sake) I wasn't that thrilled with the whole dive expericnce (even before the clearing problems today) And I know they teach in the PADI book that dives will be pleasnt and horrible and not to let the bad ones get you down. But I just wasn't that thrilled with seeing the stuff in the lake, it was just kinda like, yep thats mud, thats a snag, thats a crawfish, and Oh semi-cool a boat, but I dunno. Sorry to take up the time. Thx for reading, thx for all the support thus far. I'm not sure what I'll do. Maybe a boat charter or some other dive (dry) will let me see something great and make me go back and get thru dives 3 and 4, or maybe I've lost something and can't get it back or do the skills

 

[raxafarian]

I feel like I'm facing into a hurricane and can't take a breath everytime I remove my mask (or completely flood it), and the colder the water is, the worse that feeling. Don't know if that explains it, but it just feels like "hey... I want to take a breath... I just can't.

100 dives later and it still feels the same way. I still practice every few dives. I know how it's gonna feel, and just relax and take my time and take deep breaths. I first felt it on my first ow class (46 deg. water). It seems like a long time to be able to take a breath, but it was probably only 3-5 seconds.

Don't know if this is how you felt, but just wanted to share.

 

[WillAbbott]

I would say its fairly similar. Only I would often start to hyperventalate and have to work really hard to slow my breathing. Also emagine it like you discribed, only now add that in the middle of all that you try and force air out your nose yet nothing happens, except you choke, or struggle for the next breath. That would be more like what I had happen. I just dont get why I had no problems the first time in the pool, then 2nd time in the pool, or actually more like 5th or 6th time (I had practiced other times on my own just cause.) you all of a sudden have difficulty with it, then on your OW dive that previous difficulty is multiplied about 100times. Honestly if it is some problem that no matter what I do I can't fix it, other than to just think through it and try to work it out, maybe I shouldn't dive. Cause what happens if sometime you lose your mask and can't seem to clear it, and your sitting there fighting for air, but you can't get it, and you can't surface unless you have a good buddy to help u, etc. Just my personal view, if I can't do it, I probably don't belong in the water, because I'm just asking for trouble.

 

[raxafarian]

try this
ok...you did it in the pool. Your sinuses could very well be the culprit, along with a little xtra anxiety being in open water for the first time.

Do you have a swimming pool avail? if not, find a hotel with one, or someplace. Take your mask and snorkel.....maybe a weightbelt, or a friend/family member. Find a spot in the shallow end (maybe on a step) where you can sit on the bottom and have your head be just under water. Use the weightbelt, or have somebody hold you under by pressing on your shoulders. Have your mask and snorkel on. Breath thru the snorkel...it's just like breathing off a reg. Partially flood your mask...keep breathing.. clear. Keep doing this. Then flood your mask. Clear it.

My wife just could NOT blow out her nose... took 2 nights of this and all of the sudden, VOILA... she cleared the mask.

PS... sit there underwater with the mask off for longer and longer periods of time.

Ken

 

[MikeS]

Try it in warmer water! It’s easier to perform any of the required skills when you're relaxed and let’s face it, it’s hard to be relaxed when you’re cold. Being cold makes everything ten times harder!

You can finish your OW certification with a referral somewhere where the water is warm and clear! In fact the two dives you’ve made should count so you’ll only need two more. Once you’re comfortable doing the skills in warm water, and have more self confidence, it’ll be easier in cold water.

Mike

 

[Walter]

First, don't dive when you are congested.

When you feel better, go to the pool and practice no mask breathing and mask clearing. Problems clearing the mask may have been a result of congestion, but I don't think so. You mentioned having difficulty breathing when your mask is flooded. That indicated congestion is not the problem.

I've explained how to easily master no mask breathing and mask clearing in a post a couple of years ago. You can find step by step directions here: http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=171&perpage=15&display=&pagenumber=1

The third post will get you through your difficulty. Keep us informed.

 

[WillAbbott]

Thanks Walter and everyone else for the ideas. Yes I can do dives 3 and 4 elsewhere, my instructor mentioned it. Or I can do them with him sometime. He wasn't sure but he thought I have a year before I would have to take the whole class over again (which wouldn't be too terible, it was a good and easy class)

As for the practice, we are having a discover SCUBA this Thursday and I'm taking a couple of friends. There shouldn't be any reason I can't sit in the shallow end and try it, and if theres not many people he may even let me use a SCUBA unit and play with it.

I do agree that I think the cold water had a lot to do with it. But also think (and I probably will go see the doctor this week) that my cold may have affected my lungs, or moved there, as a day later I still feel about the same with how I'm breathing.

I still just don't understand why I had trouble breathing through my nose other than it being cold related, or due to the medications I was taking. But my current doctor it turns out is a diver (only NAUI OW and hasn't been since her OW cert., but still a diver) and so I will probably see her this week and let her know what happened, and see what she thinks.

 

[Birdman]

"...our first OW dive tour, I was like the vis isn't that great, no biggy its the NW, but what are we doing, its all sandy/mud for the bottom and a few snags, and then a few crawfish, and 2 boats sunk by one of the dive shops for thier classes to have something to see. So I wasn't all that taken with it as most people say they are or as I thought I would be."

How comfortable you are in the water in my experience has everything to do with how much fun it is to be there and how much you enjoy what's around you. When I am cold underwater it affects my outlook, ie you start wondering when this dive is going to end (even when you are not shivering as on your first dive). I found this especially on my first winter dives. I would suggest getting a warmer wetsuit (7 mm farmer john so you have 14 mm over your body core) or drysuit with a warm undergarment. You might be amazed at the difference this makes. Also you should try diving in the ocean, there's a lot to see. I don't know if the others addressed this or not but make sure you keep some distance between the mask skirt and your nose -- this can interfere with clearing.

 

[WillAbbott]

We actually did have 7mm 2peice suits.. water was just dang cold, and the weather was so terrible we couldnt dive the jetty's as we were to do on dives 3 and 4.


But just to let you know, I had also posted this whole thing to a NW list and I got a reply from the Publisher and Editor of our main NW dive magainze asking me to call him. So I did, and he of course said as many have that he thinks this was the same as many other people have happen, though the way I described it seemed different. He wants to help me get through this. He suggested I go talk to the owner of my LDS I goto and let him know briefely what happened, and that I talked to him, to call him if the owner wants. And see what the LDS Owner thinks. He thinks I should goto a warmer dive if I can (not something really in my budget) but deffinately should either dive it dry or wait till summer when the temp is right for wet dives. He wants to help me with getting the LDS owner to help me and all, and wants to see me succeed and help me through this. Then after I pass, he wants to publish the whole story in the magazine, about how I had trouble and tried again, to finnaly succeed.

Another sign that divers are GREAT people (not like I didn't know it already ) But he wants to help as much as he can in talking to the LDS owner and all, and then publish it.

I must say that after all the support from this board and This guy I am ready to go talk to the LDS owner and see what we can do, and to try and get through theese dives again. The fact that he wants to publish it is just kind of a neat bonus (I really could care less, but it would be neat to see an article about a nobody like me )

Of course talking to the LDS somewhat goes around my current instructor, so in order to keep from offending him, or making him mad, I plan to talk to the LDS owner first, and then talk to my instructor and let him know about all that has happened since OW, see what he thinks, etc. As the saying goes "don't burn your bridges behind you" However in all seriousness, if he has a problem with it and doesn't seem to ready to help me other than giving me a dive to try again on (which he really is a pretty good guy, and I would say hes a fair to good instructor, from what I know of dive instructors) I will go around him. In the end this is about me, not about keeping instructors happy, and if I have to p*** him off or what not to get through it I will, I don't want to but, this is about me not him, and my succeeding.

Thx again all for the great support, You all seem like a great bunch and I really appreciate it.

 

[ERP]

I did my open water 3 or 4 months ago.
Like you I had no issues with no mask breathing, or mask clearing in the pool. However I was surorised to find that I found the same skills challenging on the open water dives.

I attributed some of it to the cold and some of it to the salt water which seemed to irritate the inside of my nose enough to make me gag. I've done 24 or 25 dives since and it's really not been an issue for me since the open water cert dives, so there was probably an element of anxiety involved aswell.

Personally with the exception of the end of dive 4 where we just pootled around the cove we were in, I really didn't enjoy the checkout dives.

I have however enjoyed every dive since open water, even the AOW nav dive. I just love the way it feels when I'm neutral in the water just hovering there.

Once you feel better, you should persevere and complete the last two dives.

Just my 2c