Shift in Thinking

[danvolker]

Some years ago, as I first started going deeper, staying longer, hoarding regulators, etc. I noticed a cultural oddity around me that I found it hard to wrap my head around. The Tech vs. Rec divide.

FOR EXAMPLE:
Recreational Course Director who reads all the magazines, certifies hundreds of competent students a year, attends all the shows, is as just as pretty in the water as a hawksbill turtle, been diving all over the world for decades, and should bloody well know better:
"Those tech divers are just macho hooligans with a death wish. There's nothing to see where they go, the way they dive is dangerous, and their back-inflate BCs will float you face-down in the water."

Techie who could have Sheck Exley award but stopped logging ages ago, more hours on 1/2 dozen different CCRs than most dive clubs have combined dives, first deco stops usually far deeper than anyone else ever even goes, been a push diver on expedition teams in places you've never heard of, and should bloody well know better:
"80s divers can't even swim worth a damn, much less dive right. If they aren't going to do it properly why don't they just save the money for their travel BCs and take up knitting?"

I couldn't understand it because I was perfectly happy and having a roaring good time in either environment. 200 feet down and 1000 feet back in a cave? Awesome. 30 feet down on a reef watching a secretary blenny for 1/2 an hour? Awesome.

I figured the Rec person (from the example above) just didn't want their lack of understanding about the tech world to take away from their well-deserved feeling of expertise. And the Techie... well, perhaps they simply couldn't remember back to when they could only dive once or twice a year and clearing their mask was still a challenge. What was wrong with straddling both camps, I thought? It's one sport, right?

Now here's the trouble and why I bring this all up...
I've been diving for only about 12 year now. Instructing (recreationally) for 8. Tech diving for about 9, cave diving for 7. Been on a rebreather for about 6. I don't know when it happened, I don't think it was a single event or just the buildup of DMing boatload after boatload of certs...

Recreational divers annoy the hell out of me.

I'm still perfectly happy with a 30 foot reef bimble (at least, I think I probably would be... it's been a while since I've done one). I don't HAVE to go into deco to be happy on a dive. But listening to recreational prattle puts my teeth on edge.

I don't like this about myself. I was a newbie not that long ago. I still am a newbie in a million ways. And I've got to figure out a way past the prejudice.

I ask this of both sides of the fence: wondering if I'm alone here.

I have seen this division in some places....And I am thankful that I live in an area ( Palm Beach) that has so many awesome 60 to 125 foot reef and wrecks--with drift currents, that the recreational divers tend to be more advanced, even if not teked out....and the tech divers enjoy these dives WITH the recreational divers, and then they also have their own dives ( 160's to 280's) , separate from the rec crowd...And since they already dive together, there is little, if any pecking order. I don't see any.

What I see each weekend on a boat like Splashdown divers, is both sides of this equation talking about an awesome dive they just did on the Castor with 200 jewfish....the rec divers having just as much fun as the tech divers....and just as able to re-live the experience on the surface interval as the tech guys. On this boat, and many others, there are so many "regulars", that everyone becomes friends, and there is no posturing. The posturing that the OP refers to, the divide in the culture, is the "US versus Them" concept, and the more separated each group gets, the worse the problem....another reason why having lots of challenging recreational dives that the tech crowd likes also, helps to destroy the Us versus Them nonsense, especially with a core group of divers on a boat that speak to all divers on a boat as equals.

I think boats can have a certain ambience...they get it from crew, captain and regulars....and from the sites they visit most often...

So I think we can avoid the defective culture of "us versus them", by trying harder to find the right boats to dive on. When we get on the right boat, we also have to make sure that even the brand new novices don't get the idea that we think we are a "higher class of diver" than they are...."We", tech divers, are NOT a higher class of diver. The ultimate goal is to have fun...and a novice can often do this just as well as we can !

 

[tomfcrist]

I'm on my phone so I'm not going to take the time to quote it, but Dan....you hit the nail on the head when you said "we tech divers are NOT a higher class of diver". Do we enjoy a different type of diving than the majority of divers do?? Of course, but there is no heiarchy among divers based on the type of diving we do.

As much as it pains me to say it... I think George said something to the same effect during one of the old DIR videos. It was true then, and is true now.

 

[Steve_C]

. But I am rarely upset with the diver; I am upset with the instructors with whom that diver has interacted, who have clearly not shown what is possible and encouraged them to reach for it.

Agree the instructor may have failed. But not all students really pay attention to the instructor much less remember it a few weeks later.

Instructor (me a week ago). Here are the sections that will be on the test, note that X is not on this list. Student A. So X will not be on the test. Me, that is correct. Two minutes later, student B raises their hand. Will X be on the test? These are junior/senior college engineering majors.

 

[AdivingBel]

Agree the instructor may have failed. But not all students really pay attention to the instructor...

Sure, there are aspects where an OW instructor can fail, even more so in a cold water, low viz environment, but basic OW for warm, blue water dives is well... pretty basic. IMO responsibility for reef kickers, rude silt stirrers, and otherwise completely oblivious divers lies with the individual. Even as a new diver with new diver skills you don't have to be a reef destroyer. Acccidents may happen, but if you come to the sport with respect for the "new to you" environment, you can be careful and give the reef "space." You don't have to go pounding through other divers, kicking masks, and regs out of mouths. That doesn't NEED to be taught in a class. As a new diver, you can look behind you and see what you are stirring up, and if you don't have the skills to do otherwise, that's O.K. for now, stay away from the photographer. I guess all I'm saying is you can have all the training in the world, by the best instructors, but if you're an inconsiderate person, you'll be an inconsiderate diver. Skills are important, but attitude goes a long, long way. IMHO.

 

[Michael Guerrero]

Recreational divers annoy the hell out of me.

I'm still perfectly happy with a 30 foot reef bimble (at least, I think I probably would be... it's been a while since I've done one). I don't HAVE to go into deco to be happy on a dive. But listening to recreational prattle puts my teeth on edge.

It's hard to watch someone do something poorly when you know with a little effort and some decent mentorship or instruction they could do it much better.

It's hard to watch someone destroy an underwater environment that you and others are there to enjoy, especially if they're oblivious to the damage they are causing or directly interfering with your dive.

It's VERY hard to watch people who dive poorly brag about it.

 

[The Chairman]

So I think we can avoid the defective culture of "us versus them", by trying harder to find the right boats to dive on. When we get on the right boat, we also have to make sure that even the brand new novices don't get the idea that we think we are a "higher class of diver" than they are...."We", tech divers, are NOT a higher class of diver. The ultimate goal is to have fun...and a novice can often do this just as well as we can !

Damn Dan... that was good.

That can be applied to a lot of what we do: yes, even here on ScubaBoard. The raison de plonger may be different for each of us and that's OK. Viva les différences!

 

[uncfnp]

I dive some of the same areas as Dan and I can agree that I have never felt judged as rec vs tech while diving. In fact, I have found that tech divers can be almost too helpful as I flounder through the grey zone between rec and tech.

But I have felt that way on SB. And I did get it from many of the "tech" instructors I spoke with about taking tech courses. Somewhat interestingly, I have not seen that attitude among the cave instructors I have personally spoken with. A case study of one but the cave instructors have seemed much more focused the the attitude and aplitude of the diver. (Ok all you tech instructors, let me have it. I DID say it's a study of One)

In reality, it's not the gear or even the dives that should define the diver but rather the attitude and skills they bring to their chosen dive environment. In short, it's not rec and tech but good (and safe) and bad (and unsafe) divers. The automatic knee jerk of some on SB that recreation or even vacation divers equals bad diver is just as wrong as similar other assumptions in life.

 

[nolatom]

I have seen this division in some places....And I am thankful that I live in an area ( Palm Beach) that has so many awesome 60 to 125 foot reef and wrecks--with drift currents, that the recreational divers tend to be more advanced, even if not teked out....and the tech divers enjoy these dives WITH the recreational divers, and then they also have their own dives ( 160's to 280's) , separate from the rec crowd...And since they already dive together, there is little, if any pecking order. I don't see any.

What I see each weekend on a boat like Splashdown divers, is both sides of this equation talking about an awesome dive they just did on the Castor with 200 jewfish....the rec divers having just as much fun as the tech divers....and just as able to re-live the experience on the surface interval as the tech guys. On this boat, and many others, there are so many "regulars", that everyone becomes friends, and there is no posturing. The posturing that the OP refers to, the divide in the culture, is the "US versus Them" concept, and the more separated each group gets, the worse the problem....another reason why having lots of challenging recreational dives that the tech crowd likes also, helps to destroy the Us versus Them nonsense, especially with a core group of divers on a boat that speak to all divers on a boat as equals.

I think boats can have a certain ambience...they get it from crew, captain and regulars....and from the sites they visit most often...

So I think we can avoid the defective culture of "us versus them", by trying harder to find the right boats to dive on. When we get on the right boat, we also have to make sure that even the brand new novices don't get the idea that we think we are a "higher class of diver" than they are...."We", tech divers, are NOT a higher class of diver. The ultimate goal is to have fun...and a novice can often do this just as well as we can !

I love all of you.

And I like diving Palm Beach and Jupiter too.

 

[3D diver]

Us vs. them...it's human nature, not good, but human nature.

One of the reasons I shore dive rather than boat dive is the comradery---just my buddy and me. Boats add a social/crowd/ego dynamic I just don't wanna deal with.

 

[NAM001]

Ive been on both sides of the fence as most of us have when it comes to mentoring. One thing i have found, that is mostly constant, is that you can not approach someone and offer advice. In todays society it is taken as an offensive act. What you can do is let them see you dive and allow them to approach you to find out how you do the impossible things you seem to be able to do. So long as pride is in the equation most divers are in the 12 step program of diver improvement and are in denial of both the problem and that they are in the program. When someone achieves acceptance of the problem, they are at that point half way down the road of gettng better and will persue a fix for it. Whether it be how do you get 2 dives on a tank and I get barely one. Its all the same process. I once watched a couple hovering at 20 ft for nearly an hour while they hand chatted and that was the main drive for me to persue that same skills and level. You can only get so much out of a training, when a class is whats left over from the lawyers and ins co.s activities. I now have learned to take any course as the basics and ground work to allow me to objectivly evaluate and learn from others. We all are painfully aware of how little abilities so many divers complete a course with.