new diver - first dive problems

[wetb4igetinthewater]

So who do you blame? There is no one else to blame - the good news is he seems to now realize how dangerous what he did was. Hopefully, his sharing and the subsequent discussion here will prevent others from making the same mistakes!

The extremely poor training he received. If I get someone who resembles a younger version of myself, I'm going to describe in the best detail I can the consequences of not abiding by the fundamental principles of safe diving. While being young gives somewhat of a buffer against DCS, it does not making the walls of your lungs stronger, nor reduce RMV, etc..

I have a really low opinion of the average OW course today.

@Matt Spear. No touching of coral. Not for hunting. Okay?

 

[Esprise Me]

One of the first things I asked the instructor is if you should take a pony bottle with you. She said it's a "cop-out". It does seem un-necessary unless you're going to 120' or more.

Did you tell your instructor how deep you were going, and that you were diving solo?

 

[BlueTrin]

You need a better instructor, anytime you are diving solo you need redundant air supply.

The instructor obviously didn’t think the OP would be solo diving after his OW cert

(Mod edit)

 

[Joneill]

The extremely poor training he received. If I get someone who resembles a younger version of myself, I'm going to describe in the best detail I can the consequences of not abiding by the fundamental principles of safe diving. While being young gives somewhat of a buffer against DCS, it does not making the walls of your lungs stronger, nor reduce RMV, etc..

I have a really low opinion of the average OW course today.

There is blame there as well, I suspect. However, ultimately, we need to be personally accountable to educate ourselves on potentially dangerous activities that we plan on participating in.

It seems that personal accountability/ responsibility is largely out the window these days? It’s always someone else’s fault when things go wrong! Age should not matter - the buck ultimately stops with each individual person when it comes to their own safety.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

There is blame there as well, I suspect. However, ultimately, we need to be personally accountable to educate ourselves on potentially dangerous activities that we plan on participating in.

It seems that personal accountability/ responsibility is largely out the window these days? It’s always someone else’s fault when things go wrong! Age should not matter - the buck ultimately stops with each individual person when it comes to their own safety.

I think you are not understanding me. I'm looking at this from a system point of view. On one hand, training is incredibly poor these days. On the other, we have a young male in his 20's with the highest level of testosterone he will have for his entire life (unless he goes on the juice).

You don't expect him to take risks? Let's not focus on blame but rather look at the system where he thinks solo diving beyond his training, beyond his certification is a good idea and address that. This goes beyond him, but I'd rather focus on the system to address the young men like him who will follow.

 

[Esprise Me]

What do you think his instructor should have done to make him more cautious, and why do you assume s/he didn't try that?

 

[chillyinCanada]

What do you think his instructor should have done to make him more cautious, and why do you assume s/he didn't try that?

I assume that because he doesn't seem to know anything of the dangers or even simple things like why to not touch corals. Those things are all emphasized under good instruction. Matt thought 130' was his limit vs knowing that he'd only been trained to 60' and required more training/experience for deeper than that. He had no buddy on his first dive and didn't seem to understand why that might not have been a good idea, particularly to 100' with no pony and no experience. He didn't know about task loading. He doesn't seem to have known or absorbed the necessity for surface intervals and safety stops nor danger of freediving after a dive.

My OW was decades ago and I still remember the emphasis my instructor put on all of those things and more.

My concern is that our Matt wasn't really taught above the level of a resort course, if that much.

He thought his instructor was great. My interpretation is that she has a good personality. That's not the same thing as being a great instructor nor even a competent one. Even so, Matt must have done the materials and quizzes up front. He doesn't appear to have absorbed that info either and his instructor doesn't appear to have noticed that.

 

[AfterDark]

What do you think his instructor should have done to make him more cautious, and why do you assume s/he didn't try that?

I was 16 years old when I was certified. There was not then, nor is there now an instructor that could have done anything to make me more cautious. I was going to do whatever it was I was going to do regardless of what anyone told or showed me. I was told over and over again that without a wreck there was nothing to see at 100FSW around the NE area that couldn't be seen in more shallow water. That didn't stop me from seeing for myself the 1st chance I had, alone with a 72, Jvalve sans SPG, and BCD.

The only thing that stops me from doing stupid things these days is I've run out. Ultimately we learn to dive on our own and take our own chances. If the OP is anything like I was when young, well..... Just leave the coral alone while doing it.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

What do you think his instructor should have done to make him more cautious, and why do you assume s/he didn't try that?

I'd make them verbalize sincerely that they understood the risks, and if they refused, I wouldn't certify them as open water, only scuba diver. If I think they will disregard what I taught them, same. I think agencies should place more emphasis on certifications being earned and deserved (right attitude/respect), and be willing to deny certain people from being certified. There's the clause invented by NAUI on "would I want this person diving with a loved one of mine."

If I were to teach for an agency that wouldn't back me up (I know SDI would), I'd tell them to pound sand and switch agencies. And yes, I understand that I am eventually going to have some unhappy customers as a result and negative reviews on social media. But my conscience will continue to be clear and worry free.

 

[Joneill]

I think you are not understanding me. I'm looking at this from a system point of view. On one hand, training is incredibly poor these days. On the other, we have a young male in his 20's with the highest level of testosterone he will have for his entire life (unless he goes on the juice).

You don't expect him to take risks? Let's not focus on blame but rather look at the system where he thinks solo diving beyond his training, beyond his certification is a good idea and address that. This goes beyond him, but I'd rather focus on the system to address the young men like him who will follow.

I understand you - I just don’t agree with you. To me, testosterone levels don’t excuse one from taking personal responsibility.

I just got certified in 2015 and, while my class/pool dives were good, my OW referral dives were crap - basically, 1 skills dive and 3 where I essentially dove with the rest of the group on the boat with my instructor nearby. However, I educated myself in advance and read up and learned as much as I could.

One thing the PADI training hammered home was buddy diving - so not sure how a newly certified OW diver could ever get Solo was OK?