Canadian diver and buddy rescued near Apo Island, Philippines

[PygmySeahorse]

OK, so this is my question, as we are diving in Indonesia, usually in remote areas of the country. I'm not at all confident that there is ANYONE besides the local operator in some of these areas (Misool, for example). Maybe there is something approaching an official "coast guard" in Sorong, or in Labuan Bajo. That's not an argument against a PLB, but it is something I would like to know before buying one (and feeling like I can depend on it).

- Bill

You're right to be concerned. Authorities have limited boats and often no fuel, and I wouldn't rely on their phones working either (as for email addresses being monitored for NOAA alerts? Nuhuh.) There is a reason that dive boats helped evacuate the ferry that caught fire and that is that, even on wealthy Bali, authorities are hugely under-resourced. In remote areas, you need to trust your operator and pray to be picked up by a fishing boat. A PLB will just generate a false sense of security.

 

[Dan]

You're right to be concerned. Authorities have limited boats and often no fuel, and I wouldn't rely on their phones working either (as for email addresses being monitored for NOAA alerts? Nuhuh.) There is a reason that dive boats helped evacuate the ferry that caught fire and that is that, even on wealthy Bali, authorities are hugely under-resourced. In remote areas, you need to trust your operator and pray to be picked up by a fishing boat. A PLB will just generate a false sense of security.

OK, how about the following scenario, your emergency contact (X) gets a phone call from MCC (NOAA if you register your PLB in USA) then X looks at your contact list and see Misool Eco Resort (MER) contact number on your list. X calls MER & gives them your GPS location of the last PLB distress signal transmission. Would that work?

PS: Are you a pessimistic Bargibanti, Denise or Pontohi?

 

[Dan]

A very useful & informative post on PLB use in Indonesia by @IyaDiver:
Scuba diver's Personal Locator Beacon - how never to be lost at sea

 

[Dogbowl]

For the umpteenth time -This is how you "smartly" utilize a PLB as your last best chance of rescue: You supply all information about your itinerary, your nearest foreign mission Embassy/Consulate (i.g. US if US Citizen; Canada if Canadian etc), and cell phone contact numbers of the Dive Operation or Resort that you're locally diving with, and give this info to your designated Emergency Contact beforehand (a friend or relative who knows you're traveling & diving in some remote area of the world). The Rescue Coordination Center of the particular country that your PLB is registered in will call this Emergency Contact to verify that you are traveling abroad and that you may be potentially lost at sea upon receiving a bonafide emergency beacon activation of the PLB that uniquely identifies YOU.

The national SAR assets of the particular country you are visiting are then notified to go search for you, as well as the local Dive Ops/Resort (because you wisely gave their base cell phone operations call number beforehand to your Emergency Contact), given the GPS signal coordinates determined by the COSPAS/SARSAT System as it fixes on the location of your PLB's activation.

Does this make sense @Dogbowl ? Do you finally get this @billt4sf ? Do you now know & understand @Centrals ?

Thanks very much @Kevrumbo for lumping me in. I did not say I didn’t understand how a PLB “should” work. I understand it very well, thank you.

What you wrote above doesn’t change my opinion that I think in some countries, where there are scarce resources (i.e., no official rescue organization, no rescue boats or helicopters, local “rescue people” who don’t have money to pay for fuel), that a timely rescue may not result from the launch of a PLB, even if all of the steps you so kindly stated above have been completed.

There was another thread on PLBs, where the poster was looking to buy 5 Nautilus Lifelines with radios, for the very reason that he lived and dived in a country where a PLB would be “useless”, as he put it. There simply wasn’t any rescue organization there to rescue him. His best chance of rescue, should something go wrong, was a passing local boat, if any.

So, @Kevrumbo , please I do not need yet another explanation of how a PLB is “supposed” to work. I’ve read all the threads on this already. While I understand it is my last resort for a rescue, I do not kid myself that it is foolproof.

Having said all that, don’t get me wrong, I still strongly agree that one should have a PLB for diving. In fact, I will be buying a PLB shortly with canister, AND a Nautilus Lifeline with 2-way radio tomorrow (new old stock). I’m covering all my bases so to speak.

 

[Kevrumbo]

You're right to be concerned. Authorities have limited boats and often no fuel, and I wouldn't rely on their phones working either (as for email addresses being monitored for NOAA alerts? Nuhuh.) There is a reason that dive boats helped evacuate the ferry that caught fire and that is that, even on wealthy Bali, authorities are hugely under-resourced. In remote areas, you need to trust your operator and pray to be picked up by a fishing boat. A PLB will just generate a false sense of security.

Thanks very much @Kevrumbo for lumping me in. I did not say I didn’t understand how a PLB “should” work. I understand it very well, thank you.

What you wrote above doesn’t change my opinion that I think in some countries, where there are scarce resources (i.e., no official rescue organization, no rescue boats or helicopters, local “rescue people” who don’t have money to pay for fuel), that a timely rescue may not result from the launch of a PLB, even if all of the steps you so kindly stated above have been completed.

There was another thread on PLBs, where the poster was looking to buy 5 Nautilus Lifelines with radios, for the very reason that he lived and dived in a country where a PLB would be “useless”, as he put it. There simply wasn’t any rescue organization there to rescue him. His best chance of rescue, should something go wrong, was a passing local boat, if any.

So, @Kevrumbo , please I do not need yet another explanation of how a PLB is “supposed” to work. I’ve read all the threads on this already. While I understand it is my last resort for a rescue, I do not kid myself that it is foolproof.

Having said all that, don’t get me wrong, I still strongly agree that one should have a PLB for diving. In fact, I will be buying a PLB shortly with canister, AND a Nautilus Lifeline with 2-way radio tomorrow (new old stock). I’m covering all my bases so to speak.

Once again . . .first of all, how did you make contact with the Dive Operation or Resort to initially book and reserve the dates for your vacation holiday dive excursion ? Via website email and cellphone to make the reservation? Doesn't it make sense to provide your PLB's designated Emergency Contact with at the very least this cellphone call number for the Resort/Dive Operation you're using? Do you finally understand how your GPS coordinates can then be relayed to the dive operation boats searching for you -->even if they have no VHF marine radios (making a Nautilus Lifeline VHF beacon/2-way radio totally useless) and have to return to the Resort to receive the navigation info on your location?

If there is no organized national Search and Rescue (SAR) in the particular remote region of the foreign country that you are visiting, far away from the major shipping lanes -the PLB and COSPAS/SARSAT system can still work if you can at least provide your Emergency Contact a rudimentary business communication link via cellphone to the local dive operation that you're diving with.

The motivation is to find ways to increase your margin and chances of survival & discovery in a worst case lost at sea scenario . . .even with the rescue potential of local dive-op boats, national SAR services and PLB satellite assets being delayed.

@Dogbowl , @PygmySeahorse , even a delay of 9 hours worst case as above in the OP can be survivable -especially in tropical 80°F/27°C waters. (The WWII survivors of the torpedoed USS Indianapolis just barely endured four days at sea without any acknowledged report they were overdue or Naval Command's awareness of the sinking, before being luckily spotted by a routine air patrol and later rescued. . .). You want to smartly set things up with a PLB and good foresight beforehand as best as you can, so you won't ever have to go through such an ordeal. . .

Finally, here's another tip for you @Dogbowl , another resource that can aid in helping you abroad -register your trip with full itinerary and contacts to:
Registration of Canadians Abroad - Travel.gc.ca
(And when you finally purchase one, provide full information on your PLB as well).

 

[Kevrumbo]

There was another thread on PLBs, where the poster was looking to buy 5 Nautilus Lifelines with radios, for the very reason that he lived and dived in a country where a PLB would be “useless”, as he put it. There simply wasn’t any rescue organization there to rescue him. His best chance of rescue, should something go wrong, was a passing local boat, if any.

Here's that thread you're referring to and my rebuttal:

Hi Kevrumbo.

Maputo [Mozambique] or ANY decent SAR boats are 800km away from our dive sites… There is no way these people would help.

However, I can quickly send a dozen of boats, most of them equipped with a VHF. The lifeline’s distress button could help and shouldn’t be received by any other boat than our searching boat. But the two-ways VHF is definitely more convenient.

Due to the current here, all dive guides here use an SMB during the full dive. I guess my best option is to keep there a proper waterproof VHF with the housing Bred was talking about…

@Denis Sab , for local SAR with your Dive Operation Boats/RIB/Skiffs, a VHF Beacon System with Automatic Identification System/Digital Selective Calling that uniquely identifies your clients in a lost diver contingency is a viable option. Several Liveaboards worldwide utilize this system (Nautilus Lifeline) and provide them for their diving clients: see Undersea Hunter Cocos Island Costa Rica Dive Program - Safety

You may have clients like myself who also have their own private PLB as a last resort back-up in case the VHF Beacons dropout because of range limitations (Nautilus advertises 60km maximum, but realistically at best only 10 to 20km in high swell seas & rain conditions). This is how the PLB works with local dive operations in remote locations without national SAR coverage:

The PLB when activated uplinks to the COSPAS/SARSAT System as described above --if it was my PLB for example, my emergency contact would at least have information on your dive operation (Odyssea Dive Centre), your cellphone numbers and emergency contact numbers for the US Embassy in the Capital Maputo. In other words, the Rescue Coordination Center in the United States and/or the US Embassy in Maputo can still call your dive operation Odyssea DIve Centre in Vilanculos Town, and relay vital GPS coordinates to my location as determined by the satellite system.

 

[PygmySeahorse]

OK, how about the following scenario, your emergency contact (X) gets a phone call from MCC (NOAA if you register your PLB in USA) then X looks at your contact list and see Misool Eco Resort (MER) contact number on your list. X calls MER & gives them your GPS location of the last PLB distress signal transmission. Would that work?

PS: Are you a pessimistic Bargibanti, Denise or Pontohi?

I'm a Denise! And, yes, I think that would improve your chances - if the resort boats have GPS navigation. (I've not dived Misool, but most Indonesian boats I've been on navigate by local knowledge plus paper charts). You'd still be looking at a search restricted to the resort's available boats - forget fishing boats since for most you'd be lucky if someone had credit on their phone. You're also going to face search range restrictions.

 

[billt4sf]

Altogether that is very helpful. I like the idea that my GPS coords can be communicated to someone in the US that could then communicate them down the line, assuming that my designated person knows what to do and does it.

I personally think that the diveop in the area will be more responsive in most cases than the Indo national authority. Reading the wikipedia article does NOT inspire confidence, it seems like it was written by someone paying more attention to bureaucracy than anything but what do I know?

Getting my/our GPS coords to the local operator seems like a VERY useful thing to do! So back to Dan's suggested PLB system...

Thanks for the clarification and I'm sorry if I annoyed anyone.

- Bill

 

[billt4sf]

I'm a Denise! And, yes, I think that would improve your chances - if the resort boats have GPS navigation. (I've not dived Misool, but most Indonesian boats I've been on navigate by local knowledge plus paper charts). You'd still be looking at a search restricted to the resort's available boats - forget fishing boats since for most you'd be lucky if someone had credit on their phone. You're also going to face search range restrictions.

I'm 99% sure that the boats (or at least the resorts) where we go have the ability to navigate by GPS: Misool Eco Resort, Mermaid, Sorido Bay, Geko Dive --- is where we have been so far. I feel very confident that they would be working VERY hard and very competently on our behalf, and getting them the GPS coords could only help.

You make some excellent points.

- Bill

 

[PygmySeahorse]

I'm 99% sure that the boats (or at least the resorts) where we go have the ability to navigate by GPS: Misool Eco Resort, Mermaid, Sorido Bay, Geko Dive --- is where we have been so far. I feel very confident that they would be working VERY hard and very competently on our behalf, and getting them the GPS coords could only help.

You make some excellent points.

- Bill

Well, look forward to catching up in person, inshallah. For the record, I would be surprised if Geko Dive - the Padangbai op, right? - did have GPS, just because they're always covering the same relatively small range and distance, and it's an area with a lot of boat traffic. The Raja Ampat ones might well do: have you seen them using GPS to navigate?

Anywise, hopefully one of the many Indonesia-based dive pros will chime in....